In California, Restoring Our Relationship With Fire Is Possible
If fire — and all that comes in its wake — is an inevitable aspect of life in our state, how do we live with it? And how could we begin to change our relationship to fire?
A fire truck drives through smoky haze from the Caldor Fire on Highway 50 near Pollock Pines and Strawberry Campground on Tues., Aug. 31, 2021. (Beth LaBerge/KQED)
Devastating. Catastrophic. Deadly.
These words are often used to describe wildfires in our state. As we’ve seen in the last five years, wildfires and the toxic smoke that comes with them have impacted all Californians.
Whether it’s grabbing an N95 mask on smoky days, preparing an emergency go bag, or evacuating your home as a fire encroaches upon your town, communities across the state are now dealing with more aggressive fire seasons. But if fire — and all that comes in its wake — is an inevitable aspect of life here, how do we live with it? And could we change our relationship to fire?
KQED Science’s Danielle Venton has reported on fire and our changing climate for six years. She’s witnessed firsthand how we’ve come to think and talk about the role major fire phenomena have on our lives. Shifting our conversations, and even the metrics for measuring a fire’s impact, could help us craft multipronged solutions. She spoke with Devin Katayama of The Bay to discuss why the dominant fire narrative must change.
“We need to do some big rethinking about the state’s relationship with fires,” Venton said. “We might talk about being at war with fire, or we saw big dramatic headlines like ‘The West Is Burning,’ and that really indicates to me that we haven’t gotten over the idea that all fire is bad and that Western forests are not supposed to burn.”
As fires have grown more destructive, engulfing entire towns and displacing thousands of Californians, scientists and ecologists are placing renewed attention on prescribed burns, a centuries-old practice that Indigenous tribes like the Klamath’s Karuk used for stewarding their land. The practice involves setting controlled fires, or “good fire,” to burn through dry debris in the understory of forests, which, if left dry and unmanaged, becomes the perfect fuel for a blaze.
Not all fires are bad. But fire coverage and reporting often frame an incident as a disaster that must be contained, redirected or stopped. Californians are often used to understanding the magnitude of a developing disaster by dividing the incident into digestible pieces, like how many acres it’s burned, or how contained it is.
But Venton says that fire’s impact can’t just be measured by acres and area contained. “If the fire is burning in a healthy way, in a place where it’s doing ecological good, a fire could be 15% contained. And that doesn’t tell you that it’s catastrophic necessarily,” she said.
Instead, she argues that we should reassess and reprioritize metrics for measuring a fire’s impact. “How many people are being evacuated? Is it threatening towns?” she said.
“Is it burning in a way that is out of control and … how many firefighters are involved in the firefight? When did they last have a break?”
A burned structure off Highway 50 near Phillips, California, on Tuesday, Aug. 31, 2021, after the Caldor Fire spread through the area that Monday evening. Until recently, federal firefighters — also known as “forestry technicians” — were paid about $13 an hour. A new plan under President Biden would increase that amount to $15 an hour. (Beth LaBerge/KQED)
Who really fights fires?
Calling people heroes is not productive, Venton said. Instead, she urges us to think about who is doing this work and how they’re compensated.
Until recently, federal firefighters — also known as “forestry technicians” — were paid about $13 an hour. A new plan under President Biden would increase that amount to $15 an hour, but “most of the livable wage comes from overtime, meaning that people rely on it, meaning that they feel like it’s never OK to say no to an assignment,” she said.
But that doesn’t include the work of incarcerated firefighters who fight California’s blazes. Incarcerated firefighters are paid $2 to $5 per day, and they get an extra dollar per hour when they’re actively working at a fire.
The work itself is brutal, and many firefighters are working long hours in dangerous situations while disconnected from their families.
“I would much rather they be fairly paid and fairly treated professionals,” Venton said.
A second change she recommends is to treat the work of fire prevention with the same attention and value as fighting existing blazes.
“The hero narrative feeds into this thing I see in our culture that I don’t like,” she explained. “We value coming to the rescue more than preventing problems in the first place.”
How can you create community-based solutions?
“Fires are a human-caused problem, and that means that humans can be part of the solution,” Venton said.
In the Fresno County town of Shaver Lake, bordered in part by land owned by Southern California Edison, communities spent decades putting in fire breaks and setting prescribed burns.
In the end, regarded as heroes were the firefighters, rather than the foresters and land managers who spent a decade building fuel breaks and lighting “good fires” as part of their mitigation strategy.
“People who extinguish flames are called heroes. People who trim brush and light prescribed fires aren’t thought of that way,” Venton said earlier this year.
But Venton also points out that wildfires are a multifaceted and constantly evolving problem. One solution does not fit all. The solutions themselves are constantly evolving as well.
In her reporting, she says attention often falls on where mitigation attempts to prevent catastrophic fires have failed. “Of course, some fires are not going to respond to a firebreak,” she explained. “That doesn’t mean it’s not worth it.”
She points to an analogy of seatbelts.
In the 1950s, cars were incredibly dangerous and accidents could result in serious injury or death. But after iterations of new safety strategies, cars are now manufactured to include seatbelts, “crumple zones,” and airbags. That shift came about after years of experimenting and testing multiple solutions. The same goes for future wildfire prevention, which could involve variations of mitigation strategies.
If not all fires are bad, what about wildfire smoke?
“Wildfire smoke is likely the No. 1 way Californians will feel the effects of fires and really the effects of climate change,” Venton said. “Smoke is really its own natural disaster.”
The 2018 Camp Fire in Butte County nearly obliterated the town of Paradise, killing 106 people and displacing thousands. On top of that devastation, researchers estimated that the smoke of that fire killed an additional 3,600 people.
“That’s 30 times more than a heart attack or respiratory illness,” Venton added.
But Venton says a major solution to mitigating hazardous levels of wildfire smoke would involve dramatically scaling up the amount of controlled and prescribed fire.
“A little bit of smoke we should not worry about,” she explained. “It’s the really heavy, toxic smoke when homes and cars [burn] — and that’s the really bad smoke.”
Venton urges us to reconsider the notion that blue skies mean ecological balance.
Bill Tripp, a member of the Karuk Tribe and an advocate for a return to prescribed burns, told Venton that California’s skies have always been hazy.
“The historical records show that the forest looked like a well-pruned orchard with a constant haze of smoke in the air,” he said. “That haze, constant haze is part of that natural background. And that’s what people don’t understand.”
But identifying ways to protect people from the hazardous smoke emitted from megafires is a necessary part of our fire conversation now. Researchers and journalists are just now measuring the full impacts smoke has on communities. For her part, Venton urges that questions like how to access affordable air purifiers and reliable information on air quality be part of these conversations.
How can we live with fire?
Preparing An Emergency Bag
“I want us to have a better relationship with fire in this state so that this state continues to be habitable and a wonderful place to live,” Venton said.
“Our ecosystems would be healthier, our lungs would be healthier. Our communities would not have to live in so much fear.”
While she admits California has a long way to go, she believes that a future with a restored relationship with fire is possible. It requires investment and a conversation toward solutions.
“If I can do anything to try to help the conversation towards those
solutions, that’s what I want to do,” she said.
Follow The Bay to hear more local Bay Area stories like this one. New episodes are released Monday, Wednesday and Friday at 3 a.m. Find The Bay on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, and NPR One or via Alexa.
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"content": "\u003cp>Devastating. Catastrophic. Deadly.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>These words are often used to describe wildfires in our state. As we’ve seen in the last five years, wildfires and the toxic smoke that comes with them have impacted all Californians.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Whether it’s \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11834305/masks-for-smoke-and-covid-19-what-kind-is-best\">grabbing an N95 mask on smoky days\u003c/a>, \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11833686/what-to-pack-in-your-emergency-bag-with-covid-19-in-mind\">preparing an emergency go bag\u003c/a>, or \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11834901/fire-evacuation-what-actually-happens-and-how-can-you-plan\">evacuating your home\u003c/a> as a fire encroaches upon your town, communities across the state are now dealing with more aggressive fire seasons. But if fire — and all that comes in its wake — is an inevitable aspect of life here, how do we live \u003cem>with\u003c/em> it? And could we change our relationship to fire?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/author/dventon\">KQED Science’s Danielle Venton\u003c/a> has reported on fire and our changing climate for six years. She’s witnessed firsthand how we’ve come to think and talk about the role major fire phenomena have on our lives. Shifting our conversations, and even the metrics for measuring a fire’s impact, could help us craft multipronged solutions. \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11885698/how-to-think-about-fire-in-a-different-way\">She spoke with Devin Katayama of The Bay\u003c/a> to discuss why the dominant fire narrative must change.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe loading=\"lazy\" frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm?e=KQINC3762305706&light=true\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>\u003ca href=\"https://bit.ly/3AZNKFy\">Read the episode transcript.\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch3>Why are California’s wildfires so destructive now?\u003c/h3>\n\u003cp>[aside label ='Prepare for a Possible Evacuation' tag='prepare-evacuation']In 2021, \u003ca href=\"https://www.facebook.com/CALFIRE/posts/10159468556157390\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">fires \u003c/a>\u003ca href=\"https://www.facebook.com/CALFIRE/posts/10159468556157390\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">already\u003c/a>\u003ca href=\"https://www.facebook.com/CALFIRE/posts/10159468556157390\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\"> have burned through more acres than during last year’s record-breaking season\u003c/a> compared to this time last year.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“For the first maybe two or three years, it kind of felt like a fluke,” Venton said. “[Now] it feels inevitable.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>A century of fire suppression, \u003ca href=\"https://www.capradio.org/articles/2020/09/16/the-racist-removal-of-native-americans-in-california-is-often-missing-from-wildfire-discussions-experts-say/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">the forced removal of California’s Indigenous people\u003c/a> from their land, and \u003ca href=\"https://www.summitdaily.com/news/playing-with-fire-how-a-history-of-mining-suppression-and-climate-change-has-fueled-a-new-generation-of-wildfires/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">extractive industries\u003c/a> combined with \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1962273/megadrought-conditions-not-seen-for-400-years-have-returned-to-the-west-scientists-say\">climate change-fueled megadroughts\u003c/a> have produced a uniquely combustible scenario that makes fires in the West more unpredictable than in previous decades.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“We need to do some big rethinking about the state’s relationship with fires,” Venton said. “We might talk about being at war with fire, or we saw big dramatic headlines like ‘The West Is Burning,’ and that really indicates to me that we haven’t gotten over the idea that all fire is bad and that Western forests are not supposed to burn.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>As fires have grown more destructive, engulfing entire towns and \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11873396/i-cant-abandon-this-community-months-after-czu-fires-survivors-struggle-to-rebuild\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">displacing thousands of Californians\u003c/a>, scientists and ecologists are placing renewed attention on \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1973196/the-karuk-used-fire-to-manage-the-forest-for-centuries-now-they-want-to-do-that-again\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">prescribed burns, a centuries-old practice\u003c/a> that Indigenous tribes like the Klamath’s Karuk used for stewarding their land. The practice involves setting controlled fires, or “good fire,” to burn through dry debris in the understory of forests, which, if left dry and unmanaged, becomes the perfect fuel for a blaze.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote class=\"tiktok-embed\" style=\"max-width: 605px;min-width: 325px\" cite=\"https://www.tiktok.com/@kqedofficial/video/6997511512524901638\" data-video-id=\"6997511512524901638\">\n\u003csection>\u003ca title=\"@kqedofficial\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/@kqedofficial\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">@kqedofficial\u003c/a>We break down how CA’s fire season got so bad. \u003ca title=\"california\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/tag/california\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">##california\u003c/a> \u003ca title=\"californiafire\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/tag/californiafire\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">##californiafire\u003c/a> \u003ca title=\"wildfire2021\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/tag/wildfire2021\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">##wildfire2021\u003c/a> \u003ca title=\"dixiefire\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/tag/dixiefire\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">##dixiefire\u003c/a> \u003ca title=\"climatechange\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/tag/climatechange\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">##climatechange\u003c/a> \u003ca title=\"droughtlife\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/tag/droughtlife\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">##droughtlife\u003c/a> \u003ca title=\"localnews\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/tag/localnews\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">##localnews\u003c/a> \u003ca title=\"firetok\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/tag/firetok\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">##firetok\u003c/a>\u003ca title=\"♬ original sound - kqed\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/music/original-sound-6997511357541190406\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">♬ original sound – kqed\u003c/a>\u003c/section>\n\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>[tiktok]\u003c/p>\n\u003ch3>How do you measure the impact of fire?\u003c/h3>\n\u003cp>Not all fires are bad. But fire coverage and reporting often frame an incident as a disaster that must be contained, redirected or stopped. Californians are often used to understanding the magnitude of a developing disaster by dividing the incident into digestible pieces, like how many acres it’s burned, or how contained it is.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But Venton says that fire’s impact can’t just be measured by acres and area contained. “If the fire is burning in a healthy way, in a place where it’s doing ecological good, a fire could be 15% contained. And that doesn’t tell you that it’s catastrophic necessarily,” she said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Instead, she argues that we should reassess and reprioritize metrics for measuring a fire’s impact. “How many people are being evacuated? Is it threatening towns?” she said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Is it burning in a way that is out of control and … how many firefighters are involved in the firefight? When did they last have a break?”\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11887361\" class=\"wp-caption alignnone\" style=\"max-width: 1920px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"wp-image-11887361 size-full\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/10/2021/09/071_CaldorFire_08312021.jpg\" alt=\"Ash remains of a structure and a stone fireplace surrounded by dozens of charred trees.\" width=\"1920\" height=\"1280\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2021/09/071_CaldorFire_08312021.jpg 1920w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2021/09/071_CaldorFire_08312021-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2021/09/071_CaldorFire_08312021-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2021/09/071_CaldorFire_08312021-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2021/09/071_CaldorFire_08312021-1536x1024.jpg 1536w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 1920px) 100vw, 1920px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">A burned structure off Highway 50 near Phillips, California, on Tuesday, Aug. 31, 2021, after the Caldor Fire spread through the area that Monday evening. Until recently, federal firefighters — also known as “forestry technicians” — were paid about $13 an hour. A new plan under President Biden would increase that amount to $15 an hour. \u003ccite>(Beth LaBerge/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003ch3>Who really fights fires?\u003c/h3>\n\u003cp>Calling people heroes is not productive, Venton said. Instead, she urges us to think about who is doing this work and how they’re compensated.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Until recently, federal firefighters — also known as “forestry technicians” — were paid about $13 an hour. \u003ca href=\"https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/watch-live-biden-expected-to-announce-pay-raises-for-federal-firefighters\">A new plan under President Biden would increase that amount to $15 an hour\u003c/a>, but “most of the livable wage comes from overtime, meaning that people rely on it, meaning that they feel like it’s never OK to say no to an assignment,” she said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But that doesn’t include the work of incarcerated firefighters who fight California’s blazes. \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11846622/whats-next-for-incarcerated-firefighters-in-california\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Incarcerated firefighters are paid $2 to $5 per day\u003c/a>, and they get an extra dollar per hour when they’re actively working at a fire.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The work itself is brutal, and many firefighters are working long hours in dangerous situations while disconnected from their families.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I would much rather they be fairly paid and fairly treated professionals,” Venton said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>A second change she recommends is to treat the work of fire prevention with the same attention and value as fighting existing blazes.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The hero narrative feeds into this thing I see in our culture that I don’t like,” she explained. “We value coming to the rescue more than preventing problems in the first place.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[pullquote size='large' align='right' citation='Danielle Venton, KQED Science Reporter']‘We value coming to the rescue more than preventing problems in the first place.’[/pullquote]\u003c/p>\n\u003ch3>How can you create community-based solutions?\u003c/h3>\n\u003cp>“Fires are a human-caused problem, and that means that humans can be part of the solution,” Venton said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp style=\"text-align: left\">Through her reporting, Venton has met \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1973138/how-a-small-forest-community-saved-itself-from-fire\">neighbors who are taking fire prevention into their own hands\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In the Fresno County town of Shaver Lake, bordered in part by land owned by Southern California Edison, communities spent decades putting in fire breaks and setting prescribed burns.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>While this approach might seem long and fairly unglamorous, \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1973159/how-to-save-a-california-town-from-wildfire-plentyy-of-advance-work-and-agency-cooperation\">their mitigation efforts helped interrupt the spread of the 2020 Creek Fire\u003c/a>, which ultimately saved their town from devastation.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In the end, regarded as heroes were the firefighters, rather than the foresters and land managers who spent a decade building fuel breaks and lighting “good fires” as part of their mitigation strategy.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“People who extinguish flames are called heroes. People who trim brush and light prescribed fires aren’t thought of that way,” Venton said earlier this year.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignright\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/35/2021/05/KQEDSCIENCE_CRKFR-1.gif\" alt=\"A gif shows how fuel breaks interrupted fire paths in the 2020 Creek Fire. The area with a previous prescribed burn is also indicated near the origin of the Creek Fire. Text reads: Forest treatments and fuel breaks helped interrupt the spread of the Creek Fire in the Shaver Lake area, Sept. 2020. \" width=\"400\" height=\"709\">\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But Venton also points out that wildfires are a multifaceted and constantly evolving problem. One solution does not fit all. The solutions themselves are constantly evolving as well.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In her reporting, she says attention often falls on where mitigation attempts to prevent catastrophic fires have failed. “Of course, some fires are not going to respond to a firebreak,” she explained. “That doesn’t mean it’s not worth it.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>She points to an analogy of seatbelts.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In the 1950s, cars were incredibly dangerous and accidents could result in serious injury or death. But after iterations of new safety strategies, cars are now manufactured to include seatbelts, “crumple zones,” and airbags. That shift came about after years of experimenting and testing multiple solutions. The same goes for future wildfire prevention, which could involve variations of mitigation strategies.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch3>If not all fires are bad, what about wildfire smoke?\u003c/h3>\n\u003cp>“Wildfire smoke is likely the No. 1 way Californians will feel the effects of fires and really the effects of climate change,” Venton said. “Smoke is really its own natural disaster.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The 2018 Camp Fire in Butte County nearly obliterated the town of Paradise, killing 106 people and displacing thousands. On top of that devastation, researchers estimated that \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1971666/california-wildfires-killed-106-people-two-years-ago-researchers-say-the-smoke-killed-3652\">the smoke of that fire killed an additional 3,600 people\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“That’s 30 times more than a heart attack or respiratory illness,” Venton added.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But Venton says a major solution to mitigating hazardous levels of wildfire smoke would involve dramatically scaling up the amount of controlled and prescribed fire.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“A little bit of smoke we should not worry about,” she explained. “It’s the really heavy, toxic smoke when homes and cars [burn] — and that’s the really bad smoke.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Venton urges us to reconsider the notion that blue skies mean ecological balance.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bill Tripp, a member of the Karuk Tribe and an advocate for \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1976240/californias-forests-are-at-a-turning-point-why-arent-we-committing-to-good-fire\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">a return to prescribed burns\u003c/a>, told Venton that California’s skies have always been hazy.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The historical records show that the forest looked like a well-pruned orchard with a constant haze of smoke in the air,” he said. “That haze, constant haze is part of that natural background. And that’s what people don’t understand.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But identifying ways to protect people from the hazardous smoke emitted from megafires is a necessary part of our fire conversation now. Researchers and journalists are just now measuring the full impacts smoke has on communities. For her part, Venton urges that questions like \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1976551/how-to-get-or-make-a-free-low-cost-air-purifier-for-your-home\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">how to access affordable air purifiers\u003c/a> and \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1969271/making-sense-of-purple-air-vs-airnow-and-a-new-map-to-rule-them-all\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">reliable information on air quality\u003c/a> be part of these conversations.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch3>How can we live \u003cem>with\u003c/em> fire?\u003c/h3>\n\u003cp>[aside label ='Preparing An Emergency Bag' tag='emergency-bag']“I want us to have a better relationship with fire in this state so that this state continues to be habitable and a wonderful place to live,” Venton said\u003cstrong>.\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Our ecosystems would be healthier, our lungs would be healthier. Our communities would not have to live in so much fear.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>While she admits California has a long way to go, she believes that a future with a restored relationship with fire is possible. It requires investment and a conversation toward solutions.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“If I can do anything to try to help the conversation towards those\u003cbr>\nsolutions, that’s what I want to do,” she said.\u003c/p>\n\u003chr>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>This episode was edited and mixed by \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/realchrisjbeale\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Christopher Beale\u003c/a> and \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/author/amontecillo\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Alan Montecillo\u003c/a> and hosted by \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/author/dkatayama\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Devin Katayama\u003c/a>. \u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>Follow \u003c/em>\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/tag/the-bay\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\u003cem>The Bay\u003c/em>\u003c/a>\u003cem> to hear more local Bay Area stories like this one. New episodes are released Monday, Wednesday and Friday at 3 a.m. Find The Bay on \u003c/em>\u003ca href=\"https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-bay/id1350043452?mt=2\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\u003cem>Apple Podcasts\u003c/em>\u003c/a>\u003cem>, \u003c/em>\u003ca href=\"https://open.spotify.com/show/4BIKBKIujizLHlIlBNaAqQ\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\u003cem>Spotify\u003c/em>\u003c/a>\u003cem>, \u003c/em>\u003ca href=\"https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/kqed/the-bay\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\u003cem>Stitcher\u003c/em>\u003c/a>\u003cem>, and NPR One or via \u003c/em>\u003ca href=\"https://www.amazon.com/KQED-The-Bay-Flash-Briefing/dp/B07H6YYV23\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\u003cem>Alexa\u003c/em>\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad floatright]\u003c/p>\n",
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"content": "\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>Devastating. Catastrophic. Deadly.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>These words are often used to describe wildfires in our state. As we’ve seen in the last five years, wildfires and the toxic smoke that comes with them have impacted all Californians.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Whether it’s \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11834305/masks-for-smoke-and-covid-19-what-kind-is-best\">grabbing an N95 mask on smoky days\u003c/a>, \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11833686/what-to-pack-in-your-emergency-bag-with-covid-19-in-mind\">preparing an emergency go bag\u003c/a>, or \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11834901/fire-evacuation-what-actually-happens-and-how-can-you-plan\">evacuating your home\u003c/a> as a fire encroaches upon your town, communities across the state are now dealing with more aggressive fire seasons. But if fire — and all that comes in its wake — is an inevitable aspect of life here, how do we live \u003cem>with\u003c/em> it? And could we change our relationship to fire?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/author/dventon\">KQED Science’s Danielle Venton\u003c/a> has reported on fire and our changing climate for six years. She’s witnessed firsthand how we’ve come to think and talk about the role major fire phenomena have on our lives. Shifting our conversations, and even the metrics for measuring a fire’s impact, could help us craft multipronged solutions. \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11885698/how-to-think-about-fire-in-a-different-way\">She spoke with Devin Katayama of The Bay\u003c/a> to discuss why the dominant fire narrative must change.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe loading=\"lazy\" frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm?e=KQINC3762305706&light=true\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>\u003ca href=\"https://bit.ly/3AZNKFy\">Read the episode transcript.\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch3>Why are California’s wildfires so destructive now?\u003c/h3>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>",
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"content": "\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>In 2021, \u003ca href=\"https://www.facebook.com/CALFIRE/posts/10159468556157390\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">fires \u003c/a>\u003ca href=\"https://www.facebook.com/CALFIRE/posts/10159468556157390\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">already\u003c/a>\u003ca href=\"https://www.facebook.com/CALFIRE/posts/10159468556157390\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\"> have burned through more acres than during last year’s record-breaking season\u003c/a> compared to this time last year.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“For the first maybe two or three years, it kind of felt like a fluke,” Venton said. “[Now] it feels inevitable.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>A century of fire suppression, \u003ca href=\"https://www.capradio.org/articles/2020/09/16/the-racist-removal-of-native-americans-in-california-is-often-missing-from-wildfire-discussions-experts-say/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">the forced removal of California’s Indigenous people\u003c/a> from their land, and \u003ca href=\"https://www.summitdaily.com/news/playing-with-fire-how-a-history-of-mining-suppression-and-climate-change-has-fueled-a-new-generation-of-wildfires/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">extractive industries\u003c/a> combined with \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1962273/megadrought-conditions-not-seen-for-400-years-have-returned-to-the-west-scientists-say\">climate change-fueled megadroughts\u003c/a> have produced a uniquely combustible scenario that makes fires in the West more unpredictable than in previous decades.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“We need to do some big rethinking about the state’s relationship with fires,” Venton said. “We might talk about being at war with fire, or we saw big dramatic headlines like ‘The West Is Burning,’ and that really indicates to me that we haven’t gotten over the idea that all fire is bad and that Western forests are not supposed to burn.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>As fires have grown more destructive, engulfing entire towns and \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11873396/i-cant-abandon-this-community-months-after-czu-fires-survivors-struggle-to-rebuild\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">displacing thousands of Californians\u003c/a>, scientists and ecologists are placing renewed attention on \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1973196/the-karuk-used-fire-to-manage-the-forest-for-centuries-now-they-want-to-do-that-again\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">prescribed burns, a centuries-old practice\u003c/a> that Indigenous tribes like the Klamath’s Karuk used for stewarding their land. The practice involves setting controlled fires, or “good fire,” to burn through dry debris in the understory of forests, which, if left dry and unmanaged, becomes the perfect fuel for a blaze.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote class=\"tiktok-embed\" style=\"max-width: 605px;min-width: 325px\" cite=\"https://www.tiktok.com/@kqedofficial/video/6997511512524901638\" data-video-id=\"6997511512524901638\">\n\u003csection>\u003ca title=\"@kqedofficial\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/@kqedofficial\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">@kqedofficial\u003c/a>We break down how CA’s fire season got so bad. \u003ca title=\"california\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/tag/california\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">##california\u003c/a> \u003ca title=\"californiafire\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/tag/californiafire\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">##californiafire\u003c/a> \u003ca title=\"wildfire2021\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/tag/wildfire2021\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">##wildfire2021\u003c/a> \u003ca title=\"dixiefire\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/tag/dixiefire\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">##dixiefire\u003c/a> \u003ca title=\"climatechange\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/tag/climatechange\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">##climatechange\u003c/a> \u003ca title=\"droughtlife\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/tag/droughtlife\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">##droughtlife\u003c/a> \u003ca title=\"localnews\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/tag/localnews\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">##localnews\u003c/a> \u003ca title=\"firetok\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/tag/firetok\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">##firetok\u003c/a>\u003ca title=\"♬ original sound - kqed\" href=\"https://www.tiktok.com/music/original-sound-6997511357541190406\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">♬ original sound – kqed\u003c/a>\u003c/section>\n\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>",
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"content": "\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch3>How do you measure the impact of fire?\u003c/h3>\n\u003cp>Not all fires are bad. But fire coverage and reporting often frame an incident as a disaster that must be contained, redirected or stopped. Californians are often used to understanding the magnitude of a developing disaster by dividing the incident into digestible pieces, like how many acres it’s burned, or how contained it is.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But Venton says that fire’s impact can’t just be measured by acres and area contained. “If the fire is burning in a healthy way, in a place where it’s doing ecological good, a fire could be 15% contained. And that doesn’t tell you that it’s catastrophic necessarily,” she said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Instead, she argues that we should reassess and reprioritize metrics for measuring a fire’s impact. “How many people are being evacuated? Is it threatening towns?” she said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Is it burning in a way that is out of control and … how many firefighters are involved in the firefight? When did they last have a break?”\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11887361\" class=\"wp-caption alignnone\" style=\"max-width: 1920px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"wp-image-11887361 size-full\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/10/2021/09/071_CaldorFire_08312021.jpg\" alt=\"Ash remains of a structure and a stone fireplace surrounded by dozens of charred trees.\" width=\"1920\" height=\"1280\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2021/09/071_CaldorFire_08312021.jpg 1920w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2021/09/071_CaldorFire_08312021-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2021/09/071_CaldorFire_08312021-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2021/09/071_CaldorFire_08312021-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2021/09/071_CaldorFire_08312021-1536x1024.jpg 1536w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 1920px) 100vw, 1920px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">A burned structure off Highway 50 near Phillips, California, on Tuesday, Aug. 31, 2021, after the Caldor Fire spread through the area that Monday evening. Until recently, federal firefighters — also known as “forestry technicians” — were paid about $13 an hour. A new plan under President Biden would increase that amount to $15 an hour. \u003ccite>(Beth LaBerge/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003ch3>Who really fights fires?\u003c/h3>\n\u003cp>Calling people heroes is not productive, Venton said. Instead, she urges us to think about who is doing this work and how they’re compensated.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Until recently, federal firefighters — also known as “forestry technicians” — were paid about $13 an hour. \u003ca href=\"https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/watch-live-biden-expected-to-announce-pay-raises-for-federal-firefighters\">A new plan under President Biden would increase that amount to $15 an hour\u003c/a>, but “most of the livable wage comes from overtime, meaning that people rely on it, meaning that they feel like it’s never OK to say no to an assignment,” she said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But that doesn’t include the work of incarcerated firefighters who fight California’s blazes. \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11846622/whats-next-for-incarcerated-firefighters-in-california\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Incarcerated firefighters are paid $2 to $5 per day\u003c/a>, and they get an extra dollar per hour when they’re actively working at a fire.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The work itself is brutal, and many firefighters are working long hours in dangerous situations while disconnected from their families.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I would much rather they be fairly paid and fairly treated professionals,” Venton said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>A second change she recommends is to treat the work of fire prevention with the same attention and value as fighting existing blazes.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The hero narrative feeds into this thing I see in our culture that I don’t like,” she explained. “We value coming to the rescue more than preventing problems in the first place.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>",
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"content": "\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch3>How can you create community-based solutions?\u003c/h3>\n\u003cp>“Fires are a human-caused problem, and that means that humans can be part of the solution,” Venton said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp style=\"text-align: left\">Through her reporting, Venton has met \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1973138/how-a-small-forest-community-saved-itself-from-fire\">neighbors who are taking fire prevention into their own hands\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In the Fresno County town of Shaver Lake, bordered in part by land owned by Southern California Edison, communities spent decades putting in fire breaks and setting prescribed burns.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>While this approach might seem long and fairly unglamorous, \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1973159/how-to-save-a-california-town-from-wildfire-plentyy-of-advance-work-and-agency-cooperation\">their mitigation efforts helped interrupt the spread of the 2020 Creek Fire\u003c/a>, which ultimately saved their town from devastation.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In the end, regarded as heroes were the firefighters, rather than the foresters and land managers who spent a decade building fuel breaks and lighting “good fires” as part of their mitigation strategy.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“People who extinguish flames are called heroes. People who trim brush and light prescribed fires aren’t thought of that way,” Venton said earlier this year.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignright\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/35/2021/05/KQEDSCIENCE_CRKFR-1.gif\" alt=\"A gif shows how fuel breaks interrupted fire paths in the 2020 Creek Fire. The area with a previous prescribed burn is also indicated near the origin of the Creek Fire. Text reads: Forest treatments and fuel breaks helped interrupt the spread of the Creek Fire in the Shaver Lake area, Sept. 2020. \" width=\"400\" height=\"709\">\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But Venton also points out that wildfires are a multifaceted and constantly evolving problem. One solution does not fit all. The solutions themselves are constantly evolving as well.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In her reporting, she says attention often falls on where mitigation attempts to prevent catastrophic fires have failed. “Of course, some fires are not going to respond to a firebreak,” she explained. “That doesn’t mean it’s not worth it.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>She points to an analogy of seatbelts.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In the 1950s, cars were incredibly dangerous and accidents could result in serious injury or death. But after iterations of new safety strategies, cars are now manufactured to include seatbelts, “crumple zones,” and airbags. That shift came about after years of experimenting and testing multiple solutions. The same goes for future wildfire prevention, which could involve variations of mitigation strategies.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch3>If not all fires are bad, what about wildfire smoke?\u003c/h3>\n\u003cp>“Wildfire smoke is likely the No. 1 way Californians will feel the effects of fires and really the effects of climate change,” Venton said. “Smoke is really its own natural disaster.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The 2018 Camp Fire in Butte County nearly obliterated the town of Paradise, killing 106 people and displacing thousands. On top of that devastation, researchers estimated that \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1971666/california-wildfires-killed-106-people-two-years-ago-researchers-say-the-smoke-killed-3652\">the smoke of that fire killed an additional 3,600 people\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“That’s 30 times more than a heart attack or respiratory illness,” Venton added.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But Venton says a major solution to mitigating hazardous levels of wildfire smoke would involve dramatically scaling up the amount of controlled and prescribed fire.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“A little bit of smoke we should not worry about,” she explained. “It’s the really heavy, toxic smoke when homes and cars [burn] — and that’s the really bad smoke.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Venton urges us to reconsider the notion that blue skies mean ecological balance.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bill Tripp, a member of the Karuk Tribe and an advocate for \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1976240/californias-forests-are-at-a-turning-point-why-arent-we-committing-to-good-fire\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">a return to prescribed burns\u003c/a>, told Venton that California’s skies have always been hazy.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The historical records show that the forest looked like a well-pruned orchard with a constant haze of smoke in the air,” he said. “That haze, constant haze is part of that natural background. And that’s what people don’t understand.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But identifying ways to protect people from the hazardous smoke emitted from megafires is a necessary part of our fire conversation now. Researchers and journalists are just now measuring the full impacts smoke has on communities. For her part, Venton urges that questions like \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1976551/how-to-get-or-make-a-free-low-cost-air-purifier-for-your-home\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">how to access affordable air purifiers\u003c/a> and \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1969271/making-sense-of-purple-air-vs-airnow-and-a-new-map-to-rule-them-all\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">reliable information on air quality\u003c/a> be part of these conversations.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch3>How can we live \u003cem>with\u003c/em> fire?\u003c/h3>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>",
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"content": "\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>“I want us to have a better relationship with fire in this state so that this state continues to be habitable and a wonderful place to live,” Venton said\u003cstrong>.\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Our ecosystems would be healthier, our lungs would be healthier. Our communities would not have to live in so much fear.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>While she admits California has a long way to go, she believes that a future with a restored relationship with fire is possible. It requires investment and a conversation toward solutions.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“If I can do anything to try to help the conversation towards those\u003cbr>\nsolutions, that’s what I want to do,” she said.\u003c/p>\n\u003chr>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>This episode was edited and mixed by \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/realchrisjbeale\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Christopher Beale\u003c/a> and \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/author/amontecillo\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Alan Montecillo\u003c/a> and hosted by \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/author/dkatayama\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Devin Katayama\u003c/a>. \u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>Follow \u003c/em>\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/tag/the-bay\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\u003cem>The Bay\u003c/em>\u003c/a>\u003cem> to hear more local Bay Area stories like this one. New episodes are released Monday, Wednesday and Friday at 3 a.m. Find The Bay on \u003c/em>\u003ca href=\"https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-bay/id1350043452?mt=2\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\u003cem>Apple Podcasts\u003c/em>\u003c/a>\u003cem>, \u003c/em>\u003ca href=\"https://open.spotify.com/show/4BIKBKIujizLHlIlBNaAqQ\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\u003cem>Spotify\u003c/em>\u003c/a>\u003cem>, \u003c/em>\u003ca href=\"https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/kqed/the-bay\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\u003cem>Stitcher\u003c/em>\u003c/a>\u003cem>, and NPR One or via \u003c/em>\u003ca href=\"https://www.amazon.com/KQED-The-Bay-Flash-Briefing/dp/B07H6YYV23\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\u003cem>Alexa\u003c/em>\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>",
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},
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"title": "The California Report Magazine",
"tagline": "Your state, your stories",
"info": "Every week, The California Report Magazine takes you on a road trip for the ears: to visit the places and meet the people who make California unique. The in-depth storytelling podcast from the California Report.",
"airtime": "FRI 4:30pm-5pm, 6:30pm-7pm, 11pm-11:30pm",
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"officialWebsiteLink": "/californiareportmagazine",
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"order": 10
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"google": "https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5tZWdhcGhvbmUuZm0vS1FJTkM3NjkwNjk1OTAz",
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},
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"info": "A one-hour radio program to hear celebrated writers, artists and thinkers address contemporary ideas and values, often discussing the creative process. Please note: tapes or transcripts are not available",
"imageSrc": "https://ww2.kqed.org/radio/wp-content/uploads/sites/50/2018/05/cityartsandlecture-300x300.jpg",
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"airtime": "SUN 1pm-2pm, TUE 10pm, WED 1am",
"meta": {
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"source": "City Arts & Lectures"
},
"link": "https://www.cityarts.net",
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"rss": "https://www.cityarts.net/feed/"
}
},
"closealltabs": {
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"order": 1
},
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"info": "\u003cem>Code Switch\u003c/em>, which listeners will hear in the first part of the hour, has fearless and much-needed conversations about race. Hosted by journalists of color, the show tackles the subject of race head-on, exploring how it impacts every part of society — from politics and pop culture to history, sports and more.\u003cbr />\u003cbr />\u003cem>Life Kit\u003c/em>, which will be in the second part of the hour, guides you through spaces and feelings no one prepares you for — from finances to mental health, from workplace microaggressions to imposter syndrome, from relationships to parenting. The show features experts with real world experience and shares their knowledge. Because everyone needs a little help being human.\u003cbr />\u003cbr />\u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/podcasts/510312/codeswitch\">\u003cem>Code Switch\u003c/em> offical site and podcast\u003c/a>\u003cbr />\u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/lifekit\">\u003cem>Life Kit\u003c/em> offical site and podcast\u003c/a>\u003cbr />",
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"id": "commonwealth-club",
"title": "Commonwealth Club of California Podcast",
"info": "The Commonwealth Club of California is the nation's oldest and largest public affairs forum. As a non-partisan forum, The Club brings to the public airwaves diverse viewpoints on important topics. The Club's weekly radio broadcast - the oldest in the U.S., dating back to 1924 - is carried across the nation on public radio stations and is now podcasting. Our website archive features audio of our recent programs, as well as selected speeches from our long and distinguished history. This podcast feed is usually updated twice a week and is always un-edited.",
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"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Commonwealth-Club-Podcast-Tile-360x360-1.jpg",
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"source": "Commonwealth Club of California"
},
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"google": "https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cDovL3d3dy5jb21tb253ZWFsdGhjbHViLm9yZy9hdWRpby9wb2RjYXN0L3dlZWtseS54bWw",
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"title": "Forum",
"tagline": "The conversation starts here",
"info": "KQED’s live call-in program discussing local, state, national and international issues, as well as in-depth interviews.",
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"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Forum-Podcast-Tile-703x703-1.jpg",
"imageAlt": "KQED Forum with Mina Kim and Alexis Madrigal",
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"source": "kqed",
"order": 9
},
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"google": "https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5tZWdhcGhvbmUuZm0vS1FJTkM5NTU3MzgxNjMz",
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"officialWebsiteLink": "http://freakonomics.com/",
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"meta": {
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"source": "WNYC"
},
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"apple": "https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/freakonomics-radio/id354668519",
"tuneIn": "https://tunein.com/podcasts/WNYC-Podcasts/Freakonomics-Radio-p272293/",
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},
"fresh-air": {
"id": "fresh-air",
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"apple": "https://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewPodcast?s=143441&mt=2&id=214089682&at=11l79Y&ct=nprdirectory",
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"info": "A live production of NPR and WBUR Boston, in collaboration with stations across the country, Here & Now reflects the fluid world of news as it's happening in the middle of the day, with timely, in-depth news, interviews and conversation. Hosted by Robin Young, Jeremy Hobson and Tonya Mosley.",
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"hidden-brain": {
"id": "hidden-brain",
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"info": "Shankar Vedantam uses science and storytelling to reveal the unconscious patterns that drive human behavior, shape our choices and direct our relationships.",
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"airtime": "SUN 7pm-8pm",
"meta": {
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"source": "NPR"
},
"link": "/radio/program/hidden-brain",
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"how-i-built-this": {
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"title": "How I Built This with Guy Raz",
"info": "Guy Raz dives into the stories behind some of the world's best known companies. How I Built This weaves a narrative journey about innovators, entrepreneurs and idealists—and the movements they built.",
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"airtime": "SUN 7:30pm-8pm",
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},
"link": "/radio/program/how-i-built-this",
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"npr": "https://rpb3r.app.goo.gl/3zxy",
"apple": "https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/how-i-built-this-with-guy-raz/id1150510297?mt=2",
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"hyphenacion": {
"id": "hyphenacion",
"title": "Hyphenación",
"tagline": "Where conversation and cultura meet",
"info": "What kind of no sabo word is Hyphenación? For us, it’s about living within a hyphenation. Like being a third-gen Mexican-American from the Texas border now living that Bay Area Chicano life. Like Xorje! Each week we bring together a couple of hyphenated Latinos to talk all about personal life choices: family, careers, relationships, belonging … everything is on the table. ",
"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/03/Hyphenacion_FinalAssets_PodcastTile.png",
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"officialWebsiteLink": "/podcasts/hyphenacion",
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"order": 15
},
"link": "/podcasts/hyphenacion",
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},
"jerrybrown": {
"id": "jerrybrown",
"title": "The Political Mind of Jerry Brown",
"tagline": "Lessons from a lifetime in politics",
"info": "The Political Mind of Jerry Brown brings listeners the wisdom of the former Governor, Mayor, and presidential candidate. Scott Shafer interviewed Brown for more than 40 hours, covering the former governor's life and half-century in the political game and Brown has some lessons he'd like to share. ",
"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/The-Political-Mind-of-Jerry-Brown-Podcast-Tile-703x703-1.jpg",
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"officialWebsiteLink": "/podcasts/jerrybrown",
"meta": {
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"order": 18
},
"link": "/podcasts/jerrybrown",
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}
},
"latino-usa": {
"id": "latino-usa",
"title": "Latino USA",
"airtime": "MON 1am-2am, SUN 6pm-7pm",
"info": "Latino USA, the radio journal of news and culture, is the only national, English-language radio program produced from a Latino perspective.",
"imageSrc": "https://ww2.kqed.org/radio/wp-content/uploads/sites/50/2018/04/latinoUsa.jpg",
"officialWebsiteLink": "http://latinousa.org/",
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},
"link": "/radio/program/latino-usa",
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"apple": "https://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewPodcast?s=143441&mt=2&id=79681317&at=11l79Y&ct=nprdirectory",
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"rss": "https://feeds.npr.org/510016/podcast.xml"
}
},
"marketplace": {
"id": "marketplace",
"title": "Marketplace",
"info": "Our flagship program, helmed by Kai Ryssdal, examines what the day in money delivered, through stories, conversations, newsworthy numbers and more. Updated Monday through Friday at about 3:30 p.m. PT.",
"airtime": "MON-FRI 4pm-4:30pm, MON-WED 6:30pm-7pm",
"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Marketplace-Podcast-Tile-360x360-1.jpg",
"officialWebsiteLink": "https://www.marketplace.org/",
"meta": {
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"source": "American Public Media"
},
"link": "/radio/program/marketplace",
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"rss": "https://feeds.publicradio.org/public_feeds/marketplace-pm/rss/rss"
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},
"masters-of-scale": {
"id": "masters-of-scale",
"title": "Masters of Scale",
"info": "Masters of Scale is an original podcast in which LinkedIn co-founder and Greylock Partner Reid Hoffman sets out to describe and prove theories that explain how great entrepreneurs take their companies from zero to a gazillion in ingenious fashion.",
"airtime": "Every other Wednesday June 12 through October 16 at 8pm (repeats Thursdays at 2am)",
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"officialWebsiteLink": "https://mastersofscale.com/",
"meta": {
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"source": "WaitWhat"
},
"link": "/radio/program/masters-of-scale",
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"rss": "https://rss.art19.com/masters-of-scale"
}
},
"mindshift": {
"id": "mindshift",
"title": "MindShift",
"tagline": "A podcast about the future of learning and how we raise our kids",
"info": "The MindShift podcast explores the innovations in education that are shaping how kids learn. Hosts Ki Sung and Katrina Schwartz introduce listeners to educators, researchers, parents and students who are developing effective ways to improve how kids learn. We cover topics like how fed-up administrators are developing surprising tactics to deal with classroom disruptions; how listening to podcasts are helping kids develop reading skills; the consequences of overparenting; and why interdisciplinary learning can engage students on all ends of the traditional achievement spectrum. This podcast is part of the MindShift education site, a division of KQED News. KQED is an NPR/PBS member station based in San Francisco. You can also visit the MindShift website for episodes and supplemental blog posts or tweet us \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/MindShiftKQED\">@MindShiftKQED\u003c/a> or visit us at \u003ca href=\"/mindshift\">MindShift.KQED.org\u003c/a>",
"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Mindshift-Podcast-Tile-703x703-1.jpg",
"imageAlt": "KQED MindShift: How We Will Learn",
"officialWebsiteLink": "/mindshift/",
"meta": {
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"source": "kqed",
"order": 12
},
"link": "/podcasts/mindshift",
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"google": "https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5tZWdhcGhvbmUuZm0vS1FJTkM1NzY0NjAwNDI5",
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}
},
"morning-edition": {
"id": "morning-edition",
"title": "Morning Edition",
"info": "\u003cem>Morning Edition\u003c/em> takes listeners around the country and the world with multi-faceted stories and commentaries every weekday. Hosts Steve Inskeep, David Greene and Rachel Martin bring you the latest breaking news and features to prepare you for the day.",
"airtime": "MON-FRI 3am-9am",
"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Morning-Edition-Podcast-Tile-360x360-1.jpg",
"officialWebsiteLink": "https://www.npr.org/programs/morning-edition/",
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"link": "/radio/program/morning-edition"
},
"onourwatch": {
"id": "onourwatch",
"title": "On Our Watch",
"tagline": "Deeply-reported investigative journalism",
"info": "For decades, the process for how police police themselves has been inconsistent – if not opaque. In some states, like California, these proceedings were completely hidden. After a new police transparency law unsealed scores of internal affairs files, our reporters set out to examine these cases and the shadow world of police discipline. On Our Watch brings listeners into the rooms where officers are questioned and witnesses are interrogated to find out who this system is really protecting. Is it the officers, or the public they've sworn to serve?",
"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/On-Our-Watch-Podcast-Tile-703x703-1.jpg",
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"officialWebsiteLink": "/podcasts/onourwatch",
"meta": {
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"source": "kqed",
"order": 11
},
"link": "/podcasts/onourwatch",
"subscribe": {
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"google": "https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5ucHIub3JnLzUxMDM2MC9wb2RjYXN0LnhtbD9zYz1nb29nbGVwb2RjYXN0cw",
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},
"on-the-media": {
"id": "on-the-media",
"title": "On The Media",
"info": "Our weekly podcast explores how the media 'sausage' is made, casts an incisive eye on fluctuations in the marketplace of ideas, and examines threats to the freedom of information and expression in America and abroad. For one hour a week, the show tries to lift the veil from the process of \"making media,\" especially news media, because it's through that lens that we see the world and the world sees us",
"airtime": "SUN 2pm-3pm, MON 12am-1am",
"imageSrc": "https://ww2.kqed.org/radio/wp-content/uploads/sites/50/2018/04/onTheMedia.png",
"officialWebsiteLink": "https://www.wnycstudios.org/shows/otm",
"meta": {
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"source": "wnyc"
},
"link": "/radio/program/on-the-media",
"subscribe": {
"apple": "https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/on-the-media/id73330715?mt=2",
"tuneIn": "https://tunein.com/radio/On-the-Media-p69/",
"rss": "http://feeds.wnyc.org/onthemedia"
}
},
"pbs-newshour": {
"id": "pbs-newshour",
"title": "PBS NewsHour",
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