Cyclists and visitors converge on the Google campus on Thursday, June 5, 2014, in Mountain View. (Marcio Jose Sanchez/AP)
For more than three decades, Clive Wilkinson has been among the most sought-after office designers in the world. He has planned spaces for the likes of Microsoft, Disney, Intuit and other companies seeking unorthodox approaches to work life.
But he now has regrets about what is perhaps his most famous work: the Googleplex, the tech giant's posh headquarters in Mountain View.
Wilkinson helped lay out Google's campus after winning its design competition in 2004, leading him to work directly with Google co-founders Larry Page and Sergey Brin.
"Larry and Sergey said at the time, 'We don't really have any reference point but the Stanford campus model,'" said Wilkinson.
In Mountain View, what emerged was a maze of well-lit nooks, bleachers and clubhouse rooms to encourage collaboration. The office would also become famous for its amenities: Gourmet meals. Fitness classes. Organic gardens. Massage rooms. Laundry services. Private parks. Volleyball courts. Swimming pools. And so on.
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But looking back, Wilkinson thinks Google's luxurious on-site perks have made workers too dependent on the company, a situation he calls "dangerous."
"This notion that you can provide everything that would support a worker's life on campus might appear to be extremely generous and supportive," he said. "But it also has a whole range of potentially negative impacts."
Architect Clive Wilkinson's design for the famed Googleplex set a high bar for other Silicon Valley companies eager to keep employees at home in the office. (Jessica Pons for NPR)
Wilkinson spoke in an interview at his glass-enclosed hillside home in West Los Angeles, which some have compared to a "spaceship on stilts." His comments on Google's campus came during an extensive conversation with NPR about how the pandemic may forever reshape office life and what it could mean for workers.
While Silicon Valley has long been known for offering unusual amenities to its workers, Google's offerings set a high bar. Other tech giants began to roll out their own free meals, nature trails and private transportation services in efforts to attract and retain talent. But Wilkinson said as companies plan to bring workers back into the office, such arrangements should be reconsidered.
He said blurring the line between work and nonwork keeps employees tethered to the office, benefiting the employer most of all. That, he argues, may seem to keep workers happy but can quickly spark burnout.
"Work-life balance cannot be achieved by spending all your life on a work campus. It's not real. It's not really engaging with the world in the way most people do," he said. "It also drains the immediate neighborhoods of being able to have a commercial reality."
Employees have no reason to leave campus to explore local cafes, restaurants or grocery stores because everything is handed to them. To Wilkinson, overly coddling workers like this is "fundamentally unhealthy."
That, he said, "hasn't been recognized as one of the dangerous side effects."
If an employer is trying to foster creativity, "you don't want an overly comfortable workplace. You shouldn't have sleep pods everywhere," he said. "Creative work doesn't happen in a condition of luxury. If you have that much luxury, you naturally want to fall asleep."
At the same time, it is "a difficult one to pull apart," he said. "Because once you made all those offers to your employees, how do you pull back from that situation?"
"There's a way that something that was built with good intentions can be slightly corrupted," Warzel told NPR. "It's not a terrible thing for employees to get nice perks, but what is it in service of? Making you a better worker? Or making sure your needs are met? Or keeping you stuck in this liminal work-like state for as long as possible."
That said, plenty of Google's some 144,000 employees appear to be just fine with the on-site luxuries their employer provides. Surveys routinely place Google at the tops of lists for worker happiness and satisfaction with how much employees are paid. When the pandemic forced Googlers off campus, it appears it dented worker morale, and the company is responding with new cash bonuses.
When COVID-19 hit, some 2.5 million square feet of office space Wilkinson's firm was working on was canceled or delayed. But he becomes defiant when asked whether the pandemic has killed the office.
"It's ridiculous to say the office is dead," said Wilkinson. "The office is the fermenting ground for people growing into successful adults. How would that ever be dead?"
Studies suggest remote work will outlast the pandemic. But most companies in a new U.S. Chamber of Commerce survey said they also plan to maintain their office spaces. Wilkinson's corporate clients are now returning. He says most of them are not ready to forgo the office. They are, however, eager for a facelift, one that makes sense in a hybrid work environment.
To a certain degree, he said, companies are winging it.
"People don't know how much space they need anymore, so I think an awful lot of large companies are waiting to see what everybody else does," Wilkinson said.
No one wants a depressingly empty office, something he calls "one of the biggest problems in the new workplace."
He adds, "When you go in there, specifically because of hybrid working, is the place going to feel that it's underpowered and it's running on empty?"
And so he suspects, happily, that the pandemic has wiped out one particular type of office: the cubicle farm.
"Cubicles are like human chicken farming. They have always been bad for anything other than kind of factory-farming kind of approach to the office," he said. "Put people in tiny little footprint because it takes less money than an enclosed office and we can kind of keep an eye on them."
Out with the old office, in with the 'boutique hotel' feel
If jammed-together desks are out and Wilkinson cautions against swanky amenities à la Google, what does the post-pandemic workplace resemble?
Wilkinson envisions big, open spaces with couches and cozy nooks as work stations that are not assigned to any single employee. An environment where it's easy to hang out and chat.
Some have compared the glass-enclosed hillside home that Wilkinson built for himself in West Los Angeles to a "spaceship on stilts."
"You might think you're walking into the lounge of a boutique hotel," Wilkinson said. "It's an amazingly effective work environment, even though there's no conventional kind of office furnishing or anything like that."
He has noticed something else about the pandemic-era office plans he is now working on: Companies are investing in outdoor spaces. Go ahead, answer your emails in the shade.
"Because now it's seen as being healthy," he said. "Health itself has suddenly become one of the top criteria about where you work."
He said the future office will be a balancing act. It needs to be more attractive than working from home, yet not so attractive that workers don't want to go home.
But not even the most seasoned corporate architect can predict the answer to the question at the center of it all: How many workers really want to return to the office, and how often do they want to be there?
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"We're having very interesting conversations with a lot of clients right now about, 'Does the office need to be a bunch of project rooms? Does it need to be one huge cafeteria?'" he said. "We're now building a lot of Zoom rooms, which is something we never did before."
Copyright 2022 NPR. To see more, visit www.npr.org.
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"content": "\u003cp>For more than three decades, Clive Wilkinson has been among the most sought-after office designers in the world. He has planned spaces for the likes of Microsoft, Disney, Intuit and other companies seeking unorthodox approaches to work life.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But he now has regrets about what is perhaps his most famous work: the Googleplex, the tech giant's posh headquarters in Mountain View.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Wilkinson helped lay out Google's campus after winning its design competition in 2004, leading him to work directly with Google co-founders Larry Page and Sergey Brin.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"Larry and Sergey said at the time, 'We don't really have any reference point but the Stanford campus model,'\" said Wilkinson.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In Mountain View, what emerged was a maze of well-lit nooks, bleachers and clubhouse rooms to encourage collaboration. The office would also become famous for its amenities: Gourmet meals. Fitness classes. Organic gardens. Massage rooms. Laundry services. Private parks. Volleyball courts. Swimming pools. And so on.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But looking back, Wilkinson thinks Google's luxurious on-site perks have made workers too dependent on the company, a situation he calls \"dangerous.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"This notion that you can provide everything that would support a worker's life on campus might appear to be extremely generous and supportive,\" he said. \"But it also has a whole range of potentially negative impacts.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11902513\" class=\"wp-caption alignnone\" style=\"max-width: 1920px\">\u003cimg class=\"size-full wp-image-11902513\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/10/2022/01/clive-wilkinson_003-edit_custom-28f1d4588fcde15941d9af240730efe934e9b4e5-scaled-e1643058811428.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"1920\" height=\"1279\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">Architect Clive Wilkinson's design for the famed Googleplex set a high bar for other Silicon Valley companies eager to keep employees at home in the office. \u003ccite>(Jessica Pons for NPR)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>Wilkinson spoke in an interview at his glass-enclosed hillside home in West Los Angeles, which some have compared to a \"\u003ca href=\"https://homeworlddesign.com/west-los-angeles-residence-clive-wilkinson-architects/\">spaceship on stilts\u003c/a>.\" His comments on Google's campus came during an extensive conversation with NPR about how the pandemic may forever reshape office life and what it could mean for workers.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>While Silicon Valley has long been known for offering unusual amenities to its workers, Google's offerings set a high bar. Other tech giants began to roll out their own free meals, nature trails and private transportation services in efforts to attract and retain talent. But Wilkinson said as companies plan to bring workers back into the office, such arrangements should be reconsidered.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>He said blurring the line between work and nonwork keeps employees tethered to the office, benefiting the employer most of all. That, he argues, may seem to keep workers happy but can quickly spark burnout.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"Work-life balance cannot be achieved by spending all your life on a work campus. It's not real. It's not really engaging with the world in the way most people do,\" he said. \"It also drains the immediate neighborhoods of being able to have a commercial reality.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Employees have no reason to leave campus to explore local cafes, restaurants or grocery stores because everything is handed to them. To Wilkinson, overly coddling workers like this is \"fundamentally unhealthy.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>That, he said, \"hasn't been recognized as one of the dangerous side effects.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>If an employer is trying to foster creativity, \"you don't want an overly comfortable workplace. You shouldn't have sleep pods everywhere,\" he said. \"Creative work doesn't happen in a condition of luxury. If you have that much luxury, you naturally want to fall asleep.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>At the same time, it is \"a difficult one to pull apart,\" he said. \"Because once you made all those offers to your employees, how do you pull back from that situation?\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Authors Charlie Warzel and Anne Helen Petersen talked to Wilkinson about his new perspective on the Googleplex in their new book \u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/2021/11/29/1059829390/working-from-home-doesnt-have-to-suck-heres-how-out-of-office-can-be-better\">\u003cem>Out of Office: The Big Problem and Bigger Promise of Working from Home\u003c/em>\u003c/a>\u003cem>.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"There's a way that something that was built with good intentions can be slightly corrupted,\" Warzel told NPR. \"It's not a terrible thing for employees to get nice perks, but what is it in service of? Making you a better worker? Or making sure your needs are met? Or keeping you stuck in this liminal work-like state for as long as possible.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>That said, plenty of Google's some 144,000 employees appear to be just fine with the on-site luxuries their employer provides. Surveys routinely place Google at the tops of lists for\u003ca href=\"https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20191204005292/en/Despite-Employee-Tensions-Google-Ranks-1-out-of-the-CareerBliss-50-Happiest-Companies-for-2020\"> worker happiness\u003c/a> and satisfaction with how much employees are paid. When the pandemic forced Googlers off campus, it appears it dented worker morale, and the company is responding with \u003ca href=\"https://www.reuters.com/technology/google-give-additional-staff-bonus-next-year-2021-12-08/\">new cash bonuses\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Google, which did not respond to a request for comment, is planning a new \u003ca href=\"https://www.cnbc.com/2021/05/25/google-cleared-to-build-multi-billion-dollar-megacampus-in-san-jose.html?__source=sharebar%7Ctwitter&par=sharebar\">multibillion-dollar campus\u003c/a> in San Jose and \u003ca href=\"https://www.mercurynews.com/2021/05/19/google-huge-new-campus-mountain-view-green-tech-real-estate-develop/\">another massive site\u003c/a> in Mountain View.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch3>The office is not dead, Wilkinson argues\u003c/h3>\n\u003cp>When COVID-19 hit, some 2.5 million square feet of office space Wilkinson's firm was working on was canceled or delayed. But he becomes defiant when asked whether the pandemic has killed the office.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"It's ridiculous to say the office is dead,\" said Wilkinson. \"The office is the fermenting ground for people growing into successful adults. How would that ever be dead?\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Studies suggest remote work will outlast the pandemic. But most companies in a \u003ca href=\"https://www.uschamber.com/workforce/rsm-survey-shows-how-covid-19-has-influenced-a-transformation-of-the-working-world\">new U.S. Chamber of Commerce survey\u003c/a> said they also plan to maintain their office spaces. Wilkinson's corporate clients are now returning. He says most of them are not ready to forgo the office. They are, however, eager for a facelift, one that makes sense in a hybrid work environment.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>To a certain degree, he said, companies are winging it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"People don't know how much space they need anymore, so I think an awful lot of large companies are waiting to see what everybody else does,\" Wilkinson said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>No one wants a depressingly empty office, something he calls \"one of the biggest problems in the new workplace.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>He adds, \"When you go in there, specifically because of hybrid working, is the place going to feel that it's underpowered and it's running on empty?\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>And so he suspects, happily, that the pandemic has wiped out one particular type of office: the cubicle farm.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"Cubicles are like human chicken farming. They have always been bad for anything other than kind of factory-farming kind of approach to the office,\" he said. \"Put people in tiny little footprint because it takes less money than an enclosed office and we can kind of keep an eye on them.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003ch3>Out with the old office, in with the 'boutique hotel' feel\u003c/h3>\n\u003cp>If jammed-together desks are out and Wilkinson cautions against swanky amenities à la Google, what does the post-pandemic workplace resemble?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Wilkinson envisions big, open spaces with couches and cozy nooks as work stations that are not assigned to any single employee. An environment where it's easy to hang out and chat.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure class=\"wp-caption alignnone\" style=\"max-width: 1600px\">\u003cimg src=\"https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2022/01/19/clive-wilkinson_008-edit_custom-f21324dfa746b167ea0996cad197100dbc35fbb1-s1600-c85.webp\" alt=\"\" width=\"1600\" height=\"1065\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">Some have compared the glass-enclosed hillside home that Wilkinson built for himself in West Los Angeles to a \"spaceship on stilts.\"\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>\"You might think you're walking into the lounge of a boutique hotel,\" Wilkinson said. \"It's an amazingly effective work environment, even though there's no conventional kind of office furnishing or anything like that.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>He has noticed something else about the pandemic-era office plans he is now working on: Companies are investing in outdoor spaces. Go ahead, answer your emails in the shade.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"Because now it's seen as being healthy,\" he said. \"Health itself has suddenly become one of the top criteria about where you work.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>He said the future office will be a balancing act. It needs to be more attractive than working from home, yet not so attractive that workers don't want to go home.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But not even the most seasoned corporate architect can predict the answer to the question at the center of it all: How many workers really want to return to the office, and how often do they want to be there?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad floatright]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"We're having very interesting conversations with a lot of clients right now about, 'Does the office need to be a bunch of project rooms? Does it need to be one huge cafeteria?'\" he said. \"We're now building a lot of Zoom rooms, which is something we never did before.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cdiv class=\"fullattribution\">Copyright 2022 NPR. To see more, visit www.npr.org.\u003cimg src=\"https://www.google-analytics.com/__utm.gif?utmac=UA-5828686-4&utmdt=Architect+behind+Googleplex+now+says+it%27s+%27dangerous%27+to+work+at+such+a+posh+office&utme=8(APIKey)9(MDAxOTAwOTE4MDEyMTkxMDAzNjczZDljZA004)\">\u003c/div>\n\n",
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"excerpt": "Clive Wilkinson says it's really not a good thing for employees to work at a place that has catered meals, private parks, massage tables and a laundromat ... because why would you ever leave? ",
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"content": "\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>For more than three decades, Clive Wilkinson has been among the most sought-after office designers in the world. He has planned spaces for the likes of Microsoft, Disney, Intuit and other companies seeking unorthodox approaches to work life.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But he now has regrets about what is perhaps his most famous work: the Googleplex, the tech giant's posh headquarters in Mountain View.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Wilkinson helped lay out Google's campus after winning its design competition in 2004, leading him to work directly with Google co-founders Larry Page and Sergey Brin.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"Larry and Sergey said at the time, 'We don't really have any reference point but the Stanford campus model,'\" said Wilkinson.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In Mountain View, what emerged was a maze of well-lit nooks, bleachers and clubhouse rooms to encourage collaboration. The office would also become famous for its amenities: Gourmet meals. Fitness classes. Organic gardens. Massage rooms. Laundry services. Private parks. Volleyball courts. Swimming pools. And so on.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>",
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"content": "\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But looking back, Wilkinson thinks Google's luxurious on-site perks have made workers too dependent on the company, a situation he calls \"dangerous.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"This notion that you can provide everything that would support a worker's life on campus might appear to be extremely generous and supportive,\" he said. \"But it also has a whole range of potentially negative impacts.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11902513\" class=\"wp-caption alignnone\" style=\"max-width: 1920px\">\u003cimg class=\"size-full wp-image-11902513\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/10/2022/01/clive-wilkinson_003-edit_custom-28f1d4588fcde15941d9af240730efe934e9b4e5-scaled-e1643058811428.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"1920\" height=\"1279\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">Architect Clive Wilkinson's design for the famed Googleplex set a high bar for other Silicon Valley companies eager to keep employees at home in the office. \u003ccite>(Jessica Pons for NPR)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>Wilkinson spoke in an interview at his glass-enclosed hillside home in West Los Angeles, which some have compared to a \"\u003ca href=\"https://homeworlddesign.com/west-los-angeles-residence-clive-wilkinson-architects/\">spaceship on stilts\u003c/a>.\" His comments on Google's campus came during an extensive conversation with NPR about how the pandemic may forever reshape office life and what it could mean for workers.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>While Silicon Valley has long been known for offering unusual amenities to its workers, Google's offerings set a high bar. Other tech giants began to roll out their own free meals, nature trails and private transportation services in efforts to attract and retain talent. But Wilkinson said as companies plan to bring workers back into the office, such arrangements should be reconsidered.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>He said blurring the line between work and nonwork keeps employees tethered to the office, benefiting the employer most of all. That, he argues, may seem to keep workers happy but can quickly spark burnout.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"Work-life balance cannot be achieved by spending all your life on a work campus. It's not real. It's not really engaging with the world in the way most people do,\" he said. \"It also drains the immediate neighborhoods of being able to have a commercial reality.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Employees have no reason to leave campus to explore local cafes, restaurants or grocery stores because everything is handed to them. To Wilkinson, overly coddling workers like this is \"fundamentally unhealthy.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>That, he said, \"hasn't been recognized as one of the dangerous side effects.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>If an employer is trying to foster creativity, \"you don't want an overly comfortable workplace. You shouldn't have sleep pods everywhere,\" he said. \"Creative work doesn't happen in a condition of luxury. If you have that much luxury, you naturally want to fall asleep.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>At the same time, it is \"a difficult one to pull apart,\" he said. \"Because once you made all those offers to your employees, how do you pull back from that situation?\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Authors Charlie Warzel and Anne Helen Petersen talked to Wilkinson about his new perspective on the Googleplex in their new book \u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/2021/11/29/1059829390/working-from-home-doesnt-have-to-suck-heres-how-out-of-office-can-be-better\">\u003cem>Out of Office: The Big Problem and Bigger Promise of Working from Home\u003c/em>\u003c/a>\u003cem>.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"There's a way that something that was built with good intentions can be slightly corrupted,\" Warzel told NPR. \"It's not a terrible thing for employees to get nice perks, but what is it in service of? Making you a better worker? Or making sure your needs are met? Or keeping you stuck in this liminal work-like state for as long as possible.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>That said, plenty of Google's some 144,000 employees appear to be just fine with the on-site luxuries their employer provides. Surveys routinely place Google at the tops of lists for\u003ca href=\"https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20191204005292/en/Despite-Employee-Tensions-Google-Ranks-1-out-of-the-CareerBliss-50-Happiest-Companies-for-2020\"> worker happiness\u003c/a> and satisfaction with how much employees are paid. When the pandemic forced Googlers off campus, it appears it dented worker morale, and the company is responding with \u003ca href=\"https://www.reuters.com/technology/google-give-additional-staff-bonus-next-year-2021-12-08/\">new cash bonuses\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Google, which did not respond to a request for comment, is planning a new \u003ca href=\"https://www.cnbc.com/2021/05/25/google-cleared-to-build-multi-billion-dollar-megacampus-in-san-jose.html?__source=sharebar%7Ctwitter&par=sharebar\">multibillion-dollar campus\u003c/a> in San Jose and \u003ca href=\"https://www.mercurynews.com/2021/05/19/google-huge-new-campus-mountain-view-green-tech-real-estate-develop/\">another massive site\u003c/a> in Mountain View.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch3>The office is not dead, Wilkinson argues\u003c/h3>\n\u003cp>When COVID-19 hit, some 2.5 million square feet of office space Wilkinson's firm was working on was canceled or delayed. But he becomes defiant when asked whether the pandemic has killed the office.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"It's ridiculous to say the office is dead,\" said Wilkinson. \"The office is the fermenting ground for people growing into successful adults. How would that ever be dead?\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Studies suggest remote work will outlast the pandemic. But most companies in a \u003ca href=\"https://www.uschamber.com/workforce/rsm-survey-shows-how-covid-19-has-influenced-a-transformation-of-the-working-world\">new U.S. Chamber of Commerce survey\u003c/a> said they also plan to maintain their office spaces. Wilkinson's corporate clients are now returning. He says most of them are not ready to forgo the office. They are, however, eager for a facelift, one that makes sense in a hybrid work environment.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>To a certain degree, he said, companies are winging it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"People don't know how much space they need anymore, so I think an awful lot of large companies are waiting to see what everybody else does,\" Wilkinson said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>No one wants a depressingly empty office, something he calls \"one of the biggest problems in the new workplace.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>He adds, \"When you go in there, specifically because of hybrid working, is the place going to feel that it's underpowered and it's running on empty?\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>And so he suspects, happily, that the pandemic has wiped out one particular type of office: the cubicle farm.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"Cubicles are like human chicken farming. They have always been bad for anything other than kind of factory-farming kind of approach to the office,\" he said. \"Put people in tiny little footprint because it takes less money than an enclosed office and we can kind of keep an eye on them.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003ch3>Out with the old office, in with the 'boutique hotel' feel\u003c/h3>\n\u003cp>If jammed-together desks are out and Wilkinson cautions against swanky amenities à la Google, what does the post-pandemic workplace resemble?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Wilkinson envisions big, open spaces with couches and cozy nooks as work stations that are not assigned to any single employee. An environment where it's easy to hang out and chat.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure class=\"wp-caption alignnone\" style=\"max-width: 1600px\">\u003cimg src=\"https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2022/01/19/clive-wilkinson_008-edit_custom-f21324dfa746b167ea0996cad197100dbc35fbb1-s1600-c85.webp\" alt=\"\" width=\"1600\" height=\"1065\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">Some have compared the glass-enclosed hillside home that Wilkinson built for himself in West Los Angeles to a \"spaceship on stilts.\"\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>\"You might think you're walking into the lounge of a boutique hotel,\" Wilkinson said. \"It's an amazingly effective work environment, even though there's no conventional kind of office furnishing or anything like that.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>He has noticed something else about the pandemic-era office plans he is now working on: Companies are investing in outdoor spaces. Go ahead, answer your emails in the shade.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"Because now it's seen as being healthy,\" he said. \"Health itself has suddenly become one of the top criteria about where you work.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>He said the future office will be a balancing act. It needs to be more attractive than working from home, yet not so attractive that workers don't want to go home.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But not even the most seasoned corporate architect can predict the answer to the question at the center of it all: How many workers really want to return to the office, and how often do they want to be there?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>",
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"title": "American Suburb: The Podcast",
"tagline": "The flip side of gentrification, told through one town",
"info": "Gentrification is changing cities across America, forcing people from neighborhoods they have long called home. Call them the displaced. Now those priced out of the Bay Area are looking for a better life in an unlikely place. American Suburb follows this migration to one California town along the Delta, 45 miles from San Francisco. But is this once sleepy suburb ready for them?",
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"order": 19
},
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"apple": "https://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewPodcast?mt=2&id=1287748328",
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"id": "baycurious",
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"tagline": "Exploring the Bay Area, one question at a time",
"info": "KQED’s new podcast, Bay Curious, gets to the bottom of the mysteries — both profound and peculiar — that give the Bay Area its unique identity. And we’ll do it with your help! You ask the questions. You decide what Bay Curious investigates. And you join us on the journey to find the answers.",
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"info": "The day's top stories from BBC News compiled twice daily in the week, once at weekends.",
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"apple": "https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/global-news-podcast/id135067274?mt=2",
"tuneIn": "https://tunein.com/radio/BBC-World-Service-p455581/",
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"id": "code-switch-life-kit",
"title": "Code Switch / Life Kit",
"info": "\u003cem>Code Switch\u003c/em>, which listeners will hear in the first part of the hour, has fearless and much-needed conversations about race. Hosted by journalists of color, the show tackles the subject of race head-on, exploring how it impacts every part of society — from politics and pop culture to history, sports and more.\u003cbr />\u003cbr />\u003cem>Life Kit\u003c/em>, which will be in the second part of the hour, guides you through spaces and feelings no one prepares you for — from finances to mental health, from workplace microaggressions to imposter syndrome, from relationships to parenting. The show features experts with real world experience and shares their knowledge. Because everyone needs a little help being human.\u003cbr />\u003cbr />\u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/podcasts/510312/codeswitch\">\u003cem>Code Switch\u003c/em> offical site and podcast\u003c/a>\u003cbr />\u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/lifekit\">\u003cem>Life Kit\u003c/em> offical site and podcast\u003c/a>\u003cbr />",
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"id": "commonwealth-club",
"title": "Commonwealth Club of California Podcast",
"info": "The Commonwealth Club of California is the nation's oldest and largest public affairs forum. As a non-partisan forum, The Club brings to the public airwaves diverse viewpoints on important topics. The Club's weekly radio broadcast - the oldest in the U.S., dating back to 1924 - is carried across the nation on public radio stations and is now podcasting. Our website archive features audio of our recent programs, as well as selected speeches from our long and distinguished history. This podcast feed is usually updated twice a week and is always un-edited.",
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"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Commonwealth-Club-Podcast-Tile-360x360-1.jpg",
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"source": "Commonwealth Club of California"
},
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"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Forum-Podcast-Tile-703x703-1.jpg",
"imageAlt": "KQED Forum with Mina Kim and Alexis Madrigal",
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"source": "kqed",
"order": 10
},
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"google": "https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5tZWdhcGhvbmUuZm0vS1FJTkM5NTU3MzgxNjMz",
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},
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"officialWebsiteLink": "http://freakonomics.com/",
"airtime": "SUN 1am-2am, SAT 3pm-4pm",
"meta": {
"site": "radio",
"source": "WNYC"
},
"link": "/radio/program/freakonomics-radio",
"subscribe": {
"npr": "https://rpb3r.app.goo.gl/4s8b",
"apple": "https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/freakonomics-radio/id354668519",
"tuneIn": "https://tunein.com/podcasts/WNYC-Podcasts/Freakonomics-Radio-p272293/",
"rss": "https://feeds.feedburner.com/freakonomicsradio"
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},
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"id": "fresh-air",
"title": "Fresh Air",
"info": "Hosted by Terry Gross, \u003cem>Fresh Air from WHYY\u003c/em> is the Peabody Award-winning weekday magazine of contemporary arts and issues. One of public radio's most popular programs, Fresh Air features intimate conversations with today's biggest luminaries.",
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"meta": {
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"link": "/radio/program/fresh-air",
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"apple": "https://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewPodcast?s=143441&mt=2&id=214089682&at=11l79Y&ct=nprdirectory",
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"title": "Here & Now",
"info": "A live production of NPR and WBUR Boston, in collaboration with stations across the country, Here & Now reflects the fluid world of news as it's happening in the middle of the day, with timely, in-depth news, interviews and conversation. Hosted by Robin Young, Jeremy Hobson and Tonya Mosley.",
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"rss": "https://feeds.npr.org/510051/podcast.xml"
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},
"how-i-built-this": {
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"title": "How I Built This with Guy Raz",
"info": "Guy Raz dives into the stories behind some of the world's best known companies. How I Built This weaves a narrative journey about innovators, entrepreneurs and idealists—and the movements they built.",
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"airtime": "SUN 7:30pm-8pm",
"meta": {
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"link": "/radio/program/how-i-built-this",
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},
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"id": "inside-europe",
"title": "Inside Europe",
"info": "Inside Europe, a one-hour weekly news magazine hosted by Helen Seeney and Keith Walker, explores the topical issues shaping the continent. No other part of the globe has experienced such dynamic political and social change in recent years.",
"airtime": "SAT 3am-4am",
"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Inside-Europe-Podcast-Tile-300x300-1.jpg",
"meta": {
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"source": "Deutsche Welle"
},
"link": "/radio/program/inside-europe",
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"apple": "https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/inside-europe/id80106806?mt=2",
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}
},
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"id": "latino-usa",
"title": "Latino USA",
"airtime": "MON 1am-2am, SUN 6pm-7pm",
"info": "Latino USA, the radio journal of news and culture, is the only national, English-language radio program produced from a Latino perspective.",
"imageSrc": "https://ww2.kqed.org/radio/wp-content/uploads/sites/50/2018/04/latinoUsa.jpg",
"officialWebsiteLink": "http://latinousa.org/",
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"link": "/radio/program/latino-usa",
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"apple": "https://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewPodcast?s=143441&mt=2&id=79681317&at=11l79Y&ct=nprdirectory",
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"rss": "https://feeds.npr.org/510016/podcast.xml"
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},
"live-from-here-highlights": {
"id": "live-from-here-highlights",
"title": "Live from Here Highlights",
"info": "Chris Thile steps to the mic as the host of Live from Here (formerly A Prairie Home Companion), a live public radio variety show. Download Chris’s Song of the Week plus other highlights from the broadcast. Produced by American Public Media.",
"airtime": "SAT 6pm-8pm, SUN 11am-1pm",
"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Live-From-Here-Podcast-Tile-360x360-1.jpg",
"officialWebsiteLink": "https://www.livefromhere.org/",
"meta": {
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"source": "american public media"
},
"link": "/radio/program/live-from-here-highlights",
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"apple": "https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/id1167173941",
"tuneIn": "https://tunein.com/radio/Live-from-Here-Highlights-p921744/",
"rss": "https://feeds.publicradio.org/public_feeds/a-prairie-home-companion-highlights/rss/rss"
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},
"marketplace": {
"id": "marketplace",
"title": "Marketplace",
"info": "Our flagship program, helmed by Kai Ryssdal, examines what the day in money delivered, through stories, conversations, newsworthy numbers and more. Updated Monday through Friday at about 3:30 p.m. PT.",
"airtime": "MON-FRI 4pm-4:30pm, MON-WED 6:30pm-7pm",
"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Marketplace-Podcast-Tile-360x360-1.jpg",
"officialWebsiteLink": "https://www.marketplace.org/",
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"source": "American Public Media"
},
"link": "/radio/program/marketplace",
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},
"mindshift": {
"id": "mindshift",
"title": "MindShift",
"tagline": "A podcast about the future of learning and how we raise our kids",
"info": "The MindShift podcast explores the innovations in education that are shaping how kids learn. Hosts Ki Sung and Katrina Schwartz introduce listeners to educators, researchers, parents and students who are developing effective ways to improve how kids learn. We cover topics like how fed-up administrators are developing surprising tactics to deal with classroom disruptions; how listening to podcasts are helping kids develop reading skills; the consequences of overparenting; and why interdisciplinary learning can engage students on all ends of the traditional achievement spectrum. This podcast is part of the MindShift education site, a division of KQED News. KQED is an NPR/PBS member station based in San Francisco. You can also visit the MindShift website for episodes and supplemental blog posts or tweet us \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/MindShiftKQED\">@MindShiftKQED\u003c/a> or visit us at \u003ca href=\"/mindshift\">MindShift.KQED.org\u003c/a>",
"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Mindshift-Podcast-Tile-703x703-1.jpg",
"imageAlt": "KQED MindShift: How We Will Learn",
"officialWebsiteLink": "/mindshift/",
"meta": {
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"source": "kqed",
"order": 13
},
"link": "/podcasts/mindshift",
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"google": "https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5tZWdhcGhvbmUuZm0vS1FJTkM1NzY0NjAwNDI5",
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},
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"id": "morning-edition",
"title": "Morning Edition",
"info": "\u003cem>Morning Edition\u003c/em> takes listeners around the country and the world with multi-faceted stories and commentaries every weekday. Hosts Steve Inskeep, David Greene and Rachel Martin bring you the latest breaking news and features to prepare you for the day.",
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"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Morning-Edition-Podcast-Tile-360x360-1.jpg",
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"onourwatch": {
"id": "onourwatch",
"title": "On Our Watch",
"tagline": "Deeply-reported investigative journalism",
"info": "For decades, the process for how police police themselves has been inconsistent – if not opaque. In some states, like California, these proceedings were completely hidden. After a new police transparency law unsealed scores of internal affairs files, our reporters set out to examine these cases and the shadow world of police discipline. On Our Watch brings listeners into the rooms where officers are questioned and witnesses are interrogated to find out who this system is really protecting. Is it the officers, or the public they've sworn to serve?",
"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/On-Our-Watch-Podcast-Tile-703x703-1.jpg",
"imageAlt": "On Our Watch from NPR and KQED",
"officialWebsiteLink": "/podcasts/onourwatch",
"meta": {
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"source": "kqed",
"order": 12
},
"link": "/podcasts/onourwatch",
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"google": "https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5ucHIub3JnLzUxMDM2MC9wb2RjYXN0LnhtbD9zYz1nb29nbGVwb2RjYXN0cw",
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"rss": "https://feeds.npr.org/510360/podcast.xml"
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},
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"id": "on-the-media",
"title": "On The Media",
"info": "Our weekly podcast explores how the media 'sausage' is made, casts an incisive eye on fluctuations in the marketplace of ideas, and examines threats to the freedom of information and expression in America and abroad. For one hour a week, the show tries to lift the veil from the process of \"making media,\" especially news media, because it's through that lens that we see the world and the world sees us",
"airtime": "SUN 2pm-3pm, MON 12am-1am",
"imageSrc": "https://ww2.kqed.org/radio/wp-content/uploads/sites/50/2018/04/onTheMedia.png",
"officialWebsiteLink": "https://www.wnycstudios.org/shows/otm",
"meta": {
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},
"link": "/radio/program/on-the-media",
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"tuneIn": "https://tunein.com/radio/On-the-Media-p69/",
"rss": "http://feeds.wnyc.org/onthemedia"
}
},
"our-body-politic": {
"id": "our-body-politic",
"title": "Our Body Politic",
"info": "Presented by KQED, KCRW and KPCC, and created and hosted by award-winning journalist Farai Chideya, Our Body Politic is unapologetically centered on reporting on not just how women of color experience the major political events of today, but how they’re impacting those very issues.",
"airtime": "SAT 6pm-7pm, SUN 1am-2am",
"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Our-Body-Politic-Podcast-Tile-360x360-1.jpg",
"officialWebsiteLink": "https://our-body-politic.simplecast.com/",
"meta": {
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"source": "kcrw"
},
"link": "/radio/program/our-body-politic",
"subscribe": {
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"google": "https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5zaW1wbGVjYXN0LmNvbS9feGFQaHMxcw",
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"rss": "https://feeds.simplecast.com/_xaPhs1s",
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},
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"id": "pbs-newshour",
"title": "PBS NewsHour",
"info": "Analysis, background reports and updates from the PBS NewsHour putting today's news in context.",
"airtime": "MON-FRI 3pm-4pm",
"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/PBS-News-Hour-Podcast-Tile-360x360-1.jpg",
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},
"link": "/radio/program/pbs-newshour",
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"apple": "https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/pbs-newshour-full-show/id394432287?mt=2",
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"rss": "https://www.pbs.org/newshour/feeds/rss/podcasts/show"
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},
"perspectives": {
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