How to Do Therapy With Founder of Brown Girl Therapy, Sahaj Kohli
Pain and Purpose: Lessons From Bruce Lee and Frida Kahlo
Hey, Young World, the World is Yours
How Can Filipinxs Join the Fight Against Anti-Blackness?
If I Ruled the World
No More Shame
Our Lives Matter, Too
Fight Like Chadwick
Bonus: TBT and California Love's Walter Thompson-Hernández on IG Live
Sponsored
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Isabeth is a bilingual audio journalist from Southeast Los Angeles and her interests are in wellness, social justice, lifestyle, arts and culture. Previously, she worked on Truth Be Told and as a freelancer for NPR’s Weekend Edition, Roxane Gay and Tressie McMillan Cottom’s Hear to Slay, KCRW's Bodies, and Feeling My Flo podcast. Isabeth is an NPR Next Generation Radio alum, an IWMF Gwen Ifill Fellow, and a previous NPR National Desk intern. She holds a Master’s in Public Health from Emory University and a Bachelor of Arts from UC Berkeley.","avatar":"https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/122e7c21a0daf743684d9988238ef02f?s=600&d=blank&r=g","twitter":"IsabethKahlo","facebook":null,"instagram":null,"linkedin":null,"sites":[{"site":"arts","roles":["contributor"]},{"site":"news","roles":["author"]},{"site":"podcasts","roles":["editor"]}],"headData":{"title":"Isabeth Mendoza | KQED","description":"Engagement Producer","ogImgSrc":"https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/122e7c21a0daf743684d9988238ef02f?s=600&d=blank&r=g","twImgSrc":"https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/122e7c21a0daf743684d9988238ef02f?s=600&d=blank&r=g"},"isLoading":false,"link":"/author/imendoza"}},"breakingNewsReducer":{},"campaignFinanceReducer":{},"firebase":{"requesting":{},"requested":{},"timestamps":{},"data":{},"ordered":{},"auth":{"isLoaded":false,"isEmpty":true},"authError":null,"profile":{"isLoaded":false,"isEmpty":true},"listeners":{"byId":{},"allIds":[]},"isInitializing":false,"errors":[]},"navBarReducer":{"navBarId":"podcasts","fullView":true,"showPlayer":false},"navMenuReducer":{"menus":[{"key":"menu1","items":[{"name":"News","link":"/","type":"title"},{"name":"Politics","link":"/politics"},{"name":"Science","link":"/science"},{"name":"Education","link":"/educationnews"},{"name":"Housing","link":"/housing"},{"name":"Immigration","link":"/immigration"},{"name":"Criminal Justice","link":"/criminaljustice"},{"name":"Silicon Valley","link":"/siliconvalley"},{"name":"Forum","link":"/forum"},{"name":"The California Report","link":"/californiareport"}]},{"key":"menu2","items":[{"name":"Arts & Culture","link":"/arts","type":"title"},{"name":"Critics’ Picks","link":"/thedolist"},{"name":"Cultural Commentary","link":"/artscommentary"},{"name":"Food & Drink","link":"/food"},{"name":"Bay Area Hip-Hop","link":"/bayareahiphop"},{"name":"Rebel Girls","link":"/rebelgirls"},{"name":"Arts Video","link":"/artsvideos"}]},{"key":"menu3","items":[{"name":"Podcasts","link":"/podcasts","type":"title"},{"name":"Bay Curious","link":"/podcasts/baycurious"},{"name":"Rightnowish","link":"/podcasts/rightnowish"},{"name":"The Bay","link":"/podcasts/thebay"},{"name":"On Our Watch","link":"/podcasts/onourwatch"},{"name":"Mindshift","link":"/podcasts/mindshift"},{"name":"Consider This","link":"/podcasts/considerthis"},{"name":"Political Breakdown","link":"/podcasts/politicalbreakdown"}]},{"key":"menu4","items":[{"name":"Live Radio","link":"/radio","type":"title"},{"name":"TV","link":"/tv","type":"title"},{"name":"Events","link":"/events","type":"title"},{"name":"For Educators","link":"/education","type":"title"},{"name":"Support KQED","link":"/support","type":"title"},{"name":"About","link":"/about","type":"title"},{"name":"Help Center","link":"https://kqed-helpcenter.kqed.org/s","type":"title"}]}]},"pagesReducer":{},"postsReducer":{"stream_live":{"type":"live","id":"stream_live","audioUrl":"https://streams.kqed.org/kqedradio","title":"Live Stream","excerpt":"Live Stream information currently unavailable.","link":"/radio","featImg":"","label":{"name":"KQED Live","link":"/"}},"stream_kqedNewscast":{"type":"posts","id":"stream_kqedNewscast","audioUrl":"https://www.kqed.org/.stream/anon/radio/RDnews/newscast.mp3?_=1","title":"KQED Newscast","featImg":"","label":{"name":"88.5 FM","link":"/"}},"podcasts_778":{"type":"posts","id":"podcasts_778","meta":{"index":"posts_1591205157","site":"podcasts","id":"778","score":null,"sort":[1608223968000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"how-to-do-therapy-with-sahaj-kohli","title":"How to Do Therapy With Founder of Brown Girl Therapy, Sahaj Kohli","publishDate":1608223968,"format":"standard","headTitle":"Truth Be Told | KQED Podcasts | KQED","labelTerm":{},"content":"\u003cp>We believe Truth Be Told is the space where Black, Indigenous and people of color can talk to each other about identity and find wisdom within our own communities. We get questions from our listeners all the time, but we can't answer them all in our podcast. So we are trying something new by introducing “Conversations with Wise Ones.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>You may have noticed on the show that we consistently say therapy is the answer to many of our listener questions. Now, we want to break it down a bit, specifically, how to find a therapist, how therapy sessions work, and when it’s time to close out of Instagram and find a therapist to support you.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>We talked with \u003ca href=\"https://www.instagram.com/sahajkohli/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Sahaj Kohli\u003c/a>, founder of \u003ca href=\"https://www.instagram.com/browngirltherapy/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Brown Girl Therapy\u003c/a>, the largest wellness and mental health community created for first- and second-generation immigrants. Brown Girl Therapy began as a passion project while Kohli was working full time as a journalist, and now, it has grown into a newsletter, conversations clubs, gatherings and workshops that Sahaj creates and facilitates herself. Kohli is also a therapist-in-training at George Washington University. She joined Truth Be Told engagement producer, Isabeth Mendoza, for a conversation on the difference between scrolling to find coping skills versus seeing a therapist, and how to navigate the search process.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>This interview has been edited and condensed for clarity. Resources mentioned for multiculturally competent and affirming therapy are \u003ca href=\"https://openpathcollective.org/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Open Path Collective\u003c/a>, \u003ca href=\"https://www.asianmhc.org/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Asian Mental Health Collective\u003c/a>, \u003ca href=\"https://www.inclusivetherapists.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Inclusive Therapists\u003c/a> and \u003ca href=\"https://www.nqttcn.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">National Queer and Trans Therapists of Color Network\u003c/a>. \u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Isabeth Mendoza: How did you figure out you needed therapy and how did you find a good fit? \u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sahaj Kohli:\u003c/strong> When I was in college, which was over a decade ago, I saw my college counselor because therapy is free and accessible on college campuses. So it was one of those things where I was like, ‘Why not? You know what? What do I have to lose?’ As a South Asian, and a child of immigrants, I grew up in a family where we were really enmeshed, and I was always expected to put my family first, even if I had other plans. So going to counseling in college, during my formative years and even just for a few sessions, really helped me self-actualize that I am an individual outside of my family.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The second time I pursued therapy was after I experienced something traumatic in my early 20s. I was living at home, and I was not in a good place and my parents were as supportive as they knew how to be (which is something I was only able to acknowledge years later). But I knew that I needed professional help and that was really new for them. They immediately saw it as something that was a reflection of their parenting or something that they did wrong and can fix on their own. So a lot of that process was trying to help them understand that what I was going through had nothing to do with them and is not a reflection of them failing me. Unfortunately, it didn't really end with me getting the help I needed at that time. Thankfully, I had a solid support system outside of my family that allowed me to begin the healing journey.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>When I moved to New York a few years later, that's actually when I sought therapy for myself. Again, at that point, I was privileged enough to be financially independent, to be physically away from my family, and to be able to make these decisions for myself. I initially found my therapist through a referral from a friend’s therapist because she specialized in trauma.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>It never really crossed my mind that maybe I should consider looking for someone who understood my upbringing or shared background with me or anything else. I looked at it the way a lot of people seem to look at therapy, which is, this is a health professional.\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>They should know how to work with me no matter what. I got lucky and worked with my therapist for three years.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>I got really lucky. My therapist was really helpful, and I was with her for three years. It was a really good experience for me in self-actualizing and learning to explore my own emotional needs, my own relationship struggles, my own everything.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>While we ended therapy for other reasons — I felt ready and was in a season of change — there did come a point near the end of my therapy with her (she was a white woman) where I did start to feel like there was a little bit of judgment and a little bit of misunderstanding about my culture. I would always write it off because at that point it had been a few years and she had helped me so much. But now, looking back, I think that that is what is one of the biggest fears for Asian Americans and South Asians and people of color: ‘Why go to someone who will probably never be able to relate to my experiences and who will probably judge me or shame me for them?’\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>It's a very real fear. And that's why I think the process of looking for a therapist is really important. It's really important to be intentional, to be really curious, and to remember that that process is as much about you getting to know the therapist as it is them getting to know you.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Mendoza: What advice would you share with a listener who’s question is: \u003cem>How do you even start looking for and finding the right therapist? We are all unique hybrids and we share our parents' past and traumas whether we like it or not.\u003c/em>\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kohli:\u003c/strong> Unfortunately, finding a therapist is a daunting process. Still, I am a strong believer that therapy can be useful for everyone when you find the right fit. Therapy can be utilized for dealing and healing from trauma, but also it can be used to be a personal development tool. For Asian Americans, especially children of immigrants, a therapist is a great way to learn and build the toolkit for effective communication in relationships, boundary setting, navigating our identity struggles, navigating our learned behaviors and mindsets that might be a product of intergenerational trauma passed down from generations before us, and ultimately exploring the agency that we do have within the systems that we live in and work in and love.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Get Clear on Your 'Why'\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The first thing people really need to consider before seeking therapy is getting clear on why:\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>Why do you want to go to therapy?\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>What are you hoping to gain from it?\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>What are your current struggles that you are hoping to manage after you've been in therapy, say, every week for six months?\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>What is the goal?\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\u003cp>I think it's important to get clear on the why because if you don't know why, it will be really hard to find the right fit. If you can confidently speak to what your needs are, it'll be that much more helpful in finding someone who can help you with those specific needs.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Get Clarity on What It Looks Like\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>I think it's also important for people to view finding a therapist as a contractual agreement. You're looking for a professional to provide services for you. So the consultation and the first few sessions are as much about you getting to know the therapist as it is about them getting to know you. During the consultation, ask what therapy looks like in the room with them. This will give you an idea of their approach. Every therapist does therapy in different ways. Some therapists might be really engaged, talkative, give you homework, be action-oriented and be more directive. Whereas other therapists may be more passive, not ask that many questions or might focus just on your past and not your future or present.\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>If you know that you are someone who wants to go to therapy and wants to be given homework between sessions, you want it to be really collaborative, then you can say that. The therapist will say that is or is not how they practice therapy.\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>If you’re someone who isn’t sure what you need, tell them that, too!\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>It's really important to bring forth all of your fears, or anxieties, or reservations because you can learn a lot about the therapist by how they engage with you about these concerns and questions.\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\u003cp>Statistically, the number one indicator of success in therapy is the relationship between the therapist and client. So, it’s very important that you are comfortable with your therapist. For folks who might have not had a positive experience in therapy before or maybe they had their first consultation call that didn't really go well, I want to say I'm sorry you didn't have a good experience. I do encourage people to keep trying. It is like dating in that way. You're going to find people who you might click with just for a few sessions and then it doesn't feel right anymore. You might find someone that on the first consultation call, you just didn't get a good feeling. Trust your gut. Trust your instinct.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>If you don't feel comfortable with someone you're not going to want to put in the work that goes into healing and growth with that person. And that's just going to be a waste of your time and theirs.\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>When you do find that therapist who feels right for you right now, it really is life-changing. I don't say that lightly. I personally have experienced that. I don't think that the therapist I saw when I was in New York would be a good fit for me right now. But at the time, it was the perfect fit and it was life-changing for me.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Side note: When you're looking at therapist databases don't be scared to look at credentials. There are licensed clinical social workers, licensed professional counselors, marriage and family therapists. And there are therapists with a Psy. D, which is a doctorate in psychology, Ph.D., which is a doctorate in philosophy, or an MD, which would be a psychiatrist who can prescribe medication. You want to make sure that you're seeing someone who is licensed. I think databases do a good job of screening for that, but I think it's important because you want someone who has gone through extensive years of training and supervision and is studied in identifying patterns, dealing with mental health issues or specializes in what you’re looking for. On that note, I think a lot of people actually benefit from supplementing therapy with another type of healing, like coaching or \u003ca href=\"https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/integrative_medicine_digestive_center/services/reiki.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Reiki\u003c/a>. There is never one way to get the kind of help you want, but it's more of a matter of not feeling deceived by what you're looking for. If you're looking for a licensed therapist, then make sure that you're actually looking for a licensed therapist.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Break Down Your Own Stigmas\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Three of the big reasons that I hear people are hesitant to start therapy are the stigma in the community, the cost and questioning whether it is even for you because it doesn’t look like you. So the stigma is a societal and cultural issue that we just have to continuously deconstruct. And that happens by normalizing therapy and mental health care, and by talking about it just in the same way that we would talk about going to go see a doctor when we have the flu.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Cost is a very real factor and I think that it can be one of the biggest barriers to seeking therapy. I urge people to ask for sliding scales. Therapy is a product and it's a service that you are asking to hire someone for. Feel comfortable asking if they will offer sliding scales.\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>Ask about cost and sliding scales during the consultation process or try to find if it's available on the therapist's website.\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>If you have insurance, call to get a list of people in the network (this can also help narrow down the list)\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>You can also consider finding a new therapist — someone fresh out of graduate school or a clinic that may be a part of a graduate program where the cost can be more accessible.\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>Also, group therapy can be cheaper and you will work through a program with other people who share in your identity or struggle.\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\u003cp>And then lastly, I mentioned questioning whether it's even for you. I know firsthand how white the counseling and mental health spaces are. I've been in it from all sides — as someone who has seen a therapist for years and as someone who is studying to be a minority therapist AND someone who's actually looking for a therapist right now. As I said before, don't assume that your therapist will be more effective if they come from the same background as you, and it's really important not to rule anyone out because of that.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>All therapists should be curious about how your identity, culture and struggles affect you regardless of whether or not they share in them.\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>With that said, though, I know mental health care is such a personal, vulnerable, scary and stigmatized thing still, that a lot of people feel more comfortable when they know that the person helping them or the person that they're about to share their deepest secrets or vulnerabilities to can relate in some way.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Have a candid conversation during the consultation process. Some questions you can ask are:\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>How does multiculturalism inform your practice?\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>Have you ever worked with someone from my background?\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>In what ways have you done your own identity work?\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\u003cp>I think in a lot of Eastern cultures and communities where collectivism is a big part of the belief system, seeking therapy can be seen as a failure, whether it's you failing to help yourself or your parents' community failing to help you. It's important for Asian Americans and our communities to deconstruct these beliefs and reconstruct them as therapy not being something to be ashamed of.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>Trying to be the best version of yourself is not wrong. Seeking support for something that is hard for you is not wrong.\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>Therapy essentially nurtures a person's sense of self-help and self-actualization. And this does not mean that you don't care about your community or are selfish. It just means that you want to be better in touch with who you are.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The Western style of therapy is called individual therapy, and it’s not always aligned with the values people from Eastern cultures hold. They may urge you to individuate from your family unit, to set harsher boundaries than you're comfortable with. And that's a part of the process of looking and finding the right therapist, because there will be therapists out there who will take your culture into consideration, who will be curious about what finding an agency looks like for you within the system that you live in, and there will be therapists who don’t get it sadly.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Mendoza: I'm seeing in my social media normalization of talking about trauma. How do you figure out when the practices and rituals are no longer serving you and it’s time to consider therapy?\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kohli:\u003c/strong> That’s a very valid question. It’s easy to get inundated on social media, especially with therapists on Instagram sharing all of these tips and techniques and things to consider.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>I'm a therapist-in-training, but even on Brown Girl Therapy, I try to provide resources and reflections for folks to be able to engage in this healing work on their own. A part of that, at least for me, is because mental health isn't totally accessible to everyone. I think these resources can be really great for trying to do the work on your own.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>But social media and Google are not a replacement for therapy, nor is information on these platforms individualized enough to be prescribed advice for people following them.\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>The actual act of having that release, building that rapport or that relationship with a professional who is trained in this work is very different. You can find all the coping skills on the internet. But when you're seeing an actual therapist, you're learning much more than just the coping skills. You're learning about where your behaviors stem from, where they're rooted, how you could change your perspective on certain things, how you can live more and show up more authentically in different relationships, and why certain relationships are harder for you than others. It's just not the same thing.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Mendoza: Do you have suggested language for folks to use when they're in a session and may feel like they need to advocate for themselves?\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kohli:\u003c/strong> I encourage people to feel comfortable speaking up when something doesn't feel right, especially immediately in the session. If a therapist says something that made you feel bad in the moment or felt shamed (even if you have been working with them for a long time) it's important to be communicative in the moment because that's the only way to really repair that. Also remember that 1. Therapists are human and 2. A lot of the ways we engage with our therapist can reflect how we engage with the outside world, so use that relationship as a practice ground to speak up and advocate for yourself!\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>I also want to remind you that you are paying someone to provide services and if you don't feel like the services that you're getting are useful or helpful to you, you deserve to bring that up. So you can say, “Hey, I just want to take a second because you said X, and that made me feel Y and I don't feel good about that. Can we talk about it?”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>You could wait until after the session and send an email, which I have done before. I don't like to bring stuff up in the moment face to face. And then my therapist had said that we can talk about it in the next session and I appreciated that she made room for it. The one thing you don't want to happen is you don't want to not say anything and then just bite your tongue and it becomes something that festers throughout. If you're not comfortable and find you don't have that trust and rapport with the therapist and then you're not going to get everything that you should be getting out of it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Mendoza: If it gets to a point where you feel as if you low-key need to break up with your therapist, how do you do that? \u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kohli: \u003c/strong>I was very nervous when I had to break up with mine. It's hard. People break up with therapists for different reasons, right? Either you feel like you don't need it anymore, which is totally OK, or you don't feel like it's a right fit anymore. There are other reasons, too, like inaccessibility, which I think are easier because you can point to something and say, like, I can't access this anymore. But when it comes to the first two, it's OK if you got such a good experience out of it for six months and then realized you don't feel good in this relationship anymore.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>It can be really scary because you've been so vulnerable and this person might know really deep things about you that maybe you haven't shared with anyone else. It can feel even harder because you're like, ‘Oh, I don't want to upset this person,’ or ‘I don't want them to feel bad.’ Your therapist should always support your journey. What we like to say in the mental health field is, as a therapist, we're trying to work ourselves out of a job.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But the whole point of seeing a therapist is so that the therapist can help you enough that you're not going to need to see a therapist anymore. And so when it's time to end your time with the therapist, it's OK if it brings up emotions — it's the end of a relationship. They should never make you feel like you're wrong. And if they do, then I think that says more about them as a therapist than it does about what it is you need at that moment.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>Sahaj Kohli, is a first-generation Indian American and founder of \u003ca href=\"https://www.instagram.com/browngirltherapy/?hl=en\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Brown Girl Therapy\u003c/a>. \u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad floatright]\u003c/p>\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":null,"status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1608229974,"stats":{"hasAudio":false,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":51,"wordCount":3549},"headData":{"title":"How to Do Therapy With Founder of Brown Girl Therapy, Sahaj Kohli | KQED Podcasts","description":"We believe Truth Be Told is the space where Black, Indigenous and people of color can talk to each other about identity and find wisdom within our own communities. We get questions from our listeners all the time, but we can't answer them all in our podcast. So we are trying something new by introducing","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":""},"disqusIdentifier":"778 https://ww2.kqed.org/podcasts/?p=778","disqusUrl":"https://ww2.kqed.org/podcasts/2020/12/17/how-to-do-therapy-with-sahaj-kohli/","disqusTitle":"How to Do Therapy With Founder of Brown Girl Therapy, Sahaj Kohli","source":"Truth Be Told","sourceUrl":"https://www.kqed.org/podcasts/truthbetold","nprByline":"Isabeth Mendoza","subhead":"Advice on how to find or how to break up with your therapist plus, the difference between scrolling for therapy versus being in it","path":"/podcasts/778/how-to-do-therapy-with-sahaj-kohli","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>We believe Truth Be Told is the space where Black, Indigenous and people of color can talk to each other about identity and find wisdom within our own communities. We get questions from our listeners all the time, but we can't answer them all in our podcast. So we are trying something new by introducing “Conversations with Wise Ones.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>You may have noticed on the show that we consistently say therapy is the answer to many of our listener questions. Now, we want to break it down a bit, specifically, how to find a therapist, how therapy sessions work, and when it’s time to close out of Instagram and find a therapist to support you.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>We talked with \u003ca href=\"https://www.instagram.com/sahajkohli/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Sahaj Kohli\u003c/a>, founder of \u003ca href=\"https://www.instagram.com/browngirltherapy/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Brown Girl Therapy\u003c/a>, the largest wellness and mental health community created for first- and second-generation immigrants. Brown Girl Therapy began as a passion project while Kohli was working full time as a journalist, and now, it has grown into a newsletter, conversations clubs, gatherings and workshops that Sahaj creates and facilitates herself. Kohli is also a therapist-in-training at George Washington University. She joined Truth Be Told engagement producer, Isabeth Mendoza, for a conversation on the difference between scrolling to find coping skills versus seeing a therapist, and how to navigate the search process.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>This interview has been edited and condensed for clarity. Resources mentioned for multiculturally competent and affirming therapy are \u003ca href=\"https://openpathcollective.org/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Open Path Collective\u003c/a>, \u003ca href=\"https://www.asianmhc.org/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Asian Mental Health Collective\u003c/a>, \u003ca href=\"https://www.inclusivetherapists.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Inclusive Therapists\u003c/a> and \u003ca href=\"https://www.nqttcn.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">National Queer and Trans Therapists of Color Network\u003c/a>. \u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Isabeth Mendoza: How did you figure out you needed therapy and how did you find a good fit? \u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sahaj Kohli:\u003c/strong> When I was in college, which was over a decade ago, I saw my college counselor because therapy is free and accessible on college campuses. So it was one of those things where I was like, ‘Why not? You know what? What do I have to lose?’ As a South Asian, and a child of immigrants, I grew up in a family where we were really enmeshed, and I was always expected to put my family first, even if I had other plans. So going to counseling in college, during my formative years and even just for a few sessions, really helped me self-actualize that I am an individual outside of my family.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The second time I pursued therapy was after I experienced something traumatic in my early 20s. I was living at home, and I was not in a good place and my parents were as supportive as they knew how to be (which is something I was only able to acknowledge years later). But I knew that I needed professional help and that was really new for them. They immediately saw it as something that was a reflection of their parenting or something that they did wrong and can fix on their own. So a lot of that process was trying to help them understand that what I was going through had nothing to do with them and is not a reflection of them failing me. Unfortunately, it didn't really end with me getting the help I needed at that time. Thankfully, I had a solid support system outside of my family that allowed me to begin the healing journey.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>When I moved to New York a few years later, that's actually when I sought therapy for myself. Again, at that point, I was privileged enough to be financially independent, to be physically away from my family, and to be able to make these decisions for myself. I initially found my therapist through a referral from a friend’s therapist because she specialized in trauma.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>It never really crossed my mind that maybe I should consider looking for someone who understood my upbringing or shared background with me or anything else. I looked at it the way a lot of people seem to look at therapy, which is, this is a health professional.\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>They should know how to work with me no matter what. I got lucky and worked with my therapist for three years.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>I got really lucky. My therapist was really helpful, and I was with her for three years. It was a really good experience for me in self-actualizing and learning to explore my own emotional needs, my own relationship struggles, my own everything.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>While we ended therapy for other reasons — I felt ready and was in a season of change — there did come a point near the end of my therapy with her (she was a white woman) where I did start to feel like there was a little bit of judgment and a little bit of misunderstanding about my culture. I would always write it off because at that point it had been a few years and she had helped me so much. But now, looking back, I think that that is what is one of the biggest fears for Asian Americans and South Asians and people of color: ‘Why go to someone who will probably never be able to relate to my experiences and who will probably judge me or shame me for them?’\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>It's a very real fear. And that's why I think the process of looking for a therapist is really important. It's really important to be intentional, to be really curious, and to remember that that process is as much about you getting to know the therapist as it is them getting to know you.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Mendoza: What advice would you share with a listener who’s question is: \u003cem>How do you even start looking for and finding the right therapist? We are all unique hybrids and we share our parents' past and traumas whether we like it or not.\u003c/em>\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kohli:\u003c/strong> Unfortunately, finding a therapist is a daunting process. Still, I am a strong believer that therapy can be useful for everyone when you find the right fit. Therapy can be utilized for dealing and healing from trauma, but also it can be used to be a personal development tool. For Asian Americans, especially children of immigrants, a therapist is a great way to learn and build the toolkit for effective communication in relationships, boundary setting, navigating our identity struggles, navigating our learned behaviors and mindsets that might be a product of intergenerational trauma passed down from generations before us, and ultimately exploring the agency that we do have within the systems that we live in and work in and love.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Get Clear on Your 'Why'\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The first thing people really need to consider before seeking therapy is getting clear on why:\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>Why do you want to go to therapy?\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>What are you hoping to gain from it?\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>What are your current struggles that you are hoping to manage after you've been in therapy, say, every week for six months?\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>What is the goal?\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\u003cp>I think it's important to get clear on the why because if you don't know why, it will be really hard to find the right fit. If you can confidently speak to what your needs are, it'll be that much more helpful in finding someone who can help you with those specific needs.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Get Clarity on What It Looks Like\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>I think it's also important for people to view finding a therapist as a contractual agreement. You're looking for a professional to provide services for you. So the consultation and the first few sessions are as much about you getting to know the therapist as it is about them getting to know you. During the consultation, ask what therapy looks like in the room with them. This will give you an idea of their approach. Every therapist does therapy in different ways. Some therapists might be really engaged, talkative, give you homework, be action-oriented and be more directive. Whereas other therapists may be more passive, not ask that many questions or might focus just on your past and not your future or present.\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>If you know that you are someone who wants to go to therapy and wants to be given homework between sessions, you want it to be really collaborative, then you can say that. The therapist will say that is or is not how they practice therapy.\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>If you’re someone who isn’t sure what you need, tell them that, too!\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>It's really important to bring forth all of your fears, or anxieties, or reservations because you can learn a lot about the therapist by how they engage with you about these concerns and questions.\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\u003cp>Statistically, the number one indicator of success in therapy is the relationship between the therapist and client. So, it’s very important that you are comfortable with your therapist. For folks who might have not had a positive experience in therapy before or maybe they had their first consultation call that didn't really go well, I want to say I'm sorry you didn't have a good experience. I do encourage people to keep trying. It is like dating in that way. You're going to find people who you might click with just for a few sessions and then it doesn't feel right anymore. You might find someone that on the first consultation call, you just didn't get a good feeling. Trust your gut. Trust your instinct.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>If you don't feel comfortable with someone you're not going to want to put in the work that goes into healing and growth with that person. And that's just going to be a waste of your time and theirs.\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>When you do find that therapist who feels right for you right now, it really is life-changing. I don't say that lightly. I personally have experienced that. I don't think that the therapist I saw when I was in New York would be a good fit for me right now. But at the time, it was the perfect fit and it was life-changing for me.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Side note: When you're looking at therapist databases don't be scared to look at credentials. There are licensed clinical social workers, licensed professional counselors, marriage and family therapists. And there are therapists with a Psy. D, which is a doctorate in psychology, Ph.D., which is a doctorate in philosophy, or an MD, which would be a psychiatrist who can prescribe medication. You want to make sure that you're seeing someone who is licensed. I think databases do a good job of screening for that, but I think it's important because you want someone who has gone through extensive years of training and supervision and is studied in identifying patterns, dealing with mental health issues or specializes in what you’re looking for. On that note, I think a lot of people actually benefit from supplementing therapy with another type of healing, like coaching or \u003ca href=\"https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/integrative_medicine_digestive_center/services/reiki.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Reiki\u003c/a>. There is never one way to get the kind of help you want, but it's more of a matter of not feeling deceived by what you're looking for. If you're looking for a licensed therapist, then make sure that you're actually looking for a licensed therapist.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Break Down Your Own Stigmas\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Three of the big reasons that I hear people are hesitant to start therapy are the stigma in the community, the cost and questioning whether it is even for you because it doesn’t look like you. So the stigma is a societal and cultural issue that we just have to continuously deconstruct. And that happens by normalizing therapy and mental health care, and by talking about it just in the same way that we would talk about going to go see a doctor when we have the flu.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Cost is a very real factor and I think that it can be one of the biggest barriers to seeking therapy. I urge people to ask for sliding scales. Therapy is a product and it's a service that you are asking to hire someone for. Feel comfortable asking if they will offer sliding scales.\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>Ask about cost and sliding scales during the consultation process or try to find if it's available on the therapist's website.\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>If you have insurance, call to get a list of people in the network (this can also help narrow down the list)\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>You can also consider finding a new therapist — someone fresh out of graduate school or a clinic that may be a part of a graduate program where the cost can be more accessible.\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>Also, group therapy can be cheaper and you will work through a program with other people who share in your identity or struggle.\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\u003cp>And then lastly, I mentioned questioning whether it's even for you. I know firsthand how white the counseling and mental health spaces are. I've been in it from all sides — as someone who has seen a therapist for years and as someone who is studying to be a minority therapist AND someone who's actually looking for a therapist right now. As I said before, don't assume that your therapist will be more effective if they come from the same background as you, and it's really important not to rule anyone out because of that.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>All therapists should be curious about how your identity, culture and struggles affect you regardless of whether or not they share in them.\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>With that said, though, I know mental health care is such a personal, vulnerable, scary and stigmatized thing still, that a lot of people feel more comfortable when they know that the person helping them or the person that they're about to share their deepest secrets or vulnerabilities to can relate in some way.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Have a candid conversation during the consultation process. Some questions you can ask are:\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>How does multiculturalism inform your practice?\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>Have you ever worked with someone from my background?\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>In what ways have you done your own identity work?\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\u003cp>I think in a lot of Eastern cultures and communities where collectivism is a big part of the belief system, seeking therapy can be seen as a failure, whether it's you failing to help yourself or your parents' community failing to help you. It's important for Asian Americans and our communities to deconstruct these beliefs and reconstruct them as therapy not being something to be ashamed of.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>Trying to be the best version of yourself is not wrong. Seeking support for something that is hard for you is not wrong.\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>Therapy essentially nurtures a person's sense of self-help and self-actualization. And this does not mean that you don't care about your community or are selfish. It just means that you want to be better in touch with who you are.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The Western style of therapy is called individual therapy, and it’s not always aligned with the values people from Eastern cultures hold. They may urge you to individuate from your family unit, to set harsher boundaries than you're comfortable with. And that's a part of the process of looking and finding the right therapist, because there will be therapists out there who will take your culture into consideration, who will be curious about what finding an agency looks like for you within the system that you live in, and there will be therapists who don’t get it sadly.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Mendoza: I'm seeing in my social media normalization of talking about trauma. How do you figure out when the practices and rituals are no longer serving you and it’s time to consider therapy?\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kohli:\u003c/strong> That’s a very valid question. It’s easy to get inundated on social media, especially with therapists on Instagram sharing all of these tips and techniques and things to consider.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>I'm a therapist-in-training, but even on Brown Girl Therapy, I try to provide resources and reflections for folks to be able to engage in this healing work on their own. A part of that, at least for me, is because mental health isn't totally accessible to everyone. I think these resources can be really great for trying to do the work on your own.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>But social media and Google are not a replacement for therapy, nor is information on these platforms individualized enough to be prescribed advice for people following them.\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>The actual act of having that release, building that rapport or that relationship with a professional who is trained in this work is very different. You can find all the coping skills on the internet. But when you're seeing an actual therapist, you're learning much more than just the coping skills. You're learning about where your behaviors stem from, where they're rooted, how you could change your perspective on certain things, how you can live more and show up more authentically in different relationships, and why certain relationships are harder for you than others. It's just not the same thing.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Mendoza: Do you have suggested language for folks to use when they're in a session and may feel like they need to advocate for themselves?\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kohli:\u003c/strong> I encourage people to feel comfortable speaking up when something doesn't feel right, especially immediately in the session. If a therapist says something that made you feel bad in the moment or felt shamed (even if you have been working with them for a long time) it's important to be communicative in the moment because that's the only way to really repair that. Also remember that 1. Therapists are human and 2. A lot of the ways we engage with our therapist can reflect how we engage with the outside world, so use that relationship as a practice ground to speak up and advocate for yourself!\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>I also want to remind you that you are paying someone to provide services and if you don't feel like the services that you're getting are useful or helpful to you, you deserve to bring that up. So you can say, “Hey, I just want to take a second because you said X, and that made me feel Y and I don't feel good about that. Can we talk about it?”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>You could wait until after the session and send an email, which I have done before. I don't like to bring stuff up in the moment face to face. And then my therapist had said that we can talk about it in the next session and I appreciated that she made room for it. The one thing you don't want to happen is you don't want to not say anything and then just bite your tongue and it becomes something that festers throughout. If you're not comfortable and find you don't have that trust and rapport with the therapist and then you're not going to get everything that you should be getting out of it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Mendoza: If it gets to a point where you feel as if you low-key need to break up with your therapist, how do you do that? \u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kohli: \u003c/strong>I was very nervous when I had to break up with mine. It's hard. People break up with therapists for different reasons, right? Either you feel like you don't need it anymore, which is totally OK, or you don't feel like it's a right fit anymore. There are other reasons, too, like inaccessibility, which I think are easier because you can point to something and say, like, I can't access this anymore. But when it comes to the first two, it's OK if you got such a good experience out of it for six months and then realized you don't feel good in this relationship anymore.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>It can be really scary because you've been so vulnerable and this person might know really deep things about you that maybe you haven't shared with anyone else. It can feel even harder because you're like, ‘Oh, I don't want to upset this person,’ or ‘I don't want them to feel bad.’ Your therapist should always support your journey. What we like to say in the mental health field is, as a therapist, we're trying to work ourselves out of a job.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But the whole point of seeing a therapist is so that the therapist can help you enough that you're not going to need to see a therapist anymore. And so when it's time to end your time with the therapist, it's OK if it brings up emotions — it's the end of a relationship. They should never make you feel like you're wrong. And if they do, then I think that says more about them as a therapist than it does about what it is you need at that moment.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>Sahaj Kohli, is a first-generation Indian American and founder of \u003ca href=\"https://www.instagram.com/browngirltherapy/?hl=en\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Brown Girl Therapy\u003c/a>. \u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"floatright"},"numeric":["floatright"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/podcasts/778/how-to-do-therapy-with-sahaj-kohli","authors":["byline_podcasts_778"],"programs":["podcasts_2"],"categories":["podcasts_1"],"tags":["podcasts_312","podcasts_99","podcasts_311","podcasts_95","podcasts_122"],"featImg":"podcasts_785","label":"source_podcasts_778"},"podcasts_760":{"type":"posts","id":"podcasts_760","meta":{"index":"posts_1591205157","site":"podcasts","id":"760","score":null,"sort":[1605772904000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"pain-and-purpose-lessons-from-bruce-lee-and-frida-kahlo","title":"Pain and Purpose: Lessons From Bruce Lee and Frida Kahlo","publishDate":1605772904,"format":"aside","headTitle":"Truth Be Told | KQED Podcasts | KQED","labelTerm":{},"content":"\u003cp>\u003cimg class=\"size-medium wp-image-572 alignleft\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/77/2020/11/Tarot-Card-Season2_Episode-19-v2-KH.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"400\">\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The days are shorter and colder, and like you, we’re looking for inspiration to sustain us through winter. For our last episode of the season we talk with two authors who are passing on the wisdom of the great icons \u003ca href=\"https://brucelee.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Bruce Lee\u003c/a> and \u003ca href=\"https://www.fridakahlo.org/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Frida Kahlo\u003c/a> to teach us what we’re capable of. \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/ariannagdavis?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Arianna Davis\u003c/a> is the author of “\u003ca href=\"https://www.indiebound.org/book/9781541646322\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">What Would Frida Do? A Guide to Living Boldly\u003c/a>,” the digital director of Oprah Magazine and a self-proclaimed \u003cem>\u003ca href=\"https://www.sun-sentinel.com/barrio-logan-celebrates-artist-frida-kahlos-112th-birthday-story.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Friducha\u003c/a>\u003c/em>. Images of Frida Kahlo have been heavily commercialized, but Davis believes there is much to learn from her that can inspire us in 2020.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The book is not meant to be a blueprint of how to live your life,” Davis says. “There's definitely a lot of decisions that I wouldn't necessarily agree with, but I think we can read about her story, the decisions she made, the way she lived her life so fiercely for inspiration on how we can also live our own lives boldly and fiercely.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Kahlo is \u003ca href=\"https://www.fridakahlo.org/frida-kahlo-biography.jsp\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">considered\u003c/a> to be one of Mexico’s greatest artists. She contracted polio at the age of 6, which caused her right leg and foot to grow much thinner than her left one. As a result, she wore long skirts her entire life. In high school, she suffered a trolley accident that fractured her spine and pelvis. She was hospitalized for weeks and had to wear a full-body cast for months. Later, she would not be able to bear children with her husband and painter, Diego Rivera. She and Diego had a tumultuous marriage that, coupled with ongoing physical ailments, caused her depression. One week after her 47th birthday, Frida died of a pulmonary embolism.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Davis was hesitant in writing a book about such a big icon. “Even though I am Latina, I'm Puerto Rican and Black — I'm not Mexican. And so I had that moment of asking myself, ‘Are you really the right person to tell the story? Should this be a Mexican writer that writes it instead, especially after all the \u003ca href=\"https://www.vulture.com/article/american-dirt-book-controversy-explained.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">'American Dirt'\u003c/a> drama?' \"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But for Davis, Frida is a shared icon for all Latinx people, and so she made sure to do as much research when writing the book, including traveling to Mexico City where Frida was born and raised.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>“I'm Black and Puerto Rican and growing up as a Latina, I think Frida is one of those icons, one of those faces that you just know of. She overcame so many obstacles while being proudly feminist, being proudly Mexican, being proudly queer. And this was all in the 1920s and '30s. So for me, seeing the Frida movie and learning more about her story really sparked this fascination that kind of eventually became an obsession.”\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>The biggest lesson Davis has walked away with is one of Frida’s famous phrases, “Viva la Vida,” which means live your life or long live life. Davis feels Frida knew the end was near after Frida’s leg was amputated. Then Frida painted watermelons with a message — Viva la Vida. Davis gets goosebumps every time she remembers this phrase.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"The fact that she had every obstacle you could possibly think of in the end, she still had this positive outlook of you need to live your life and live it to the fullest,” says Davis.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Another iconic figure that worked through his own pain to build a legacy and impart life lessons that still resonate today is \u003ca href=\"https://brucelee.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Bruce Lee\u003c/a>. His daughter Shannon Lee joined host Tonya Mosley to talk about her new book “\u003ca href=\"https://www.indiebound.org/book/9781250206688\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Be Water My Friend: The Teachings of Bruce Lee.\u003c/a>” Before Bruce Lee, modern society did not \u003ca href=\"https://blackbeltmag.com/the-bruce-lee-effect\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">combine philosophy and art with sport\u003c/a>. That is part of what makes Bruce Lee iconic — and like Frida Kahlo — a timeless figure that we are continually learning from decades after their deaths.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Shannon was only 4 years old when her father died, and now she is the “keeper of the flame” running the family business and keeping his legacy alive. She’s heard many stories about her father through the lens of others and family members.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Everybody has sort of this picture of him, and look, we all romanticize who we think our parents are when we're young,” says Shannon. “It's not to say that I haven't done that at points in my life. But because of the purity of my sense of him, I'm able to look at him and go, ‘Oh, yeah, I see. That's where he was, being a real human being.’ ”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In order for Shannon to write this book, she had to work through the loss of her father, the loss of her brother, and her own feelings of fear and paralysis around being Bruce Lee’s daughter.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I'm a seeker similar to him, so he and I meet in that way,” says Shannon. “It took me time to get to a place where I'd been looking after his legacy for long enough that I was starting to feel confident that I was maturing as a human being, learning from my mistakes, gaining more confidence that I was sitting for longer and longer periods of time, breaking down his philosophies, applying them to him, to myself, that it finally the time was just right.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>Bruce Lee: “Empty your mind, be formless, shapeless. Like water. Now you put water into a cup, it becomes the cup. You put water into a bottle, it becomes the bottle. You put in a teapot, it becomes the teapot. Water can flow or it can crash. Be water, my friend.”\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>Similar to Frida Kahlo’s famous phrase, Bruce Lee is known for “Be Water My Friend,” a concept behind the notion of being like water. Shannon calls this the “water way.” “Water is essential, to life, to growth. It's essential in and of itself, she says. “And so for me, that speaks to the idea of returning to my own essential nature, discovering what that is and trying as best as possible to live.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bruce Lee severely injured his back in early 1970 and was told that he may never walk normally again, let alone do martial arts. He lived the rest of his life with back pain that he had to care for in order to live the life he wanted, in order to accomplish the things he wanted to accomplish, and be the heroic character we watched in his films. The lesson, says Shannon, is that “if we can make friends with discomfort, if we can lean into a little bit of discomfort, then we can accomplish more than we thought we could.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>For Shannon, she wrote this book because she wants people to know the depth of her father's teachings. “But more importantly,” she says, “I have been so healed and inspired and motivated by these philosophical teachings; and that I know that they can be useful and helpful, and help to soothe people's souls and also give them some tools that they can craft practices for themselves. I'm not here to tell anyone, this is how you do it. Full stop. I'm just here to say here are some things that have worked for Bruce Lee. Here some things that have worked for me. And I hope you discover what works for you.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Episode transcript \u003ca href=\"http://shorturl.at/ryzAR\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">\u003cstrong>here\u003c/strong>\u003c/a>. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Episode Guests:\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/ariannagdavis?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Arianna Davis\u003c/a>, writer, digital director of \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/OprahMagazine\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Oprah Magazine\u003c/a>, author of “\u003ca href=\"https://www.indiebound.org/book/9781541646322\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">What Would Frida Do? A Guide to Living Boldly\u003c/a>”\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>Shannon Lee, author of “\u003ca href=\"https://www.indiebound.org/book/9781250206688\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Be Water, My Friend: The Teachings of Bruce Lee\u003c/a>”\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>Kahran and Regis Bethencourt, founders of \u003ca href=\"http://creativesoulphoto.com/about/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">CreativeSoul Photography\u003c/a>, authors of “\u003ca href=\"http://creativesoulphoto.com/glory/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">GLORY: Magical Visions of Black Beauty\u003c/a>”\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Reading:\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/arts/13877670/11-transformative-reads-for-solace-and-solitude\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">11 Transformative Reads for Solace and Solitude\u003c/a> from KQED Arts\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/shelf/show/life-lessons\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Life Lessons Books\u003c/a> from Goodreads\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/list/tag/life-changing\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Listopia of life Changing Books\u003c/a> from Goodreads\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\u003cp>[ad floatright]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Listening:\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://news.artnet.com/the-art-angle/art-angle-podcast-frida-kahlo-1917547\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">How Frida Kahlo Can Change Your Life (for Better or Worse)\u003c/a> from Artnet News\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/35-what-would-frida-do-a-conversation-with-arianna-davis/id1501845212?i=1000496628863\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">What Would Frida Do?: A conversation with Arianna Davis\u003c/a> from LatinEQUIS\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/bruce-lee-podcast/id1134673435\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Bruce Lee Podcast\u003c/a> hosted by Shannon Lee\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":null,"status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1606155847,"stats":{"hasAudio":false,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":24,"wordCount":1407},"headData":{"title":"Pain and Purpose: Lessons From Bruce Lee and Frida Kahlo | KQED Podcasts","description":"The days are shorter and colder, and like you, we’re looking for inspiration to sustain us through winter. For our last episode of the season we talk with two authors who are passing on the wisdom of the great icons Bruce Lee and Frida Kahlo to teach us what we’re capable of. Arianna Davis is","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":""},"disqusIdentifier":"760 https://ww2.kqed.org/podcasts/?p=760","disqusUrl":"https://ww2.kqed.org/podcasts/2020/11/19/pain-and-purpose-lessons-from-bruce-lee-and-frida-kahlo/","disqusTitle":"Pain and Purpose: Lessons From Bruce Lee and Frida Kahlo","source":"Truth Be Told","sourceUrl":"https://www.kqed.org/podcasts/truthbetold","audioUrl":"https://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/traffic.megaphone.fm/KQINC1222447658.mp3","nprByline":"Truth Be Told team","path":"/podcasts/760/pain-and-purpose-lessons-from-bruce-lee-and-frida-kahlo","audioDuration":2276000,"audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003cimg class=\"size-medium wp-image-572 alignleft\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/77/2020/11/Tarot-Card-Season2_Episode-19-v2-KH.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"400\">\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The days are shorter and colder, and like you, we’re looking for inspiration to sustain us through winter. For our last episode of the season we talk with two authors who are passing on the wisdom of the great icons \u003ca href=\"https://brucelee.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Bruce Lee\u003c/a> and \u003ca href=\"https://www.fridakahlo.org/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Frida Kahlo\u003c/a> to teach us what we’re capable of. \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/ariannagdavis?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Arianna Davis\u003c/a> is the author of “\u003ca href=\"https://www.indiebound.org/book/9781541646322\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">What Would Frida Do? A Guide to Living Boldly\u003c/a>,” the digital director of Oprah Magazine and a self-proclaimed \u003cem>\u003ca href=\"https://www.sun-sentinel.com/barrio-logan-celebrates-artist-frida-kahlos-112th-birthday-story.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Friducha\u003c/a>\u003c/em>. Images of Frida Kahlo have been heavily commercialized, but Davis believes there is much to learn from her that can inspire us in 2020.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The book is not meant to be a blueprint of how to live your life,” Davis says. “There's definitely a lot of decisions that I wouldn't necessarily agree with, but I think we can read about her story, the decisions she made, the way she lived her life so fiercely for inspiration on how we can also live our own lives boldly and fiercely.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Kahlo is \u003ca href=\"https://www.fridakahlo.org/frida-kahlo-biography.jsp\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">considered\u003c/a> to be one of Mexico’s greatest artists. She contracted polio at the age of 6, which caused her right leg and foot to grow much thinner than her left one. As a result, she wore long skirts her entire life. In high school, she suffered a trolley accident that fractured her spine and pelvis. She was hospitalized for weeks and had to wear a full-body cast for months. Later, she would not be able to bear children with her husband and painter, Diego Rivera. She and Diego had a tumultuous marriage that, coupled with ongoing physical ailments, caused her depression. One week after her 47th birthday, Frida died of a pulmonary embolism.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Davis was hesitant in writing a book about such a big icon. “Even though I am Latina, I'm Puerto Rican and Black — I'm not Mexican. And so I had that moment of asking myself, ‘Are you really the right person to tell the story? Should this be a Mexican writer that writes it instead, especially after all the \u003ca href=\"https://www.vulture.com/article/american-dirt-book-controversy-explained.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">'American Dirt'\u003c/a> drama?' \"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But for Davis, Frida is a shared icon for all Latinx people, and so she made sure to do as much research when writing the book, including traveling to Mexico City where Frida was born and raised.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>“I'm Black and Puerto Rican and growing up as a Latina, I think Frida is one of those icons, one of those faces that you just know of. She overcame so many obstacles while being proudly feminist, being proudly Mexican, being proudly queer. And this was all in the 1920s and '30s. So for me, seeing the Frida movie and learning more about her story really sparked this fascination that kind of eventually became an obsession.”\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>The biggest lesson Davis has walked away with is one of Frida’s famous phrases, “Viva la Vida,” which means live your life or long live life. Davis feels Frida knew the end was near after Frida’s leg was amputated. Then Frida painted watermelons with a message — Viva la Vida. Davis gets goosebumps every time she remembers this phrase.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"The fact that she had every obstacle you could possibly think of in the end, she still had this positive outlook of you need to live your life and live it to the fullest,” says Davis.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Another iconic figure that worked through his own pain to build a legacy and impart life lessons that still resonate today is \u003ca href=\"https://brucelee.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Bruce Lee\u003c/a>. His daughter Shannon Lee joined host Tonya Mosley to talk about her new book “\u003ca href=\"https://www.indiebound.org/book/9781250206688\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Be Water My Friend: The Teachings of Bruce Lee.\u003c/a>” Before Bruce Lee, modern society did not \u003ca href=\"https://blackbeltmag.com/the-bruce-lee-effect\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">combine philosophy and art with sport\u003c/a>. That is part of what makes Bruce Lee iconic — and like Frida Kahlo — a timeless figure that we are continually learning from decades after their deaths.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Shannon was only 4 years old when her father died, and now she is the “keeper of the flame” running the family business and keeping his legacy alive. She’s heard many stories about her father through the lens of others and family members.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Everybody has sort of this picture of him, and look, we all romanticize who we think our parents are when we're young,” says Shannon. “It's not to say that I haven't done that at points in my life. But because of the purity of my sense of him, I'm able to look at him and go, ‘Oh, yeah, I see. That's where he was, being a real human being.’ ”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In order for Shannon to write this book, she had to work through the loss of her father, the loss of her brother, and her own feelings of fear and paralysis around being Bruce Lee’s daughter.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I'm a seeker similar to him, so he and I meet in that way,” says Shannon. “It took me time to get to a place where I'd been looking after his legacy for long enough that I was starting to feel confident that I was maturing as a human being, learning from my mistakes, gaining more confidence that I was sitting for longer and longer periods of time, breaking down his philosophies, applying them to him, to myself, that it finally the time was just right.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>Bruce Lee: “Empty your mind, be formless, shapeless. Like water. Now you put water into a cup, it becomes the cup. You put water into a bottle, it becomes the bottle. You put in a teapot, it becomes the teapot. Water can flow or it can crash. Be water, my friend.”\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>Similar to Frida Kahlo’s famous phrase, Bruce Lee is known for “Be Water My Friend,” a concept behind the notion of being like water. Shannon calls this the “water way.” “Water is essential, to life, to growth. It's essential in and of itself, she says. “And so for me, that speaks to the idea of returning to my own essential nature, discovering what that is and trying as best as possible to live.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bruce Lee severely injured his back in early 1970 and was told that he may never walk normally again, let alone do martial arts. He lived the rest of his life with back pain that he had to care for in order to live the life he wanted, in order to accomplish the things he wanted to accomplish, and be the heroic character we watched in his films. The lesson, says Shannon, is that “if we can make friends with discomfort, if we can lean into a little bit of discomfort, then we can accomplish more than we thought we could.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>For Shannon, she wrote this book because she wants people to know the depth of her father's teachings. “But more importantly,” she says, “I have been so healed and inspired and motivated by these philosophical teachings; and that I know that they can be useful and helpful, and help to soothe people's souls and also give them some tools that they can craft practices for themselves. I'm not here to tell anyone, this is how you do it. Full stop. I'm just here to say here are some things that have worked for Bruce Lee. Here some things that have worked for me. And I hope you discover what works for you.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Episode transcript \u003ca href=\"http://shorturl.at/ryzAR\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">\u003cstrong>here\u003c/strong>\u003c/a>. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Episode Guests:\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/ariannagdavis?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Arianna Davis\u003c/a>, writer, digital director of \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/OprahMagazine\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Oprah Magazine\u003c/a>, author of “\u003ca href=\"https://www.indiebound.org/book/9781541646322\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">What Would Frida Do? A Guide to Living Boldly\u003c/a>”\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>Shannon Lee, author of “\u003ca href=\"https://www.indiebound.org/book/9781250206688\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Be Water, My Friend: The Teachings of Bruce Lee\u003c/a>”\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>Kahran and Regis Bethencourt, founders of \u003ca href=\"http://creativesoulphoto.com/about/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">CreativeSoul Photography\u003c/a>, authors of “\u003ca href=\"http://creativesoulphoto.com/glory/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">GLORY: Magical Visions of Black Beauty\u003c/a>”\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Reading:\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/arts/13877670/11-transformative-reads-for-solace-and-solitude\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">11 Transformative Reads for Solace and Solitude\u003c/a> from KQED Arts\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/shelf/show/life-lessons\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Life Lessons Books\u003c/a> from Goodreads\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/list/tag/life-changing\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Listopia of life Changing Books\u003c/a> from Goodreads\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"floatright"},"numeric":["floatright"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Listening:\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://news.artnet.com/the-art-angle/art-angle-podcast-frida-kahlo-1917547\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">How Frida Kahlo Can Change Your Life (for Better or Worse)\u003c/a> from Artnet News\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/35-what-would-frida-do-a-conversation-with-arianna-davis/id1501845212?i=1000496628863\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">What Would Frida Do?: A conversation with Arianna Davis\u003c/a> from LatinEQUIS\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/bruce-lee-podcast/id1134673435\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Bruce Lee Podcast\u003c/a> hosted by Shannon Lee\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/podcasts/760/pain-and-purpose-lessons-from-bruce-lee-and-frida-kahlo","authors":["byline_podcasts_760"],"programs":["podcasts_2"],"categories":["podcasts_1"],"tags":["podcasts_300","podcasts_308","podcasts_302","podcasts_303","podcasts_305","podcasts_306","podcasts_301","podcasts_309","podcasts_304","podcasts_299","podcasts_307","podcasts_140","podcasts_119","podcasts_90","podcasts_310","podcasts_99","podcasts_178","podcasts_15","podcasts_116","podcasts_95"],"featImg":"podcasts_771","label":"source_podcasts_760"},"podcasts_737":{"type":"posts","id":"podcasts_737","meta":{"index":"posts_1591205157","site":"podcasts","id":"737","score":null,"sort":[1604563262000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"hey-young-world-the-world-is-yours","title":"Hey, Young World, the World is Yours","publishDate":1604563262,"format":"aside","headTitle":"Truth Be Told | KQED Podcasts | KQED","labelTerm":{},"content":"\u003cp>\u003cimg class=\"size-medium wp-image-572 alignleft\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/77/2020/11/Tarot-Card-Season2_Episode-18-final-KH-800x1382.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"400\">\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>This week, our souls needed to be reminded of what idealism feels like and what hope sounds like. So, we brought in some of the most dynamic voices of our time and asked one simple question: \u003cstrong>\"What's the world you're fighting for?\"\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Here are some of their answers:\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>“I’m fighting for a world where people of color don't need to work twice as hard to be seen as less than equal. I'm fighting for a world where we all have a future that’ll not be filled with floods, hurricanes and fires. I'm fighting for a world where we can heal from white supremacy and colonialism.” —\u003c/em> Althea Mitchell, member of \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/RadicalMonarchs\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Radical Monarchs\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>“So a world that I'm fighting for is for a world that has systemic and interpersonal solidarity in action. Growing up in San Diego, California I didn't see myself reflected in the curriculum. In middle school moving to Ohio, I didn't see myself reflected in the curriculum. Moving to Indianapolis, when I first taught, I didn't see myself in the curriculum. And then when I moved to Boston to go to grad school at Harvard, that's the first time I saw myself in the curriculum taking an ethnic studies graduate course taught by Dr. Christina Villarreal. She exposed me to cross coalitional movements. So today I'm fighting for our voice being unapologetically in the curriculum, being present. And I want to make sure that we're not omitted from the conversation, because when we're omitted from the conversation, we are still fighting the same battles of lack of representation, of lack of resource s or a lack of radical imagination as templates for us to see ourselves as the leaders we were born to be.”\u003c/em> — \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/tonyrosaspeaks\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Tony DelaRosa\u003c/a>, Filipinx activist, poet and manager of teacher leadership development of Teach For America in Miami\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>“The world I see right now is a world full of hope, it's people becoming more and more active, posting more and more on social media, regarding activism and how people can get involved and educate themselves on issues that they're connected to, that they're inspired by, that they are interested in. The world I'm fighting for is a world where urban oil drilling is read about in books and they think it was ridiculous that it went on for so long. It's a world where nobody is being denied the right to breathe clean air, that everybody has access to this basic human right and everybody has access to safe drinking water.”\u003c/em> — \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/NalleliCobo\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Nalleli Cobo\u003c/a>, environmental justice activist\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>“The world that I'm fighting for is one that advocates for the rights, resources and livelihood of the people in our community who've been historically and constantly marginalized. I'm fighting for a world that prioritizes unity and empathy and making sure that our communities place importance on uplifting, liberating one another.”\u003c/em> — \u003ca href=\"https://www.rubyibarra.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Ruby Ibarra\u003c/a>, M.C., poet, director and scientist\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In this episode, host Tonya Mosley hangs out with two Wise Ones, \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/alexaiono\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Alex Aiono\u003c/a>, a musician, podcast host and YouTube star, and \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/jelanianglin?lang=en\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Jelani Anglin\u003c/a>, founder of \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/goodcallnyc\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Good Call NYC\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Anglin grew up in New York and experienced a run-in with the law as a teenager. “That's a story that many young Black males have had,” says Anglin. “And if they don't, then a relative or someone they know has that story.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>While working in tech, he noticed that it was being used to connect the world but wasn’t helping his community. “I joined an incubator and we interviewed many folks that spoke about problems with policing, and that was really the starting point,” says Anglin. What emerged was Good Call NYC, an emergency hotline that connects people who are in police custody to free legal help and alerts loved ones of their arrest.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Anglin says this summer, the team of seven experienced massive growth. “Rest in peace to George Floyd, it took bad policing for us to actually be utilized within the communities when that's what we initially created for,” says Anglin. “We got over 2,000 calls in the space of a week, and we didn't miss a call. Our lawyers were taking naps in alternating shifts in order to make that happen.” Outreach over the past four years has allowed Good Call NYC to become an important resource in New York and readily available for the 2020 summer of uprisings.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The world Anglin is fighting for? “I think I can only think about this simply: I'm fighting for a world where Black lives are valued,” says Anglin. “I'm fighting for a world that understands that our inalienable rights, the pursuit of life, liberty and happiness are for everybody and not just for a certain few.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Alex Aiono also experienced his passions converging with social justice this summer. His new album, \u003cem>\u003ca href=\"https://open.spotify.com/album/3aMxTIRUiIjWssDfq4TtN3?si=vCu5WUsCRHmXSspaesTo_w\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Gospel At 23\u003c/a>\u003c/em>, reflects his upbringing in a small, very tight-knit community rooted in religion.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I think as a musician, you always want to release it on the quietest moments so that you can make as much noise as possible and you stand out. And when you're in the middle of a pandemic, racial injustice, elections, legends dying and all of this madness that's happening, you almost feel like, ‘Man, I don't want to put something out,’” explains Aiono. “Especially when it's these things that are important to you. I just got to the point where I said, ‘Whoever needs to hear this album, it's going to reach them... If it's a slow burn, it becomes an iconic piece, even if that’s just for me and my mom.’”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Aiono says the world he’s fighting for is one where Americans adopt a collective mindset, caring for and thinking about what’s good for all of us, versus our own needs and pursuits.“That's not the world that I would ideally live in,” says Aiono. “So the future and the world that I’m fighting for is one where we are caring more for each other.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>We conclude this power-packed show with Amanda Gorman, the first National Youth Poet Laureate in the United States. In a 2019 \u003cem>New York Times\u003c/em> interview, Gorman said in addition to her passion for poetry, she’s also considering a presidential run—in 2036.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Here’s one of her recent pieces:\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>\u003cstrong>The Unabated\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>We are here,\u003cbr>\nHoller all the black girls.\u003cbr>\nUs, dark daughters\u003cbr>\nIn a long chain of silence.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Hope flocks to the poet\u003cbr>\nLike female ants rallying round\u003cbr>\nTheir queen, black bodies\u003cbr>\nCarrying histories three times our size.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Our words will strip you\u003cbr>\nRaw till you glow like pennies\u003cbr>\nScraped of the memory of being owned.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>We are hope,\u003cbr>\nHowl the youth,\u003cbr>\nThose who aren’t lost for words,\u003cbr>\nBut lost without them:\u003cbr>\nThat lettered pulse and heated evasion.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Our writing is a stretched-out baptism,\u003cbr>\nA type of yoked rebirth.\u003cbr>\nWe are the ones who know:\u003cbr>\nWhere there’s smoke, there’s a poet,\u003cbr>\nWhere there’s a poet, there’s a fire,\u003cbr>\nBright as a bloodied blade.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>We will be here,\u003cbr>\nWe will be heard,\u003cbr>\nHark the poets\u003cbr>\nIn a long ring of resistance.\u003cbr>\nWe are brown as a plum pit\u003cbr>\nAnd smooth as red river clay.\u003cbr>\nOur color is no longer anatomy\u003cbr>\nNor aesthetic but an arsenal. Holy.\u003cbr>\nWholly, and simply, our own.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>—Amanda Gorman\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>A transcript of this episode can be found \u003cstrong>\u003ca href=\"http://shorturl.at/erzE4\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">here\u003c/a>\u003c/strong>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Episode Guests:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/jelanianglin?lang=en\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Jelani Anglin\u003c/a>, Founder of \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/goodcallnyc\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Good Call NYC \u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/alexaiono\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Alex Aiono\u003c/a>, musician, podcast host and YouTube star\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/tonyrosaspeaks\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Tony Delarosa\u003c/a>, Filipinx activist, poet, manager at Teach For America in Miami\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/AmandaSCGorman\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Amanda Gorman\u003c/a>, first U.S. Youth Poet Laureate\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/NalleliCobo\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Nalleli Cobo\u003c/a>, environmental justice activist\u003cbr>\nAlthea Goss, member of \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/RadicalMonarchs\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Radical Monarchs \u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.rubyibarra.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Ruby Ibarra\u003c/a>, M.C., poet and director\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.soulfirefarm.org/meet-the-farmers/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Leah Penniman\u003c/a>, food sovereignty activist, co-director of \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/soulfirefarm\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Soul Fire Farm \u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Reading:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.vox.com/21497637/election-2020-youth-vote-young-people-voting?__c=1\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The often-overlooked reasons why young people don’t vote\u003c/a>” from Vox\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/2020/09/28/916078915/young-activist-pushes-to-lower-voting-age-to-16-as-the-next-logical-step-for-gen\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Young Activist Pushes To Lower Voting Age To 16 As 'The Logical Next Step' For Gen Z\u003c/a>” from NPR\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.mprnews.org/episode/2020/10/22/could-2020-be-the-year-of-the-young-voter\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Could 2020 be the year of the young voter?\u003c/a>” from MPRNews\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad floatright]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Listening:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/2020/10/22/926678395/the-latinx-vote-comes-of-age\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Latinx Vote Comes Of Age\u003c/a>” from NPR’s \u003cem>Code Switch\u003c/em>\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/2020/10/14/923723249/they-ve-dismissed-us-how-latino-voter-outreach-still-falls-short\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">‘They've Dismissed Us’: How Latino Voter Outreach Still Falls Short\u003c/a>” from NPR’s \u003cem>It’s Been A Minute\u003c/em>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://the-youth-vote.simplecast.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\u003cem>The Youth Vote\u003c/em>\u003c/a>\u003cem> \u003c/em>podcast\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.iheart.com/podcast/1119-alex-aiono-lets-get-into-65877504/episode/does-your-voice-matter-with-tonya-72263987/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Does Your Voice Matter?\u003c/a>” from \u003cem>Alex Aiono: Let’s Get Into It\u003c/em>\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/turnout-episode-4-young-people-are-moral-compass-country/id1134154895?i=1000495632043\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Episode 4: ‘Young people are the moral compass of the country’\u003c/a>” from \u003cem>TURNOUT\u003c/em> podcast\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://yr.media/podcasts/woke-ish/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Woke ISH\u003c/a>” from the \u003cem>Adult ISH\u003c/em> podcast\u003c/p>\n\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":"To share a bit of inspiration, Tonya Mosley speaks to young activists about what kind of future they want to see.","status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1604595715,"stats":{"hasAudio":false,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":31,"wordCount":1526},"headData":{"title":"Hey, Young World, the World is Yours | KQED Podcasts","description":"To share a bit of inspiration, Tonya Mosley speaks to young activists about what kind of future they want to see.","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":""},"disqusIdentifier":"737 https://ww2.kqed.org/podcasts/?p=737","disqusUrl":"https://ww2.kqed.org/podcasts/2020/11/05/hey-young-world-the-world-is-yours/","disqusTitle":"Hey, Young World, the World is Yours","source":"Truth Be Told","sourceUrl":"https://www.kqed.org/podcasts/truthbetold","nprByline":"Truth Be Told team","templateType":"standard","featuredImageType":"standard","path":"/podcasts/737/hey-young-world-the-world-is-yours","audioUrl":"https://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/traffic.megaphone.fm/KQINC2870943774.mp3","audioDuration":2287000,"audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003cimg class=\"size-medium wp-image-572 alignleft\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/77/2020/11/Tarot-Card-Season2_Episode-18-final-KH-800x1382.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"400\">\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>This week, our souls needed to be reminded of what idealism feels like and what hope sounds like. So, we brought in some of the most dynamic voices of our time and asked one simple question: \u003cstrong>\"What's the world you're fighting for?\"\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Here are some of their answers:\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>“I’m fighting for a world where people of color don't need to work twice as hard to be seen as less than equal. I'm fighting for a world where we all have a future that’ll not be filled with floods, hurricanes and fires. I'm fighting for a world where we can heal from white supremacy and colonialism.” —\u003c/em> Althea Mitchell, member of \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/RadicalMonarchs\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Radical Monarchs\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>“So a world that I'm fighting for is for a world that has systemic and interpersonal solidarity in action. Growing up in San Diego, California I didn't see myself reflected in the curriculum. In middle school moving to Ohio, I didn't see myself reflected in the curriculum. Moving to Indianapolis, when I first taught, I didn't see myself in the curriculum. And then when I moved to Boston to go to grad school at Harvard, that's the first time I saw myself in the curriculum taking an ethnic studies graduate course taught by Dr. Christina Villarreal. She exposed me to cross coalitional movements. So today I'm fighting for our voice being unapologetically in the curriculum, being present. And I want to make sure that we're not omitted from the conversation, because when we're omitted from the conversation, we are still fighting the same battles of lack of representation, of lack of resource s or a lack of radical imagination as templates for us to see ourselves as the leaders we were born to be.”\u003c/em> — \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/tonyrosaspeaks\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Tony DelaRosa\u003c/a>, Filipinx activist, poet and manager of teacher leadership development of Teach For America in Miami\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>“The world I see right now is a world full of hope, it's people becoming more and more active, posting more and more on social media, regarding activism and how people can get involved and educate themselves on issues that they're connected to, that they're inspired by, that they are interested in. The world I'm fighting for is a world where urban oil drilling is read about in books and they think it was ridiculous that it went on for so long. It's a world where nobody is being denied the right to breathe clean air, that everybody has access to this basic human right and everybody has access to safe drinking water.”\u003c/em> — \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/NalleliCobo\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Nalleli Cobo\u003c/a>, environmental justice activist\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>“The world that I'm fighting for is one that advocates for the rights, resources and livelihood of the people in our community who've been historically and constantly marginalized. I'm fighting for a world that prioritizes unity and empathy and making sure that our communities place importance on uplifting, liberating one another.”\u003c/em> — \u003ca href=\"https://www.rubyibarra.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Ruby Ibarra\u003c/a>, M.C., poet, director and scientist\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In this episode, host Tonya Mosley hangs out with two Wise Ones, \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/alexaiono\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Alex Aiono\u003c/a>, a musician, podcast host and YouTube star, and \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/jelanianglin?lang=en\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Jelani Anglin\u003c/a>, founder of \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/goodcallnyc\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Good Call NYC\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Anglin grew up in New York and experienced a run-in with the law as a teenager. “That's a story that many young Black males have had,” says Anglin. “And if they don't, then a relative or someone they know has that story.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>While working in tech, he noticed that it was being used to connect the world but wasn’t helping his community. “I joined an incubator and we interviewed many folks that spoke about problems with policing, and that was really the starting point,” says Anglin. What emerged was Good Call NYC, an emergency hotline that connects people who are in police custody to free legal help and alerts loved ones of their arrest.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Anglin says this summer, the team of seven experienced massive growth. “Rest in peace to George Floyd, it took bad policing for us to actually be utilized within the communities when that's what we initially created for,” says Anglin. “We got over 2,000 calls in the space of a week, and we didn't miss a call. Our lawyers were taking naps in alternating shifts in order to make that happen.” Outreach over the past four years has allowed Good Call NYC to become an important resource in New York and readily available for the 2020 summer of uprisings.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The world Anglin is fighting for? “I think I can only think about this simply: I'm fighting for a world where Black lives are valued,” says Anglin. “I'm fighting for a world that understands that our inalienable rights, the pursuit of life, liberty and happiness are for everybody and not just for a certain few.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Alex Aiono also experienced his passions converging with social justice this summer. His new album, \u003cem>\u003ca href=\"https://open.spotify.com/album/3aMxTIRUiIjWssDfq4TtN3?si=vCu5WUsCRHmXSspaesTo_w\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Gospel At 23\u003c/a>\u003c/em>, reflects his upbringing in a small, very tight-knit community rooted in religion.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I think as a musician, you always want to release it on the quietest moments so that you can make as much noise as possible and you stand out. And when you're in the middle of a pandemic, racial injustice, elections, legends dying and all of this madness that's happening, you almost feel like, ‘Man, I don't want to put something out,’” explains Aiono. “Especially when it's these things that are important to you. I just got to the point where I said, ‘Whoever needs to hear this album, it's going to reach them... If it's a slow burn, it becomes an iconic piece, even if that’s just for me and my mom.’”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Aiono says the world he’s fighting for is one where Americans adopt a collective mindset, caring for and thinking about what’s good for all of us, versus our own needs and pursuits.“That's not the world that I would ideally live in,” says Aiono. “So the future and the world that I’m fighting for is one where we are caring more for each other.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>We conclude this power-packed show with Amanda Gorman, the first National Youth Poet Laureate in the United States. In a 2019 \u003cem>New York Times\u003c/em> interview, Gorman said in addition to her passion for poetry, she’s also considering a presidential run—in 2036.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Here’s one of her recent pieces:\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>\u003cstrong>The Unabated\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>We are here,\u003cbr>\nHoller all the black girls.\u003cbr>\nUs, dark daughters\u003cbr>\nIn a long chain of silence.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Hope flocks to the poet\u003cbr>\nLike female ants rallying round\u003cbr>\nTheir queen, black bodies\u003cbr>\nCarrying histories three times our size.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Our words will strip you\u003cbr>\nRaw till you glow like pennies\u003cbr>\nScraped of the memory of being owned.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>We are hope,\u003cbr>\nHowl the youth,\u003cbr>\nThose who aren’t lost for words,\u003cbr>\nBut lost without them:\u003cbr>\nThat lettered pulse and heated evasion.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Our writing is a stretched-out baptism,\u003cbr>\nA type of yoked rebirth.\u003cbr>\nWe are the ones who know:\u003cbr>\nWhere there’s smoke, there’s a poet,\u003cbr>\nWhere there’s a poet, there’s a fire,\u003cbr>\nBright as a bloodied blade.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>We will be here,\u003cbr>\nWe will be heard,\u003cbr>\nHark the poets\u003cbr>\nIn a long ring of resistance.\u003cbr>\nWe are brown as a plum pit\u003cbr>\nAnd smooth as red river clay.\u003cbr>\nOur color is no longer anatomy\u003cbr>\nNor aesthetic but an arsenal. Holy.\u003cbr>\nWholly, and simply, our own.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>—Amanda Gorman\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>A transcript of this episode can be found \u003cstrong>\u003ca href=\"http://shorturl.at/erzE4\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">here\u003c/a>\u003c/strong>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Episode Guests:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/jelanianglin?lang=en\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Jelani Anglin\u003c/a>, Founder of \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/goodcallnyc\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Good Call NYC \u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/alexaiono\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Alex Aiono\u003c/a>, musician, podcast host and YouTube star\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/tonyrosaspeaks\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Tony Delarosa\u003c/a>, Filipinx activist, poet, manager at Teach For America in Miami\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/AmandaSCGorman\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Amanda Gorman\u003c/a>, first U.S. Youth Poet Laureate\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/NalleliCobo\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Nalleli Cobo\u003c/a>, environmental justice activist\u003cbr>\nAlthea Goss, member of \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/RadicalMonarchs\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Radical Monarchs \u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.rubyibarra.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Ruby Ibarra\u003c/a>, M.C., poet and director\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.soulfirefarm.org/meet-the-farmers/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Leah Penniman\u003c/a>, food sovereignty activist, co-director of \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/soulfirefarm\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Soul Fire Farm \u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Reading:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.vox.com/21497637/election-2020-youth-vote-young-people-voting?__c=1\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The often-overlooked reasons why young people don’t vote\u003c/a>” from Vox\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/2020/09/28/916078915/young-activist-pushes-to-lower-voting-age-to-16-as-the-next-logical-step-for-gen\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Young Activist Pushes To Lower Voting Age To 16 As 'The Logical Next Step' For Gen Z\u003c/a>” from NPR\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.mprnews.org/episode/2020/10/22/could-2020-be-the-year-of-the-young-voter\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Could 2020 be the year of the young voter?\u003c/a>” from MPRNews\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"floatright"},"numeric":["floatright"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Listening:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/2020/10/22/926678395/the-latinx-vote-comes-of-age\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Latinx Vote Comes Of Age\u003c/a>” from NPR’s \u003cem>Code Switch\u003c/em>\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/2020/10/14/923723249/they-ve-dismissed-us-how-latino-voter-outreach-still-falls-short\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">‘They've Dismissed Us’: How Latino Voter Outreach Still Falls Short\u003c/a>” from NPR’s \u003cem>It’s Been A Minute\u003c/em>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://the-youth-vote.simplecast.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\u003cem>The Youth Vote\u003c/em>\u003c/a>\u003cem> \u003c/em>podcast\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.iheart.com/podcast/1119-alex-aiono-lets-get-into-65877504/episode/does-your-voice-matter-with-tonya-72263987/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Does Your Voice Matter?\u003c/a>” from \u003cem>Alex Aiono: Let’s Get Into It\u003c/em>\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/turnout-episode-4-young-people-are-moral-compass-country/id1134154895?i=1000495632043\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Episode 4: ‘Young people are the moral compass of the country’\u003c/a>” from \u003cem>TURNOUT\u003c/em> podcast\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://yr.media/podcasts/woke-ish/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Woke ISH\u003c/a>” from the \u003cem>Adult ISH\u003c/em> podcast\u003c/p>\n\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/podcasts/737/hey-young-world-the-world-is-yours","authors":["byline_podcasts_737"],"programs":["podcasts_2"],"categories":["podcasts_1"],"tags":["podcasts_295","podcasts_289","podcasts_288","podcasts_278","podcasts_285","podcasts_284","podcasts_297","podcasts_280","podcasts_273","podcasts_294","podcasts_293","podcasts_291","podcasts_274","podcasts_290","podcasts_276","podcasts_296","podcasts_286","podcasts_292","podcasts_287","podcasts_281","podcasts_277","podcasts_282","podcasts_283","podcasts_279","podcasts_275","podcasts_119","podcasts_90","podcasts_99","podcasts_272","podcasts_116","podcasts_298","podcasts_95"],"featImg":"podcasts_738","label":"source_podcasts_737"},"podcasts_706":{"type":"posts","id":"podcasts_706","meta":{"index":"posts_1591205157","site":"podcasts","id":"706","score":null,"sort":[1604084004000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"how-can-filipinxs-join-the-fight-against-anti-blackness","title":"How Can Filipinxs Join the Fight Against Anti-Blackness?","publishDate":1604084004,"format":"standard","headTitle":"Truth Be Told | KQED Podcasts | KQED","labelTerm":{},"content":"\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/podcasts/truthbetold\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\u003cem>Truth Be Told\u003c/em>\u003c/a> is a space where Black and Indigenous people and other people of color can talk to each other about identity and find wisdom within our own communities. We get questions from our listeners all the time, but we can't answer them all in our podcast. So we are trying something new by introducing our new column, “Conversations with Wise Ones.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Our first conversation is about Filipinx History Month and doing our part to support Black Lives Matter. We talked with author, psychologist and professor \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/kevinnadal\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Kevin Nadal\u003c/a>. He is an activist whose research focuses on how discrimination impacts the mental health of people of color and LGBTQ+ people. While taking care of his toddler, Nadal joined Truth Be Told engagement producer, \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/IsabethKahlo\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Isabeth Mendoza\u003c/a>, for a conversation on why Filipinxs and Filipino Americans are in a unique position to be co-conspirators in the fight for racial justice. We talked about colonialism, call-out culture and what’s on the other side of decolonization.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>This interview has been edited and condensed for clarity. The terms Filipino, Filinpinx and Filipino American are used in this interview to refer to the diverse community with ties to the Philippines living in the United States. Scroll to the bottom of the story for a glossary of helpful terms.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>Listener Question: How can the Filipinx community support Black Lives Matter?\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Isabeth Mendoza: In these past few months, many Filipinxs have reflected on the times we didn’t speak up when we experienced or witnessed racism. How do you find resolution from the explicit and implicit acts rooted in anti-Blackness? \u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kevin Nadal:\u003c/strong> Personally I try not to live in regrets, but to live in lessons and reflection in order to move forward. The times you regret, ask yourself, “What is the lesson involved?” How can you move forward if there are times that you didn't speak up in the past? Are there ways that you can correct that? There may be opportunities to go back to certain people if they’re in your life to re-approach them. For example, ‘You remember that time in 2012 when I said this or I didn't say anything?’\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In situations where you don't know those people or where the situation would be difficult to correct, it may be impossible. So this is where you have to reflect and make it right in other ways. How can you use that guilt, shame or anxiety to make things better? How can you then make sure that the next time a similar situation happens, you can hold yourself accountable? The past can illuminate some needed healing so in that case ask yourself, “Why am I doing this? Is it really for them or you?”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm?e=KQINC1201103023&light=true\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>What makes a good co-conspirator in the fight against racism? \u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Self-awareness and self-care. I think if you are somebody who is not aware of your strengths, limitations, areas for improvement, traumas or triggers, then it's going to be really hard for you to be the best accomplice, co-conspirator or revolutionary that you can be.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>When you’re trying to spread the news of social justice and you can be triggered in an argument and lash out, you’re not being as effective as if you have been able to manage some of your own emotions and work through some of your traumas. [aside postid='arts_13882499']\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Similarly, caring for your health is important because sometimes we get so caught up in whatever is happening that our emotions are heightened. Our bodies get tired. For example, if you are continuing to go to actions and you’re tired or severely depressed, going to those actions might be less healing and more triggering. I think passion and drive is really important, but when it starts to take over your body, you need to rest. You don’t need to go to every single action. We need to work as a team where some people go to some actions, some people are resting and when they’re resting they’re sitting by their phones in case people get into trouble. That’s activism. There are so many ways that we can be activists. There isn’t just one way, and one type of activism isn’t necessarily better than the other.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm?e=KQINC7533371786&light=true\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>How do you think dealing with colonialism affects being a co-conspirator?\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>I think one of the reasons why Filipinos might have difficulty being activists and revolutionaries is because of colonial mentality, which stems from more than 400 years of colonialism by Spain and the United States. Because of colonialism, Filipinos have learned to denigrate parts of themselves as being negative and to value more the beliefs and the standards of the colonizer. So if white people and their systems of power teach Filipinos that there are certain things that they need to abide by, then oftentimes Filipinos just abide by it. No questions. And so when we're talking about things like systemic racism and particularly the Black Lives Matter movement, a lot of Filipinos are complacent because they just believe that this is just how systems are. And for some Filipinos, it’s even worse where they’ve internalized these notions of anti-Blackness and are upholding systemic racism. So believing that Black people are bad or deserving of whatever oppression they experience is failing to recognize the ways that their own Filipino American communities are negatively impacted by systemic oppression.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>What’s the first thing you’d recommend to Filipinxs who are dealing with colonialism in their family and want to help them acknowledge it?\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>For a lot of people, coming to terms for the first time really is disrupting their world, because if they have thought these things for however long they’ve been alive, then activist revolutionaries are really asking them to to change their mindsets about their entire existence, which is very hard.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>One of the things that I encourage people to do is to read, to educate themselves, take ethnic studies classes if possible, read books on biographies of people of color who have paved the way for different revolutions and different movements throughout the years, and watch documentaries. We have so much access to learning, it’s something that we didn't have even five years ago. Know that you're not the only one, this is a process that most people go through at some point in their lives—the very process of coming to terms with your identity, with your own racism or internalized oppression. [aside postid='arts_13881199']\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>There are older generation Filipino, Filipino Americans who have internalized a lot of colonial mentality and might be set in their belief systems so they have a more difficult time receiving new information. I try to meet them where they’re at. It’s trying to make things relatable to them.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>If you attack them in any sort of way, they won’t be able to listen because you’ve broken this cardinal rule of respecting your elders. I'm not going to let elders say outlandish, hurtful, oppressive things. But I also know that there are certain ways I might have to approach them in order for them to hear anything that I have to say. For example, elders may say something that’s anti-Black or homophobic so I might just gently say, “Tito or Tita, I don't agree with that. And I don’t think you should be saying that, especially around me. That hurts my feelings because I either identify like that or many people who are close to me do.” I have to remember to engage in that approach because that’s the only way they might even be able to hear a little bit.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>How do we keep each other accountable and learning, but also keeping the love we have for each other? \u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>I think what’s really important is for people to work on themselves first before they start challenging others. And part of that is how people deal with anger or their trauma when they can't manage their own issues and project onto others. I encourage people to engage in any type of self care that provides some of that healing. For many people, that might be traditional Western therapy. For others, there might be more cultural practices like meditations, becoming one with nature, practicing different types of spiritualities and so forth. [aside postid='arts_13888548']\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Going through those emotions is very normal. It’s something everybody goes through as they come to terms with their social justice identities. It’s OK to get angry. But understand that anger is usually part of something bigger. It’s usually part of some trauma that people may be carrying around with them. That’s also part of this whole notion of historical trauma, where trauma runs through our veins and gets passed down through generations. For example, the wars that we’ve gone through as a people, the centuries of brutality during colonialism, the murders, and the rapes. Filipino people, who weren’t even called Filipino people back then, have been carrying so much of this with us.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>There is a lot of tone policing, emotional exhaustion and emotional labor. What is your approach in welcoming new Filipinxs and Fil-Americans into the movement against anti-Blackness?\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>For me, it’s just reminding ourselves that we’re in community and recognizing that there's nothing effective about calling out people in antagonistic ways. In fact, when we are antagonistic towards each other, that’s really just what that the colonizer and systems of oppression want. They want us to fight. They want us to not get along.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>For me, there's this notion, if you can't approach a person with kindness, why are you even approaching them? Because that may show that you don't even have a relationship with that person or you’re forgetting the idea of why you’re even in this work, which is because you want to advance all of our communities.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>It’s such a complex issue because some people they say, “We have to call out people.” I say, yeah we do have to call out some people, but for me, it’s calling out people in power, that’s what’s most important. When it comes to people in our own communities who are fighting for the greater good, then that’s where I feel like we have to at least consider being gentler. I say that because I know there are people in our community that aren’t advocating for our communities.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm?e=KQINC8787467717&light=true\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>What happens after decolonization and unlearning?\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Decolonization is a lifelong process that you don’t ever come to the end of. I like the word decolonizing because it's an active process—it’s not something that is a yes or no. What I think is on the other side of decolonization and unlearning is joy and peace, love and self-love. People don’t learn about colonizing and social justice until they’re in high school or after. That’s two decades of learning to hate yourself.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/kevinnadal\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Kevin Nadal\u003c/a> is an author, psychologist, activist and professor at John Jay College for Criminal Justice , City of New York (CUNY). We’d love to hear your feedback and your questions for future conversations with Wise Ones. Email us at truthbetold@kqed.org.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>Glossary\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Co-conspirator:\u003c/strong> “Co-conspiracy is about what we do in action, not just in language. It is about moving through guilt and shame and recognizing that we did not create none of this stuff. And so what we are taking responsibility for is the power that we hold to transform our conditions.”—Alicia Garza, \u003ca href=\"http://blacklivesmatter.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Black Lives Matter\u003c/a> co-founder and Special Projects Director for \u003ca href=\"http://www.domesticworkers.org/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">National Domestic Workers Alliance\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Colonization:\u003c/strong> “In the context of Indigenous Peoples, colonization has come to mean any kind of external control, and it is used as an expression for the subordination of Indian peoples and their rights since early contact with Europeans. In North America, colonization took the task of subordinating Indigenous Peoples to the political power of Christian European kings. In Spanish colonies, with the appearance of the colonists, the land was immediately considered under the control of the colonizing nations.”—Duane Champagne, via \u003cem>\u003ca href=\"https://indiancountrytoday.com/archive/assimilation-integration-and-colonization-7wy5Jkji8k-drES-ocFfwA\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Indian Country Today\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Decolonization: \u003c/strong>“Decolonization brings about the repatriation of Indigenous land and life; it is not a metaphor for other things we want to do to improve our societies and schools.”—Eve Tuck and K. Wayne Yang, “\u003ca href=\"http://www.nwic.edu/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/Decolonization-Is-Not-A-Metaphor.pdf\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Decolonization is not a metaphor\u003c/a>”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The process of colonization begins with the physical occupation of land and domination of the Indigenous people. Following the primarily physical aspects of colonization (i.e. military conflict, relocation, etc.), non-physical methods are applied. These include what could be called mental aspects. Religious indoctrination, cultural, social and economic assimilation are common examples. Therefore it could be said that colonization comprises two primary aspects—physical and mental. In order to be liberated from this oppressive state, the process of colonization must be reversed. That is, it must begin with the mental aspects and move towards the physical.”—Zigzag & Keyway, “\u003ca href=\"https://unsettlingamerica.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/decolonization.pdf\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Long Hot Summer ’99\u003c/a>”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Internalized oppression:\u003c/strong> “When we accept or ‘buy into’ the negative and inferiorizing messages that are propagated about who we are, then we have begun to internalize the oppression that we experienced. We have come to learn that—having certain traits, being a member of a particular group, and being who we are—are not good enough or are not desirable. Sometimes, we even learn to hate our traits, our groups, ourselves.”—E. J. R. David, via \u003cem>\u003ca href=\"https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/unseen-and-unheard/201509/internalized-oppression-we-need-stop-hating-ourselves\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Psychology Today\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad floatright]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Systemic oppression:\u003c/strong> \"A system of invisible barriers limiting people based on their membership in unfavored social identity groups. The barriers are only invisible to those ‘seemingly’ unaffected by it. The practice of institutionalized oppression is based on the belief in inherent superiority or inferiority.”—from “\u003ca href=\"https://www.pcc.edu/illumination/wp-content/uploads/sites/54/2018/05/institutionalized-oppression-definitions.pdf\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Institutionalized Oppression\u003c/a>” Tools for Diversity, created by Carol Cheney, Jeannie LaFrance and Terrie Quinteros\u003c/p>\n\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":"Professor Kevin Nadal teaches us how to address racism in our communities using compassion. ","status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1604084004,"stats":{"hasAudio":true,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":38,"wordCount":2440},"headData":{"title":"How Can Filipinxs Join the Fight Against Anti-Blackness? | KQED Podcasts","description":"Professor Kevin Nadal teaches us how to address racism in our communities using compassion. ","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":""},"disqusIdentifier":"706 https://ww2.kqed.org/podcasts/?p=706","disqusUrl":"https://ww2.kqed.org/podcasts/2020/10/30/how-can-filipinxs-join-the-fight-against-anti-blackness/","disqusTitle":"How Can Filipinxs Join the Fight Against Anti-Blackness?","source":"Truth Be Told","sourceUrl":"https://www.kqed.org/podcasts/truthbetold","templateType":"standard","featuredImageType":"standard","path":"/podcasts/706/how-can-filipinxs-join-the-fight-against-anti-blackness","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/podcasts/truthbetold\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\u003cem>Truth Be Told\u003c/em>\u003c/a> is a space where Black and Indigenous people and other people of color can talk to each other about identity and find wisdom within our own communities. We get questions from our listeners all the time, but we can't answer them all in our podcast. So we are trying something new by introducing our new column, “Conversations with Wise Ones.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Our first conversation is about Filipinx History Month and doing our part to support Black Lives Matter. We talked with author, psychologist and professor \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/kevinnadal\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Kevin Nadal\u003c/a>. He is an activist whose research focuses on how discrimination impacts the mental health of people of color and LGBTQ+ people. While taking care of his toddler, Nadal joined Truth Be Told engagement producer, \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/IsabethKahlo\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Isabeth Mendoza\u003c/a>, for a conversation on why Filipinxs and Filipino Americans are in a unique position to be co-conspirators in the fight for racial justice. We talked about colonialism, call-out culture and what’s on the other side of decolonization.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>This interview has been edited and condensed for clarity. The terms Filipino, Filinpinx and Filipino American are used in this interview to refer to the diverse community with ties to the Philippines living in the United States. Scroll to the bottom of the story for a glossary of helpful terms.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>Listener Question: How can the Filipinx community support Black Lives Matter?\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Isabeth Mendoza: In these past few months, many Filipinxs have reflected on the times we didn’t speak up when we experienced or witnessed racism. How do you find resolution from the explicit and implicit acts rooted in anti-Blackness? \u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kevin Nadal:\u003c/strong> Personally I try not to live in regrets, but to live in lessons and reflection in order to move forward. The times you regret, ask yourself, “What is the lesson involved?” How can you move forward if there are times that you didn't speak up in the past? Are there ways that you can correct that? There may be opportunities to go back to certain people if they’re in your life to re-approach them. For example, ‘You remember that time in 2012 when I said this or I didn't say anything?’\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In situations where you don't know those people or where the situation would be difficult to correct, it may be impossible. So this is where you have to reflect and make it right in other ways. How can you use that guilt, shame or anxiety to make things better? How can you then make sure that the next time a similar situation happens, you can hold yourself accountable? The past can illuminate some needed healing so in that case ask yourself, “Why am I doing this? Is it really for them or you?”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm?e=KQINC1201103023&light=true\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>What makes a good co-conspirator in the fight against racism? \u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Self-awareness and self-care. I think if you are somebody who is not aware of your strengths, limitations, areas for improvement, traumas or triggers, then it's going to be really hard for you to be the best accomplice, co-conspirator or revolutionary that you can be.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>When you’re trying to spread the news of social justice and you can be triggered in an argument and lash out, you’re not being as effective as if you have been able to manage some of your own emotions and work through some of your traumas. \u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"aside","attributes":{"named":{"postid":"arts_13882499","label":""},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Similarly, caring for your health is important because sometimes we get so caught up in whatever is happening that our emotions are heightened. Our bodies get tired. For example, if you are continuing to go to actions and you’re tired or severely depressed, going to those actions might be less healing and more triggering. I think passion and drive is really important, but when it starts to take over your body, you need to rest. You don’t need to go to every single action. We need to work as a team where some people go to some actions, some people are resting and when they’re resting they’re sitting by their phones in case people get into trouble. That’s activism. There are so many ways that we can be activists. There isn’t just one way, and one type of activism isn’t necessarily better than the other.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm?e=KQINC7533371786&light=true\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>How do you think dealing with colonialism affects being a co-conspirator?\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>I think one of the reasons why Filipinos might have difficulty being activists and revolutionaries is because of colonial mentality, which stems from more than 400 years of colonialism by Spain and the United States. Because of colonialism, Filipinos have learned to denigrate parts of themselves as being negative and to value more the beliefs and the standards of the colonizer. So if white people and their systems of power teach Filipinos that there are certain things that they need to abide by, then oftentimes Filipinos just abide by it. No questions. And so when we're talking about things like systemic racism and particularly the Black Lives Matter movement, a lot of Filipinos are complacent because they just believe that this is just how systems are. And for some Filipinos, it’s even worse where they’ve internalized these notions of anti-Blackness and are upholding systemic racism. So believing that Black people are bad or deserving of whatever oppression they experience is failing to recognize the ways that their own Filipino American communities are negatively impacted by systemic oppression.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>What’s the first thing you’d recommend to Filipinxs who are dealing with colonialism in their family and want to help them acknowledge it?\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>For a lot of people, coming to terms for the first time really is disrupting their world, because if they have thought these things for however long they’ve been alive, then activist revolutionaries are really asking them to to change their mindsets about their entire existence, which is very hard.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>One of the things that I encourage people to do is to read, to educate themselves, take ethnic studies classes if possible, read books on biographies of people of color who have paved the way for different revolutions and different movements throughout the years, and watch documentaries. We have so much access to learning, it’s something that we didn't have even five years ago. Know that you're not the only one, this is a process that most people go through at some point in their lives—the very process of coming to terms with your identity, with your own racism or internalized oppression. \u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"aside","attributes":{"named":{"postid":"arts_13881199","label":""},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>There are older generation Filipino, Filipino Americans who have internalized a lot of colonial mentality and might be set in their belief systems so they have a more difficult time receiving new information. I try to meet them where they’re at. It’s trying to make things relatable to them.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>If you attack them in any sort of way, they won’t be able to listen because you’ve broken this cardinal rule of respecting your elders. I'm not going to let elders say outlandish, hurtful, oppressive things. But I also know that there are certain ways I might have to approach them in order for them to hear anything that I have to say. For example, elders may say something that’s anti-Black or homophobic so I might just gently say, “Tito or Tita, I don't agree with that. And I don’t think you should be saying that, especially around me. That hurts my feelings because I either identify like that or many people who are close to me do.” I have to remember to engage in that approach because that’s the only way they might even be able to hear a little bit.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>How do we keep each other accountable and learning, but also keeping the love we have for each other? \u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>I think what’s really important is for people to work on themselves first before they start challenging others. And part of that is how people deal with anger or their trauma when they can't manage their own issues and project onto others. I encourage people to engage in any type of self care that provides some of that healing. For many people, that might be traditional Western therapy. For others, there might be more cultural practices like meditations, becoming one with nature, practicing different types of spiritualities and so forth. \u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"aside","attributes":{"named":{"postid":"arts_13888548","label":""},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Going through those emotions is very normal. It’s something everybody goes through as they come to terms with their social justice identities. It’s OK to get angry. But understand that anger is usually part of something bigger. It’s usually part of some trauma that people may be carrying around with them. That’s also part of this whole notion of historical trauma, where trauma runs through our veins and gets passed down through generations. For example, the wars that we’ve gone through as a people, the centuries of brutality during colonialism, the murders, and the rapes. Filipino people, who weren’t even called Filipino people back then, have been carrying so much of this with us.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>There is a lot of tone policing, emotional exhaustion and emotional labor. What is your approach in welcoming new Filipinxs and Fil-Americans into the movement against anti-Blackness?\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>For me, it’s just reminding ourselves that we’re in community and recognizing that there's nothing effective about calling out people in antagonistic ways. In fact, when we are antagonistic towards each other, that’s really just what that the colonizer and systems of oppression want. They want us to fight. They want us to not get along.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>For me, there's this notion, if you can't approach a person with kindness, why are you even approaching them? Because that may show that you don't even have a relationship with that person or you’re forgetting the idea of why you’re even in this work, which is because you want to advance all of our communities.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>It’s such a complex issue because some people they say, “We have to call out people.” I say, yeah we do have to call out some people, but for me, it’s calling out people in power, that’s what’s most important. When it comes to people in our own communities who are fighting for the greater good, then that’s where I feel like we have to at least consider being gentler. I say that because I know there are people in our community that aren’t advocating for our communities.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm?e=KQINC8787467717&light=true\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>What happens after decolonization and unlearning?\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Decolonization is a lifelong process that you don’t ever come to the end of. I like the word decolonizing because it's an active process—it’s not something that is a yes or no. What I think is on the other side of decolonization and unlearning is joy and peace, love and self-love. People don’t learn about colonizing and social justice until they’re in high school or after. That’s two decades of learning to hate yourself.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/kevinnadal\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Kevin Nadal\u003c/a> is an author, psychologist, activist and professor at John Jay College for Criminal Justice , City of New York (CUNY). We’d love to hear your feedback and your questions for future conversations with Wise Ones. Email us at truthbetold@kqed.org.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>Glossary\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Co-conspirator:\u003c/strong> “Co-conspiracy is about what we do in action, not just in language. It is about moving through guilt and shame and recognizing that we did not create none of this stuff. And so what we are taking responsibility for is the power that we hold to transform our conditions.”—Alicia Garza, \u003ca href=\"http://blacklivesmatter.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Black Lives Matter\u003c/a> co-founder and Special Projects Director for \u003ca href=\"http://www.domesticworkers.org/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">National Domestic Workers Alliance\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Colonization:\u003c/strong> “In the context of Indigenous Peoples, colonization has come to mean any kind of external control, and it is used as an expression for the subordination of Indian peoples and their rights since early contact with Europeans. In North America, colonization took the task of subordinating Indigenous Peoples to the political power of Christian European kings. In Spanish colonies, with the appearance of the colonists, the land was immediately considered under the control of the colonizing nations.”—Duane Champagne, via \u003cem>\u003ca href=\"https://indiancountrytoday.com/archive/assimilation-integration-and-colonization-7wy5Jkji8k-drES-ocFfwA\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Indian Country Today\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Decolonization: \u003c/strong>“Decolonization brings about the repatriation of Indigenous land and life; it is not a metaphor for other things we want to do to improve our societies and schools.”—Eve Tuck and K. Wayne Yang, “\u003ca href=\"http://www.nwic.edu/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/Decolonization-Is-Not-A-Metaphor.pdf\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Decolonization is not a metaphor\u003c/a>”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The process of colonization begins with the physical occupation of land and domination of the Indigenous people. Following the primarily physical aspects of colonization (i.e. military conflict, relocation, etc.), non-physical methods are applied. These include what could be called mental aspects. Religious indoctrination, cultural, social and economic assimilation are common examples. Therefore it could be said that colonization comprises two primary aspects—physical and mental. In order to be liberated from this oppressive state, the process of colonization must be reversed. That is, it must begin with the mental aspects and move towards the physical.”—Zigzag & Keyway, “\u003ca href=\"https://unsettlingamerica.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/decolonization.pdf\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Long Hot Summer ’99\u003c/a>”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Internalized oppression:\u003c/strong> “When we accept or ‘buy into’ the negative and inferiorizing messages that are propagated about who we are, then we have begun to internalize the oppression that we experienced. We have come to learn that—having certain traits, being a member of a particular group, and being who we are—are not good enough or are not desirable. Sometimes, we even learn to hate our traits, our groups, ourselves.”—E. J. R. David, via \u003cem>\u003ca href=\"https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/unseen-and-unheard/201509/internalized-oppression-we-need-stop-hating-ourselves\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Psychology Today\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"floatright"},"numeric":["floatright"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Systemic oppression:\u003c/strong> \"A system of invisible barriers limiting people based on their membership in unfavored social identity groups. The barriers are only invisible to those ‘seemingly’ unaffected by it. The practice of institutionalized oppression is based on the belief in inherent superiority or inferiority.”—from “\u003ca href=\"https://www.pcc.edu/illumination/wp-content/uploads/sites/54/2018/05/institutionalized-oppression-definitions.pdf\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Institutionalized Oppression\u003c/a>” Tools for Diversity, created by Carol Cheney, Jeannie LaFrance and Terrie Quinteros\u003c/p>\n\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/podcasts/706/how-can-filipinxs-join-the-fight-against-anti-blackness","authors":["11673"],"programs":["podcasts_2"],"categories":["podcasts_1"],"tags":["podcasts_232","podcasts_269","podcasts_271","podcasts_241","podcasts_99","podcasts_239","podcasts_236","podcasts_268","podcasts_265","podcasts_270","podcasts_261","podcasts_178","podcasts_122"],"featImg":"podcasts_731","label":"source_podcasts_706"},"podcasts_708":{"type":"posts","id":"podcasts_708","meta":{"index":"posts_1591205157","site":"podcasts","id":"708","score":null,"sort":[1603350180000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"if-i-ruled-the-world","title":"If I Ruled the World","publishDate":1603350180,"format":"aside","headTitle":"Truth Be Told | KQED Podcasts | KQED","labelTerm":{},"content":"\u003cp>\u003cimg class=\"size-medium wp-image-572 alignleft\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/77/2020/10/kTarot-Card-Season2_Ep17-KH.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"400\">\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Black women are, by and large, on the front lines of the political fight for democracy. Last year, we saw a record number of Black women serving in \u003ca href=\"https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/02/08/for-the-fifth-time-in-a-row-the-new-congress-is-the-most-racially-and-ethnically-diverse-ever/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Congress\u003c/a> and a record number of Black women serving at the \u003ca href=\"https://cawp.rutgers.edu/sites/default/files/resources/black-women-politics-2019.pdf\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">state level\u003c/a> in politics. There’s data that shows \u003ca href=\"https://www.google.com/search?q=Another+report+from+the+AAPI+Civic+Engagement+Fund+and+Groundswell+Fund+took+an+in-depth+look+at+the+2018+elections.&oq=Another+report+from+the+AAPI+Civic+Engagement+Fund+and+Groundswell+Fund+took+an+in-depth+look+at+the+2018+elections.&aqs=chrome..69i57.194j0j1&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Black, brown and Indigenous women\u003c/a> are in the trenches — as political activists, volunteers and everyday people — mobilizing Americans to get out and vote.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>This week, Tonya Mosley talks with award-winning journalist and friend, \u003ca href=\"https://farai.com/work/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Farai Chideya\u003c/a>, who knows both personally and professionally why Black women show up each and every time. Chideya has a new radio show called “\u003ca href=\"https://farai.com/our-body-politic/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Our Body Politic\u003c/a>” which unapologetically centers reporting on not just how women of color experience the major political events of today, but how they’re impacting those very issues.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Chideya calls women of color a “superdemographic.” What she means by that is, all women of color are people who can tip elections. “And as different as we are, we are all people who tend to get undervalued by the political system,” Chideya says. “Not hired as strategists, not given the advertising contracts to reach out to voters.” Because women of color are poorly marketed to and a misunderstood group compared to their political power, Chideya does not refer to the group as a “demographic” but rather a “superdemographic.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>Women of color are the secret sauce. We are the roux in the American gumbo. We are not just the parsley on the side of the plate. We are the base of the plate and we need to be understood as such. And, I would argue, Black women over the age of 70 are the secret, secret sauce.\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>Chideya believes that America is poorer intellectually and sociopolitically because the voices of Black and people of color have been excluded and censored. “We have to recognize that the act of truth-telling is an act of everyone bringing their gifts to the table and then fighting about how we write the first draft of history,” Chideya says. “It can't be told by any one group or any one person.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Still, Chideya and Mosley recognize that there needs to be a fight for a shared truth in order for a society and democracy to be preserved. Chideya created the term “psychic privacy fence,” which refers to people only being surrounded by others that are like them. “How you live is not the only way to live,” Chideya says. “And if you don't understand how other people live, you're never gonna understand America.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Chideya’s time as a journalist and political analyst made her aware that America was, in what she calls, a culture war. “People's decision-making was not based on logic — it was based on cultural affiliations. I like to think of elections as this great pageant of national belonging. And in a country this divided, people choose what kind of political affiliation they belong to,” Chideya says. “They will follow that sense of belonging off the cliff of logic.” As a journalist, Chideya believes it’s important to understand this part of the story, and not just the literal truths — understanding why people feel they belong.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>If we can understand why people's hearts are motivating them to act in a certain way, we become more able as journalists to tell the story of America and the world. We become more able as people to have compassion.\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>During election season Chideya is usually out in the field reporting and feels more informed about the heart and soul of America. “I do feel a little disconnected from how different demographics of people are making choices. I miss it and also, I don't miss it.” Chideya says she doesn’t miss the feeling of going to bed at night in a hotel room after a day where she was sometimes sexually harassed or racially harassed while out reporting. But, she does long for knowing what America is feeling. She has stayed in tune by spending time with elders. Chideya has many friends over the age of 90 — including her high school English teacher, Mrs. Louise Sims, who helped desegregate two different schools and has been married for 70 years. “It's people like her who I look to to fill my soul, mind and heart. So if you don't have any elders in your life, go make some friends who are elders. And if you're an elder, find some people who are younger to befriend you. You are needed.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In this pandemic, Chideya has been reflecting on the resentments her family has experienced due to racial injustice. “I'm actually processing a lot of stuff right now like I think a lot of people are, because I don't want to live in resentment. I want to live in abundance and opportunity.” For Chideya, this process allows her to reflect on her own resentments so she can continue doing the work without the heaviness of the past on her back. What is bringing Chideya joy during these times is being able to spend more time with her family. She hopes to tape oral histories of her mother. “She has many adventures, including being in the Peace Corps in the early 60s in Morocco with her sassy female friends, riding their mopeds. You know, Black women and women of color have been having adventures forever.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Episode transcript can be found \u003cstrong>\u003ca href=\"https://drive.google.com/file/d/17ORIqUY7h732doKGBeuzfq-t6abPUGYd/view?usp=sharing\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">here\u003c/a>\u003c/strong>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Episode Guests:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/farai?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Farai Chideya\u003c/a> (she/her), creator/host \"\u003ca href=\"https://farai.com/our-body-politic/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Our Body Politic\u003c/a>\" and award-winning journalist.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Reading:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://zora.medium.com/tagged/whats-at-stake\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\"What’s At Stake\u003c/a>\" series from Zora\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.americanprogress.org/issues/race/reports/2019/11/19/477309/women-color-collective-powerhouse-u-s-electorate/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\"Women of Color: A Collective Powerhouse in the U.S. Electorate\" report\u003c/a> from The Center for American Progress\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/oct/01/women-of-color-congress-us-elections-2020\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\"'We are living the issues': record number of women of color run for Congress\"\u003c/a> from The Guardian\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/13/opinion/megan-thee-stallion-black-women.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\"Megan Thee Stallion: Why I Speak Up for Black Women\"\u003c/a> via New York Times op-ed\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/16/magazine/black-vote.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\"How the Black Vote Became a Political Monolith\" \u003c/a>from The New York Times\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad floatright]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Listening:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://farai.com/our-body-politic/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Our Body Politic\u003c/a>” by Farai Chideya\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.thebgguide.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Brown Girls Guide to Politics\u003c/a>” podcast\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.cosmopolitan.com/entertainment/music/a34112394/best-political-podcasts/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\"The Best Political Podcasts to Help You Navigate This, Ahem, Chaotic Election Season\"\u003c/a> from the Cosmopolitan\u003c/p>\n\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":null,"status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1603382456,"stats":{"hasAudio":false,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":17,"wordCount":1084},"headData":{"title":"If I Ruled the World | KQED Podcasts","description":"Black women are, by and large, on the front lines of the political fight for democracy. Last year, we saw a record number of Black women serving in Congress and a record number of Black women serving at the state level in politics. There’s data that shows Black, brown and Indigenous women are in the","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":""},"disqusIdentifier":"708 https://ww2.kqed.org/podcasts/?p=708","disqusUrl":"https://ww2.kqed.org/podcasts/2020/10/22/if-i-ruled-the-world/","disqusTitle":"If I Ruled the World","source":"Truth Be Told","sourceUrl":"https://www.kqed.org/podcasts/truthbetold","audioUrl":"https://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/traffic.megaphone.fm/KQINC4460849620.mp3","nprByline":"Truth Be Told team","path":"/podcasts/708/if-i-ruled-the-world","audioDuration":1883000,"audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003cimg class=\"size-medium wp-image-572 alignleft\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/77/2020/10/kTarot-Card-Season2_Ep17-KH.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"400\">\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Black women are, by and large, on the front lines of the political fight for democracy. Last year, we saw a record number of Black women serving in \u003ca href=\"https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/02/08/for-the-fifth-time-in-a-row-the-new-congress-is-the-most-racially-and-ethnically-diverse-ever/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Congress\u003c/a> and a record number of Black women serving at the \u003ca href=\"https://cawp.rutgers.edu/sites/default/files/resources/black-women-politics-2019.pdf\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">state level\u003c/a> in politics. There’s data that shows \u003ca href=\"https://www.google.com/search?q=Another+report+from+the+AAPI+Civic+Engagement+Fund+and+Groundswell+Fund+took+an+in-depth+look+at+the+2018+elections.&oq=Another+report+from+the+AAPI+Civic+Engagement+Fund+and+Groundswell+Fund+took+an+in-depth+look+at+the+2018+elections.&aqs=chrome..69i57.194j0j1&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Black, brown and Indigenous women\u003c/a> are in the trenches — as political activists, volunteers and everyday people — mobilizing Americans to get out and vote.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>This week, Tonya Mosley talks with award-winning journalist and friend, \u003ca href=\"https://farai.com/work/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Farai Chideya\u003c/a>, who knows both personally and professionally why Black women show up each and every time. Chideya has a new radio show called “\u003ca href=\"https://farai.com/our-body-politic/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Our Body Politic\u003c/a>” which unapologetically centers reporting on not just how women of color experience the major political events of today, but how they’re impacting those very issues.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Chideya calls women of color a “superdemographic.” What she means by that is, all women of color are people who can tip elections. “And as different as we are, we are all people who tend to get undervalued by the political system,” Chideya says. “Not hired as strategists, not given the advertising contracts to reach out to voters.” Because women of color are poorly marketed to and a misunderstood group compared to their political power, Chideya does not refer to the group as a “demographic” but rather a “superdemographic.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>Women of color are the secret sauce. We are the roux in the American gumbo. We are not just the parsley on the side of the plate. We are the base of the plate and we need to be understood as such. And, I would argue, Black women over the age of 70 are the secret, secret sauce.\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>Chideya believes that America is poorer intellectually and sociopolitically because the voices of Black and people of color have been excluded and censored. “We have to recognize that the act of truth-telling is an act of everyone bringing their gifts to the table and then fighting about how we write the first draft of history,” Chideya says. “It can't be told by any one group or any one person.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Still, Chideya and Mosley recognize that there needs to be a fight for a shared truth in order for a society and democracy to be preserved. Chideya created the term “psychic privacy fence,” which refers to people only being surrounded by others that are like them. “How you live is not the only way to live,” Chideya says. “And if you don't understand how other people live, you're never gonna understand America.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Chideya’s time as a journalist and political analyst made her aware that America was, in what she calls, a culture war. “People's decision-making was not based on logic — it was based on cultural affiliations. I like to think of elections as this great pageant of national belonging. And in a country this divided, people choose what kind of political affiliation they belong to,” Chideya says. “They will follow that sense of belonging off the cliff of logic.” As a journalist, Chideya believes it’s important to understand this part of the story, and not just the literal truths — understanding why people feel they belong.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>If we can understand why people's hearts are motivating them to act in a certain way, we become more able as journalists to tell the story of America and the world. We become more able as people to have compassion.\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>During election season Chideya is usually out in the field reporting and feels more informed about the heart and soul of America. “I do feel a little disconnected from how different demographics of people are making choices. I miss it and also, I don't miss it.” Chideya says she doesn’t miss the feeling of going to bed at night in a hotel room after a day where she was sometimes sexually harassed or racially harassed while out reporting. But, she does long for knowing what America is feeling. She has stayed in tune by spending time with elders. Chideya has many friends over the age of 90 — including her high school English teacher, Mrs. Louise Sims, who helped desegregate two different schools and has been married for 70 years. “It's people like her who I look to to fill my soul, mind and heart. So if you don't have any elders in your life, go make some friends who are elders. And if you're an elder, find some people who are younger to befriend you. You are needed.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In this pandemic, Chideya has been reflecting on the resentments her family has experienced due to racial injustice. “I'm actually processing a lot of stuff right now like I think a lot of people are, because I don't want to live in resentment. I want to live in abundance and opportunity.” For Chideya, this process allows her to reflect on her own resentments so she can continue doing the work without the heaviness of the past on her back. What is bringing Chideya joy during these times is being able to spend more time with her family. She hopes to tape oral histories of her mother. “She has many adventures, including being in the Peace Corps in the early 60s in Morocco with her sassy female friends, riding their mopeds. You know, Black women and women of color have been having adventures forever.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Episode transcript can be found \u003cstrong>\u003ca href=\"https://drive.google.com/file/d/17ORIqUY7h732doKGBeuzfq-t6abPUGYd/view?usp=sharing\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">here\u003c/a>\u003c/strong>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Episode Guests:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/farai?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Farai Chideya\u003c/a> (she/her), creator/host \"\u003ca href=\"https://farai.com/our-body-politic/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Our Body Politic\u003c/a>\" and award-winning journalist.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Reading:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://zora.medium.com/tagged/whats-at-stake\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\"What’s At Stake\u003c/a>\" series from Zora\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.americanprogress.org/issues/race/reports/2019/11/19/477309/women-color-collective-powerhouse-u-s-electorate/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\"Women of Color: A Collective Powerhouse in the U.S. Electorate\" report\u003c/a> from The Center for American Progress\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/oct/01/women-of-color-congress-us-elections-2020\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\"'We are living the issues': record number of women of color run for Congress\"\u003c/a> from The Guardian\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/13/opinion/megan-thee-stallion-black-women.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\"Megan Thee Stallion: Why I Speak Up for Black Women\"\u003c/a> via New York Times op-ed\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/16/magazine/black-vote.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\"How the Black Vote Became a Political Monolith\" \u003c/a>from The New York Times\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"floatright"},"numeric":["floatright"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Listening:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://farai.com/our-body-politic/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Our Body Politic\u003c/a>” by Farai Chideya\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.thebgguide.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Brown Girls Guide to Politics\u003c/a>” podcast\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.cosmopolitan.com/entertainment/music/a34112394/best-political-podcasts/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">\"The Best Political Podcasts to Help You Navigate This, Ahem, Chaotic Election Season\"\u003c/a> from the Cosmopolitan\u003c/p>\n\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/podcasts/708/if-i-ruled-the-world","authors":["byline_podcasts_708"],"programs":["podcasts_2"],"categories":["podcasts_1"],"tags":["podcasts_252","podcasts_253","podcasts_244","podcasts_256","podcasts_245","podcasts_242","podcasts_247","podcasts_250","podcasts_243","podcasts_248","podcasts_255","podcasts_251","podcasts_249","podcasts_254","podcasts_246","podcasts_119","podcasts_90","podcasts_258","podcasts_98","podcasts_99","podcasts_257","podcasts_178","podcasts_15","podcasts_95"],"featImg":"podcasts_709","label":"source_podcasts_708"},"podcasts_682":{"type":"posts","id":"podcasts_682","meta":{"index":"posts_1591205157","site":"podcasts","id":"682","score":null,"sort":[1602140615000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"no-more-shame","title":"No More Shame","publishDate":1602140615,"format":"aside","headTitle":"Truth Be Told | KQED Podcasts | KQED","labelTerm":{},"content":"\u003cp>\u003cimg class=\"size-medium wp-image-572 alignleft\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/77/2020/10/RSTarot-Card-Season2_Ep16-tarot-KH-800x1382.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"400\">\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Here’s a truth: All of us know someone with mental illness, or experience it ourselves. Yet, the stigma remains.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>This week's question comes from Bri, a recent college graduate living with bipolar disorder and looking for a job. Host Tonya Mosley is joined by Wise One and New York Times Bestselling author \u003ca href=\"https://basseyikpi.com/about/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Bassey Ikpi\u003c/a>. In her memoir “\u003ca href=\"https://basseyikpi.com/books/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">I’m Telling the Truth But I’m Lying\u003c/a>,” Ikpi explores her life — as a Nigerian American immigrant, a Black woman, a slam poet, a mother, a daughter, an artist — through the lens of her mental health and diagnosis of bipolar II and anxiety.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The highs that came with her professional success were manic. And the lows, they were the can’t-get-out-of-bed, barely-able-to-walk-to-the-bathroom kind of lows. At 27-years-old, Bassey finally had a name for this thing that had ruled her life for years: bipolar II disorder.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp> \u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>\"It feels amazing and exhilarating and you feel powerful, like the most amazing person in the entire world. And that's a good feeling. But once you stay up there, it gets frightening because there is no down. And it feels like there's no ground beneath your feet. It is shocking because you're supposed to feel the ground. It also triggers paranoia and insomnia. People don't realize how physically uncomfortable it is. There's a physical discomfort that comes with it. That is what I was hoping to describe in the book…”\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>Alongside her memoir, she founded The Siwe Project, a nonprofit that promotes mental health awareness throughout the global Black community. This made Ikpi the perfect Wise One to offer our listener Bri advice on her situation:\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>“So looking for jobs has been like really hard just because it’s still COVID and like, I don't really have like an essential degree, I guess? My degree is in English and creative writing. And whenever I get to the ‘Do you have a disability?’ part, I see like all the bullet points; I'm just like...I mean, if you want to be technical, yes. But I always put no. As much as people like to say they're not going to discriminate against you, they definitely will if they feel like it. I just don't think people would take it seriously. I think people would look at me differently and treat me oddly. And I notice that whenever a job application is like, ‘Can you do this without reasonable accommodations?’ I'm just like the accommodation someone would need who, you know, wasn't physically able and versus where I would need are completely different. So for me to just mark ‘no, I can't do this without reasonable accommodations,’ it's weird because my accommodations don't look the same and I think that's very vague of them to ask people.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>My question is, how do I, as a graduate who is looking for jobs, navigate my disability and work?”\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>Ikpi herself does not check the disability box. “As much as I would love a world where mental illness was treated the exact same way as a physical disability, it's not,” she says. “And it's very easy for people to be dismissive of it.” Despite people’s best intentions, there is a bias.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But Ikpi’s first piece of advice is to get the help of a medical professional. That’s because coping mechanisms function more like crutches that can fall apart because of how unpredictable the illness can be. “You could be fine for five, six, seven years and then just one morning, you're not,” Ikpi says. She recommends investing time in finding a therapist who works for you.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“A therapist friend says it's like finding a hairdresser or a barber,” Ikpi says. “You have to keep trying to find the right one, but if you need to get your hair done today then find someone who can help today. There are certain things like emergency situations where you just need to talk to somebody when you're either a danger to yourself or others. And, you need to talk. The therapist you see may not be the right one, but you're not married to them.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Finding a trusted medical professional would also illuminate what your needs are so you can then communicate to the employer. Or use these new insights in your assessment of the job being a good fit.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>“I understand that feeling useful and productive right now feels like what we need to be doing. If it is possible for you to take a step back and not put so much pressure on yourself to get a job because you graduated, or to get a job because someone is telling you to, then take that step back because there's nothing that's more important than you and your mental health.”\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>Ikpi’s final words to Bri: “I think that especially Black women, we get so into this excellence. I tell people all the time, I am fine with Black mediocrity. Black excellence is exhausting. And it is a lot to live up to. So if you're Black average, fantastic! Let's do that, too. Let's celebrate that. Take your time. If you just graduated college, you have time, Sis. I promise you.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Episode transcript can be found \u003cstrong>\u003ca href=\"https://drive.google.com/file/d/1vOSlfDat9y_SsBlmiJtZXIkPaKWeNRFq/view?usp=sharing\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">here\u003c/a>\u003c/strong>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Episode Guests:\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://basseyikpi.com/about/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Bassey Ikpi\u003c/a>, NYT bestselling author for \"I’m Telling the Truth But I’m Lying\" and founder of The Siwe Project.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Recommended Reading:\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://basseyikpi.com/books/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">I’m Telling the Truth But I’m Lying\u003c/a>” by Bassey Ikpi\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/35840657-heart-berries?from_search=true&from_srp=true&qid=Rwh1qcZZx1&rank=3\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Heart Berries\u003c/a>” by Terese Marie Mailhot\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/40121993-the-collected-schizophrenias\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Collected Schizophrenias: Essays\u003c/a>” by Esmé Weijun Wang\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/62257.Willow_Weep_for_Me?from_search=true&from_srp=true&qid=ChEu1QImPJ&rank=1\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Willow Weep for Me: A Black Woman's Journey Through Depression\u003c/a>” by Meri Nana-Ama Danquah\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/30211990-dear-friend-from-my-life-i-write-to-you-in-your-life?from_search=true&from_srp=true&qid=4Nj68RLafc&rank=1\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Dear Friend, from My Life I Write to You in Your Life\u003c/a>” by Yiyun Li\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/22095699-my-body-is-a-book-of-rules?from_search=true&from_srp=true&qid=dIFFffUdgU&rank=1\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">My Body Is a Book of Rules\u003c/a>” by Elissa Washuta\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/40680094-the-body-papers?from_search=true&from_srp=true&qid=VWs1iHSyt5&rank=1\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Body Papers\u003c/a>” by Grace Talusan\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/42269208-i-ve-never-been-un-happier?from_search=true&from_srp=true&qid=BcM20v8PqI&rank=1\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">I've never been (Un)happier\u003c/a>” by Shaheen Bhatt\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.bustle.com/p/12-women-of-color-native-authors-open-up-about-why-they-write-about-mental-illness-2884690\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">12 Women Of Color & Native Women Writers Share Why They Write About Mental Illness\u003c/a> by Patrice Caldwell\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad floatright]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Recommended Listening:\u003cbr>\n\"\u003ca href=\"https://therapyforblackgirls.com/2020/01/09/session-92-life-bipolar-disorder/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Session 92: Life With A Bipolar Disorder\u003c/a>\" from “Therapy for Black Girls”\u003cbr>\n\"\u003ca href=\"https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/of-bipolar-and-black-identity/id1426176463\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Of Bipolar and Black Identity\u003c/a>\" podcast\u003cbr>\n\"\u003ca href=\"https://anchor.fm/talktoni\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Black and Bipolar in Quarantine\u003c/a>\" from “Black and Bipolar” podcast\u003cbr>\n\"\u003ca href=\"https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cDovL2ZlZWRzLndueWMub3JnL2NvbWUtdGhyb3VnaA/episode/NmUzMGJkNmMtMDM3Zi00OTdkLTkzZTUtMjY0M2YwNDMzY2U5?sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjk4PWK7qDsAhUClJ4KHQm4CFsQkfYCegQIARAF\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Episode 9: Bassey Ikpi Didn’t Enter the World Broken\u003c/a>\" From “Come Through with Rebecca Carroll”\u003cbr>\n\"\u003ca href=\"https://ourselvesblack.com/ob-podcast/2018/7/24/ep-1-h7596-9dhgz-a9p3l-6wtms-cj6kl-s5bne-g6nkt-m6fty-dnwh6-8c2dl-fcnps\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Dr. Ericka Goodwin: Non-Medication Treatments And Choosing And Evaluating Providers Part. 1 and Part 2\u003c/a>\" from “Ourselves Black” podcast\u003c/p>\n\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":null,"status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1602129350,"stats":{"hasAudio":false,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":20,"wordCount":1168},"headData":{"title":"No More Shame | KQED Podcasts","description":"Here’s a truth: All of us know someone with mental illness, or experience it ourselves. Yet, the stigma remains. This week’s question comes from Bri, a recent college graduate living with bipolar disorder and looking for a job. Host Tonya Mosley is joined by Wise One and New York Times Bestselling author Bassey Ikpi. In","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":""},"disqusIdentifier":"682 https://ww2.kqed.org/podcasts/?p=682","disqusUrl":"https://ww2.kqed.org/podcasts/2020/10/08/no-more-shame/","disqusTitle":"No More Shame","source":"Truth Be Told","sourceUrl":"https://www.kqed.org/podcasts/truthbetold","audioUrl":"https://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/traffic.megaphone.fm/KQINC5077658719.mp3 ","nprByline":"Truth Be Told team","path":"/podcasts/682/no-more-shame","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003cimg class=\"size-medium wp-image-572 alignleft\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/77/2020/10/RSTarot-Card-Season2_Ep16-tarot-KH-800x1382.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"400\">\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Here’s a truth: All of us know someone with mental illness, or experience it ourselves. Yet, the stigma remains.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>This week's question comes from Bri, a recent college graduate living with bipolar disorder and looking for a job. Host Tonya Mosley is joined by Wise One and New York Times Bestselling author \u003ca href=\"https://basseyikpi.com/about/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Bassey Ikpi\u003c/a>. In her memoir “\u003ca href=\"https://basseyikpi.com/books/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">I’m Telling the Truth But I’m Lying\u003c/a>,” Ikpi explores her life — as a Nigerian American immigrant, a Black woman, a slam poet, a mother, a daughter, an artist — through the lens of her mental health and diagnosis of bipolar II and anxiety.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The highs that came with her professional success were manic. And the lows, they were the can’t-get-out-of-bed, barely-able-to-walk-to-the-bathroom kind of lows. At 27-years-old, Bassey finally had a name for this thing that had ruled her life for years: bipolar II disorder.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp> \u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>\"It feels amazing and exhilarating and you feel powerful, like the most amazing person in the entire world. And that's a good feeling. But once you stay up there, it gets frightening because there is no down. And it feels like there's no ground beneath your feet. It is shocking because you're supposed to feel the ground. It also triggers paranoia and insomnia. People don't realize how physically uncomfortable it is. There's a physical discomfort that comes with it. That is what I was hoping to describe in the book…”\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>Alongside her memoir, she founded The Siwe Project, a nonprofit that promotes mental health awareness throughout the global Black community. This made Ikpi the perfect Wise One to offer our listener Bri advice on her situation:\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>“So looking for jobs has been like really hard just because it’s still COVID and like, I don't really have like an essential degree, I guess? My degree is in English and creative writing. And whenever I get to the ‘Do you have a disability?’ part, I see like all the bullet points; I'm just like...I mean, if you want to be technical, yes. But I always put no. As much as people like to say they're not going to discriminate against you, they definitely will if they feel like it. I just don't think people would take it seriously. I think people would look at me differently and treat me oddly. And I notice that whenever a job application is like, ‘Can you do this without reasonable accommodations?’ I'm just like the accommodation someone would need who, you know, wasn't physically able and versus where I would need are completely different. So for me to just mark ‘no, I can't do this without reasonable accommodations,’ it's weird because my accommodations don't look the same and I think that's very vague of them to ask people.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>My question is, how do I, as a graduate who is looking for jobs, navigate my disability and work?”\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>Ikpi herself does not check the disability box. “As much as I would love a world where mental illness was treated the exact same way as a physical disability, it's not,” she says. “And it's very easy for people to be dismissive of it.” Despite people’s best intentions, there is a bias.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But Ikpi’s first piece of advice is to get the help of a medical professional. That’s because coping mechanisms function more like crutches that can fall apart because of how unpredictable the illness can be. “You could be fine for five, six, seven years and then just one morning, you're not,” Ikpi says. She recommends investing time in finding a therapist who works for you.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“A therapist friend says it's like finding a hairdresser or a barber,” Ikpi says. “You have to keep trying to find the right one, but if you need to get your hair done today then find someone who can help today. There are certain things like emergency situations where you just need to talk to somebody when you're either a danger to yourself or others. And, you need to talk. The therapist you see may not be the right one, but you're not married to them.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Finding a trusted medical professional would also illuminate what your needs are so you can then communicate to the employer. Or use these new insights in your assessment of the job being a good fit.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>“I understand that feeling useful and productive right now feels like what we need to be doing. If it is possible for you to take a step back and not put so much pressure on yourself to get a job because you graduated, or to get a job because someone is telling you to, then take that step back because there's nothing that's more important than you and your mental health.”\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>Ikpi’s final words to Bri: “I think that especially Black women, we get so into this excellence. I tell people all the time, I am fine with Black mediocrity. Black excellence is exhausting. And it is a lot to live up to. So if you're Black average, fantastic! Let's do that, too. Let's celebrate that. Take your time. If you just graduated college, you have time, Sis. I promise you.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Episode transcript can be found \u003cstrong>\u003ca href=\"https://drive.google.com/file/d/1vOSlfDat9y_SsBlmiJtZXIkPaKWeNRFq/view?usp=sharing\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">here\u003c/a>\u003c/strong>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Episode Guests:\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://basseyikpi.com/about/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Bassey Ikpi\u003c/a>, NYT bestselling author for \"I’m Telling the Truth But I’m Lying\" and founder of The Siwe Project.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Recommended Reading:\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://basseyikpi.com/books/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">I’m Telling the Truth But I’m Lying\u003c/a>” by Bassey Ikpi\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/35840657-heart-berries?from_search=true&from_srp=true&qid=Rwh1qcZZx1&rank=3\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Heart Berries\u003c/a>” by Terese Marie Mailhot\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/40121993-the-collected-schizophrenias\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Collected Schizophrenias: Essays\u003c/a>” by Esmé Weijun Wang\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/62257.Willow_Weep_for_Me?from_search=true&from_srp=true&qid=ChEu1QImPJ&rank=1\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Willow Weep for Me: A Black Woman's Journey Through Depression\u003c/a>” by Meri Nana-Ama Danquah\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/30211990-dear-friend-from-my-life-i-write-to-you-in-your-life?from_search=true&from_srp=true&qid=4Nj68RLafc&rank=1\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Dear Friend, from My Life I Write to You in Your Life\u003c/a>” by Yiyun Li\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/22095699-my-body-is-a-book-of-rules?from_search=true&from_srp=true&qid=dIFFffUdgU&rank=1\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">My Body Is a Book of Rules\u003c/a>” by Elissa Washuta\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/40680094-the-body-papers?from_search=true&from_srp=true&qid=VWs1iHSyt5&rank=1\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Body Papers\u003c/a>” by Grace Talusan\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/42269208-i-ve-never-been-un-happier?from_search=true&from_srp=true&qid=BcM20v8PqI&rank=1\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">I've never been (Un)happier\u003c/a>” by Shaheen Bhatt\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.bustle.com/p/12-women-of-color-native-authors-open-up-about-why-they-write-about-mental-illness-2884690\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">12 Women Of Color & Native Women Writers Share Why They Write About Mental Illness\u003c/a> by Patrice Caldwell\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"floatright"},"numeric":["floatright"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Recommended Listening:\u003cbr>\n\"\u003ca href=\"https://therapyforblackgirls.com/2020/01/09/session-92-life-bipolar-disorder/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Session 92: Life With A Bipolar Disorder\u003c/a>\" from “Therapy for Black Girls”\u003cbr>\n\"\u003ca href=\"https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/of-bipolar-and-black-identity/id1426176463\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Of Bipolar and Black Identity\u003c/a>\" podcast\u003cbr>\n\"\u003ca href=\"https://anchor.fm/talktoni\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Black and Bipolar in Quarantine\u003c/a>\" from “Black and Bipolar” podcast\u003cbr>\n\"\u003ca href=\"https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cDovL2ZlZWRzLndueWMub3JnL2NvbWUtdGhyb3VnaA/episode/NmUzMGJkNmMtMDM3Zi00OTdkLTkzZTUtMjY0M2YwNDMzY2U5?sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjk4PWK7qDsAhUClJ4KHQm4CFsQkfYCegQIARAF\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Episode 9: Bassey Ikpi Didn’t Enter the World Broken\u003c/a>\" From “Come Through with Rebecca Carroll”\u003cbr>\n\"\u003ca href=\"https://ourselvesblack.com/ob-podcast/2018/7/24/ep-1-h7596-9dhgz-a9p3l-6wtms-cj6kl-s5bne-g6nkt-m6fty-dnwh6-8c2dl-fcnps\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Dr. Ericka Goodwin: Non-Medication Treatments And Choosing And Evaluating Providers Part. 1 and Part 2\u003c/a>\" from “Ourselves Black” podcast\u003c/p>\n\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/podcasts/682/no-more-shame","authors":["byline_podcasts_682"],"programs":["podcasts_2"],"categories":["podcasts_1"],"tags":["podcasts_140","podcasts_119","podcasts_90","podcasts_229","podcasts_219","podcasts_216","podcasts_228","podcasts_222","podcasts_223","podcasts_194","podcasts_221","podcasts_225","podcasts_226","podcasts_217","podcasts_227","podcasts_178","podcasts_15","podcasts_220","podcasts_218","podcasts_116","podcasts_224","podcasts_95","podcasts_122"],"featImg":"podcasts_685","label":"source_podcasts_682"},"podcasts_668":{"type":"posts","id":"podcasts_668","meta":{"index":"posts_1591205157","site":"podcasts","id":"668","score":null,"sort":[1600931001000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"our-lives-matter-too","title":"Our Lives Matter, Too","publishDate":1600931001,"format":"aside","headTitle":"Truth Be Told | KQED Podcasts | KQED","labelTerm":{},"content":"\u003cp>\u003cimg class=\"size-medium wp-image-572 alignleft\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/77/2020/09/Tarot-Card-Season2_Episode14-KH-800x1382.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"400\">\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>To live with a disability is to understand what it truly means to be vulnerable and interdependent. That's what Alice Wong wants you to know. She is an activist, podcaster and founder of the Disability Visibility Project.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"We are modern day oracles. It's time people listened to us,\" she says. At the start of the pandemic, Wong wrote a Twitter \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/SFdirewolf/status/1240269719313068032\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">thread\u003c/a> highlighting how the public health crisis confirmed who society deems disposable, unworthy of assistance, attention and treatment due to the rationing and shortage of ventilators for critically ill patients in the United States. Wong uses a non-invasive form of ventilation called a Bipap. Her ventilator is part of her body and she cannot be without it for longer than an hour due to her neuromuscular disability. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>When Wong was young, she dreamed of elevating voices of disabled people because she did not see them represented in media. This summer, she released a book titled, “\u003ca href=\"https://disabilityvisibilityproject.com/book/\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Disability Visibility: First Person Stories from the 21st Century\u003c/a>” to recenter the people Wong cares about and that she feels people should care about too. \u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>The book was really edited for the purpose of pleasing disabled audiences. I do challenge nondisabled readers saying, ‘You know there are things in this book that might make you uncomfortable. There’s maybe terms you never heard of and that’s precisely the point — to not have to explain it to you because we should be able to present ourselves as we are.- Alice Wong \u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>Wong joined Tonya Mosley to talk about her book and how \u003ca href=\"https://disabilityvisibilityproject.com/2015/01/19/disability-justice-and-social-justice-entwined-histories-and-futures/\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">disability justice\u003c/a> is tied to the Black Lives Matter movement. “I truly am kind of tired of having to make the case that my life has worth and quality the way it is, just as it is right now,” Wong says. “We really have seen who is valued and clearly Black, brown, indigenous people are considered disposable. Disabled people are considered disposable when we hear the media and hear our elected officials use terms like “acceptable losses” and “high risk people.” \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Wong says that although disabled people are a part of every community, white supremacy upholds ableism and tries to regulate what it means to be “normal.” “Everything about normal behavior is very much based on a nondisabled [person],” says Wong. “So when people are different, they navigate through the world [and], they communicate differently. That’s when these points of violence often happen.” For Wong, systems that incarcerate and trap people uphold this disciplining, which is often racialized. For example, Wong points to the many Black and disabled people killed by police and how often, their disability is ignored. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Wong is elevating the voices of disabled people in such a rich way across all platforms. That is why we chose her as this week’s Wise One.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>This week’s question came from an anonymous listener: \u003cstrong>“I have a rare brain condition called \u003ca href=\"https://www.aans.org/en/Patients/Neurosurgical-Conditions-and-Treatments/Chiari-Malformation\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Chiari Malformation\u003c/a>. And I don't know what ways I can educate my friends and family without making them feel like I'm shoving information down their throats. Help, please.” \u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Chiari Malformation is a condition where brain tissue extends into the spinal canal. There are various types of Chiari Malformation but \u003ca href=\"https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseases/chiari-malformation-type-i\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">common symptoms\u003c/a> are muscle weakness, lack of balance or abnormal reflexes, nerve problems, difficulty swallowing and sleep apnea. Long-term impacts can be paralysis, damage to muscles or nerves, pain and a pocket of spinal fluid in the spinal cord or brain stem. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“One of the biggest challenges for people with invisible disabilities is the fact that their families and friends can’t recognize how serious these are,” says Wong. “Or, oftentimes they don’t believe the disability and say, ‘You look healthy,’ or ‘You look fine.’ I think that's part of the challenge.” Wong says this is a big source of emotional labor that disabled people have to do all the time. “It’s always like, ‘No, actually this is really difficult’ or ‘No, what you see is not obvious.’”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Here are Alice Wong’s tips:\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Tip #1 Educate folks in smaller doses \u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Wong believes long lectures don’t work but preparing some information beforehand may be useful. Her advice is to prepare a sheet of information in a Google Doc describing your disability or condition. Add things you think they should know about and share the doc. Wong says you can send it with a message that says something like, \"Hey, if you want to learn more about what I’m going through and just some of the basics, here it is.” This way, Wong says, you don’t have to constantly repeat yourself and can prevent exhaustion. Another option is when you are having a bad day related to your disability, sharing with a loved one what is happening. Lastly, Wong suggests being selective about when you feel you can take on the responsibility of explaining because it can be draining. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Tip #2 Gently push back\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Because educating people on your disability can be emotionally exhausting, Wong says you can gently push back. “The information is already out there for the questions that I receive. So I would invite them to do the work because I also feel like this is not my responsibility.” \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Tip #3 Be honest about how their actions are impacting you\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“You know there are times where I felt hurt or excluded by friends or family members who are not disabled,” says Wong. “And it's just so frustrating all the time to try to educate people. So at least one of the ways to try to reach people is to really be honest about how their actions are impacting you. Maybe start with that first and then go with the educational piece.” Some suggested language: ‘What you said to me, you may not realize it, but it was really painful and this is why.’” \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Wong says you can also try to get loved ones to understand why they should learn more. She cautions that this is a very gradual process and won’t happen overnight. However, being honest and vulnerable with loved ones is really important. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Sometimes disabled or chronically ill people are not at a place yet where they feel permission or okay in saying, ‘This is what I need right now. And this may change in the future, but at this point in time, I need you all to back off,’ or ‘I need you all to stop making assumptions,’ or ‘I need you all to stop feeling sorry for me.” \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Wong says there is a fear of hearing family and friends’ responses but part of the process is accepting that loved ones will understand. “That's one thing about being disabled, it's almost like a filter where you really see the people who really have your back,” Wong says. “Your relationship with them may change, but if they really care about you they’re going to be with you or just learn to adjust.” Wong also advises letting loved ones know that you are there for them in their learning process. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Episode transcript can be found \u003cstrong>\u003ca href=\"http://shorturl.at/abxEP\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">here\u003c/a>\u003c/strong>. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Episode Guests:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/SFdirewolf\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Alice Wong \u003c/a>(she/her) is a disabled activist, media maker, and consultant based in San Francisco.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Reading:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://disabilityvisibilityproject.com/book/\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Disability Visibility: First Person Stories from the 21st Century\u003c/a>, edited by Alice Wong\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://docs.google.com/document/d/1mWz84Ro0cq5YEPfg2-gXoR-B-T1fCWEIqz_0yZXs1jU/edit\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Discussion guide\u003c/a> and \u003ca href=\"https://docs.google.com/document/d/180BSG2IEZHNOPhp9uH7dG_N6YLe9eNvkeS_ry6tEZJ0/edit\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">plain language summary\u003c/a> of the book. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"https://www.refinery29.com/en-us/2020/07/9920985/black-poc-disability-photos-jillian-mercado?utm_source=instagram.com&utm_medium=r29somos&utm_campaign=planoly\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">I’m Disabled & I Refuse To Be Your Inspiration\u003c/a> by Jillian Mercado\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.teenvogue.com/story/black-disabled-lives-matter\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Black Disabled Lives Matter: We Can't Erase Disability in #BLM\u003c/a> by Sarah Kim\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://disabilityvisibilityproject.com/resist/\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Resistance and Hope: Essays by Disabled People\u003c/a>, edited by Alice Wong\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/38402046-care-work\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Care Work: Dreaming Disability Justice \u003c/a>by Leah Lakshmi Piepzna-Samarasinha\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/476491.Too_Late_to_Die_Young\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Too Late to Die Young: Nearly True Tales from a Life \u003c/a>by Harriet McBryde Johnson\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/400560.Crip_Theory\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Crip Theory: Cultural Signs of Queerness and Disability\u003c/a> by Robert McRuer, Michael Bérubé\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/24892461-bodymap\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Bodymap \u003c/a>by Leah Lakshmi Piepzna-Samarasinha\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/50682.The_Cancer_Journals\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">The Cancer Journals\u003c/a> by Audre Lorde\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/91760.The_Diary_of_Frida_Kahlo\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">The Diary of Frida Kahlo: An Intimate Self-Portrait by Frida Kahlo\u003c/a>, Carlos Fuentes, Sarah M. Lowe\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.dukeupress.edu/exile-and-pride\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Exile and Pride: Disability, Queerness, and Liberation\u003c/a> by Eli Clare\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/blackness-and-disability-christopher-m-bell/1110792564\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Blackness and Disability: Critical Examinations and Cultural Interventions\u003c/a>, edited by Christopher Bells\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/967095.The_Ultimate_Guide_to_Sex_and_Disability\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">The Ultimate Guide to Sex and Disability: For All of Us Who Live with Disabilities, Chronic Pain, and Illness\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\nby Miriam Kaufman, Cory Silverberg, Fran Odette\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://thebodyisnotanapology.com/\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">The body is not an apology \u003c/a>blog\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.sinsinvalid.org/blog/10-principles-of-disability-justice/\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">10 Principles of Disability Justice\u003c/a> by Sins Invalid\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad floatright]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Listening:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://disabilityvisibilityproject.com/podcast-2/\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Disability Visibility\u003c/a>” by Alice Wong\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/werkit/articles/podcasting-disability-justice\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Podcasting for Disability Justice\u003c/a> by Bri M.\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"http://www.powernotpity.com/\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Power Not Pity\u003c/a>”\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/2020/07/02/886686992/the-disability-rights-movement-30-years-after-the-ada\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">The Disability Rights Movement, 30 Years After The ADA\u003c/a> from NPR\u003c/p>\n\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":null,"status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1601311405,"stats":{"hasAudio":false,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":28,"wordCount":1504},"headData":{"title":"Our Lives Matter, Too | KQED Podcasts","description":"To live with a disability is to understand what it truly means to be vulnerable and interdependent. That's what Alice Wong wants you to know. She is an activist, podcaster and founder of the Disability Visibility Project. "We are modern day oracles. It's time people listened to us," she says. At the start of the","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":""},"disqusIdentifier":"668 https://ww2.kqed.org/podcasts/?p=668","disqusUrl":"https://ww2.kqed.org/podcasts/2020/09/24/our-lives-matter-too/","disqusTitle":"Our Lives Matter, Too","source":"Truth Be Told","sourceUrl":"https://www.kqed.org/podcasts/truthbetold","audioUrl":"https://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/traffic.megaphone.fm/KQINC5791664924.mp3?updated=1600809722","nprByline":"Truth Be Told team","path":"/podcasts/668/our-lives-matter-too","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003cimg class=\"size-medium wp-image-572 alignleft\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/77/2020/09/Tarot-Card-Season2_Episode14-KH-800x1382.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"400\">\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>To live with a disability is to understand what it truly means to be vulnerable and interdependent. That's what Alice Wong wants you to know. She is an activist, podcaster and founder of the Disability Visibility Project.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"We are modern day oracles. It's time people listened to us,\" she says. At the start of the pandemic, Wong wrote a Twitter \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/SFdirewolf/status/1240269719313068032\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">thread\u003c/a> highlighting how the public health crisis confirmed who society deems disposable, unworthy of assistance, attention and treatment due to the rationing and shortage of ventilators for critically ill patients in the United States. Wong uses a non-invasive form of ventilation called a Bipap. Her ventilator is part of her body and she cannot be without it for longer than an hour due to her neuromuscular disability. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>When Wong was young, she dreamed of elevating voices of disabled people because she did not see them represented in media. This summer, she released a book titled, “\u003ca href=\"https://disabilityvisibilityproject.com/book/\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Disability Visibility: First Person Stories from the 21st Century\u003c/a>” to recenter the people Wong cares about and that she feels people should care about too. \u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>The book was really edited for the purpose of pleasing disabled audiences. I do challenge nondisabled readers saying, ‘You know there are things in this book that might make you uncomfortable. There’s maybe terms you never heard of and that’s precisely the point — to not have to explain it to you because we should be able to present ourselves as we are.- Alice Wong \u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>Wong joined Tonya Mosley to talk about her book and how \u003ca href=\"https://disabilityvisibilityproject.com/2015/01/19/disability-justice-and-social-justice-entwined-histories-and-futures/\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">disability justice\u003c/a> is tied to the Black Lives Matter movement. “I truly am kind of tired of having to make the case that my life has worth and quality the way it is, just as it is right now,” Wong says. “We really have seen who is valued and clearly Black, brown, indigenous people are considered disposable. Disabled people are considered disposable when we hear the media and hear our elected officials use terms like “acceptable losses” and “high risk people.” \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Wong says that although disabled people are a part of every community, white supremacy upholds ableism and tries to regulate what it means to be “normal.” “Everything about normal behavior is very much based on a nondisabled [person],” says Wong. “So when people are different, they navigate through the world [and], they communicate differently. That’s when these points of violence often happen.” For Wong, systems that incarcerate and trap people uphold this disciplining, which is often racialized. For example, Wong points to the many Black and disabled people killed by police and how often, their disability is ignored. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Wong is elevating the voices of disabled people in such a rich way across all platforms. That is why we chose her as this week’s Wise One.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>This week’s question came from an anonymous listener: \u003cstrong>“I have a rare brain condition called \u003ca href=\"https://www.aans.org/en/Patients/Neurosurgical-Conditions-and-Treatments/Chiari-Malformation\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Chiari Malformation\u003c/a>. And I don't know what ways I can educate my friends and family without making them feel like I'm shoving information down their throats. Help, please.” \u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Chiari Malformation is a condition where brain tissue extends into the spinal canal. There are various types of Chiari Malformation but \u003ca href=\"https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseases/chiari-malformation-type-i\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">common symptoms\u003c/a> are muscle weakness, lack of balance or abnormal reflexes, nerve problems, difficulty swallowing and sleep apnea. Long-term impacts can be paralysis, damage to muscles or nerves, pain and a pocket of spinal fluid in the spinal cord or brain stem. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“One of the biggest challenges for people with invisible disabilities is the fact that their families and friends can’t recognize how serious these are,” says Wong. “Or, oftentimes they don’t believe the disability and say, ‘You look healthy,’ or ‘You look fine.’ I think that's part of the challenge.” Wong says this is a big source of emotional labor that disabled people have to do all the time. “It’s always like, ‘No, actually this is really difficult’ or ‘No, what you see is not obvious.’”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Here are Alice Wong’s tips:\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Tip #1 Educate folks in smaller doses \u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Wong believes long lectures don’t work but preparing some information beforehand may be useful. Her advice is to prepare a sheet of information in a Google Doc describing your disability or condition. Add things you think they should know about and share the doc. Wong says you can send it with a message that says something like, \"Hey, if you want to learn more about what I’m going through and just some of the basics, here it is.” This way, Wong says, you don’t have to constantly repeat yourself and can prevent exhaustion. Another option is when you are having a bad day related to your disability, sharing with a loved one what is happening. Lastly, Wong suggests being selective about when you feel you can take on the responsibility of explaining because it can be draining. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Tip #2 Gently push back\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Because educating people on your disability can be emotionally exhausting, Wong says you can gently push back. “The information is already out there for the questions that I receive. So I would invite them to do the work because I also feel like this is not my responsibility.” \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Tip #3 Be honest about how their actions are impacting you\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“You know there are times where I felt hurt or excluded by friends or family members who are not disabled,” says Wong. “And it's just so frustrating all the time to try to educate people. So at least one of the ways to try to reach people is to really be honest about how their actions are impacting you. Maybe start with that first and then go with the educational piece.” Some suggested language: ‘What you said to me, you may not realize it, but it was really painful and this is why.’” \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Wong says you can also try to get loved ones to understand why they should learn more. She cautions that this is a very gradual process and won’t happen overnight. However, being honest and vulnerable with loved ones is really important. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Sometimes disabled or chronically ill people are not at a place yet where they feel permission or okay in saying, ‘This is what I need right now. And this may change in the future, but at this point in time, I need you all to back off,’ or ‘I need you all to stop making assumptions,’ or ‘I need you all to stop feeling sorry for me.” \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Wong says there is a fear of hearing family and friends’ responses but part of the process is accepting that loved ones will understand. “That's one thing about being disabled, it's almost like a filter where you really see the people who really have your back,” Wong says. “Your relationship with them may change, but if they really care about you they’re going to be with you or just learn to adjust.” Wong also advises letting loved ones know that you are there for them in their learning process. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Episode transcript can be found \u003cstrong>\u003ca href=\"http://shorturl.at/abxEP\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">here\u003c/a>\u003c/strong>. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Episode Guests:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/SFdirewolf\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Alice Wong \u003c/a>(she/her) is a disabled activist, media maker, and consultant based in San Francisco.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Reading:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://disabilityvisibilityproject.com/book/\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Disability Visibility: First Person Stories from the 21st Century\u003c/a>, edited by Alice Wong\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://docs.google.com/document/d/1mWz84Ro0cq5YEPfg2-gXoR-B-T1fCWEIqz_0yZXs1jU/edit\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Discussion guide\u003c/a> and \u003ca href=\"https://docs.google.com/document/d/180BSG2IEZHNOPhp9uH7dG_N6YLe9eNvkeS_ry6tEZJ0/edit\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">plain language summary\u003c/a> of the book. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"https://www.refinery29.com/en-us/2020/07/9920985/black-poc-disability-photos-jillian-mercado?utm_source=instagram.com&utm_medium=r29somos&utm_campaign=planoly\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">I’m Disabled & I Refuse To Be Your Inspiration\u003c/a> by Jillian Mercado\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.teenvogue.com/story/black-disabled-lives-matter\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Black Disabled Lives Matter: We Can't Erase Disability in #BLM\u003c/a> by Sarah Kim\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://disabilityvisibilityproject.com/resist/\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Resistance and Hope: Essays by Disabled People\u003c/a>, edited by Alice Wong\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/38402046-care-work\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Care Work: Dreaming Disability Justice \u003c/a>by Leah Lakshmi Piepzna-Samarasinha\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/476491.Too_Late_to_Die_Young\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Too Late to Die Young: Nearly True Tales from a Life \u003c/a>by Harriet McBryde Johnson\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/400560.Crip_Theory\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Crip Theory: Cultural Signs of Queerness and Disability\u003c/a> by Robert McRuer, Michael Bérubé\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/24892461-bodymap\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Bodymap \u003c/a>by Leah Lakshmi Piepzna-Samarasinha\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/50682.The_Cancer_Journals\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">The Cancer Journals\u003c/a> by Audre Lorde\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/91760.The_Diary_of_Frida_Kahlo\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">The Diary of Frida Kahlo: An Intimate Self-Portrait by Frida Kahlo\u003c/a>, Carlos Fuentes, Sarah M. Lowe\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.dukeupress.edu/exile-and-pride\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Exile and Pride: Disability, Queerness, and Liberation\u003c/a> by Eli Clare\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/blackness-and-disability-christopher-m-bell/1110792564\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Blackness and Disability: Critical Examinations and Cultural Interventions\u003c/a>, edited by Christopher Bells\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/967095.The_Ultimate_Guide_to_Sex_and_Disability\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">The Ultimate Guide to Sex and Disability: For All of Us Who Live with Disabilities, Chronic Pain, and Illness\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\nby Miriam Kaufman, Cory Silverberg, Fran Odette\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://thebodyisnotanapology.com/\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">The body is not an apology \u003c/a>blog\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.sinsinvalid.org/blog/10-principles-of-disability-justice/\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">10 Principles of Disability Justice\u003c/a> by Sins Invalid\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"floatright"},"numeric":["floatright"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Listening:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"https://disabilityvisibilityproject.com/podcast-2/\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Disability Visibility\u003c/a>” by Alice Wong\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/werkit/articles/podcasting-disability-justice\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Podcasting for Disability Justice\u003c/a> by Bri M.\u003cbr>\n“\u003ca href=\"http://www.powernotpity.com/\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Power Not Pity\u003c/a>”\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/2020/07/02/886686992/the-disability-rights-movement-30-years-after-the-ada\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">The Disability Rights Movement, 30 Years After The ADA\u003c/a> from NPR\u003c/p>\n\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/podcasts/668/our-lives-matter-too","authors":["byline_podcasts_668"],"programs":["podcasts_2"],"categories":["podcasts_1"],"tags":["podcasts_213","podcasts_212","podcasts_140","podcasts_202","podcasts_119","podcasts_90","podcasts_210","podcasts_206","podcasts_91","podcasts_207","podcasts_211","podcasts_208","podcasts_99","podcasts_204","podcasts_205","podcasts_203","podcasts_129","podcasts_178","podcasts_15","podcasts_116","podcasts_214","podcasts_215","podcasts_67","podcasts_95","podcasts_209"],"featImg":"podcasts_670","label":"source_podcasts_668"},"podcasts_629":{"type":"posts","id":"podcasts_629","meta":{"index":"posts_1591205157","site":"podcasts","id":"629","score":null,"sort":[1599721396000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"fight-like-chadwick","title":"Fight Like Chadwick","publishDate":1599721396,"format":"aside","headTitle":"Truth Be Told | KQED Podcasts | KQED","labelTerm":{},"content":"\u003cp>\u003cimg class=\"size-medium wp-image-572 alignleft\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/77/2020/09/Tarot-Card-Season2_Ep14_chadwick-v2-KH.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"400\">\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>On Aug. 28, 2020, the world heard the news that actor \u003ca href=\"https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/28/entertainment/chadwick-boseman-dies/index.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Chadwick Boseman had died at the age of 43 of colon cancer\u003c/a>. Boseman was known for his role as King T'Challa in Marvel's \"Black Panther.\" He also portrayed iconic Black figures such as James Brown, Thurgood Marshall and Jackie Robinson. Boseman’s death came as a shock because he did not publicly disclose his stage 3 diagnosis and four-year fight. His death not only raised awareness of colon cancer, but also the health care disparities Black people face.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Colon cancer is \u003ca href=\"https://www.cancer.gov/types/colorectal/hp/colon-treatment-pdq#:~:text=Cancer%20of%20the%20colon%20is,approximately%2050%25%20of%20the%20patients.\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">curable\u003c/a> if caught early. It most \u003ca href=\"https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/wellness/colon-cancer-chadwick-boseman-tips/2020/09/03/13d224f2-ed29-11ea-99a1-71343d03bc29_story.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">commonly affects\u003c/a> people who are 50 and older, but in 2018, the American Cancer Society (ACA) \u003ca href=\"https://www.cancer.org/cancer/colon-rectal-cancer/detection-diagnosis-staging/acs-recommendations.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">changed its guidelines\u003c/a> to advise people to start \u003ca href=\"https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/to-your-health/wp/2018/05/30/colorectal-cancer-screening-should-start-at-age-45-not-50-american-cancer-society-says/?itid=lk_inline_manual_21\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">regularly screening at 45\u003c/a> because of the steady rise in the number of young people diagnosed. Yet, Boseman died of colon cancer at the age of 43, before the recommended screening age.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Black Americans have the \u003ca href=\"https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5785537/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">highest death rate and shortest survival rate\u003c/a> from colorectal cancer of any racial group in the U.S. There are a lot of reasons for it, but one of the most important ones is late diagnosis. By the time we get to a doctor, it's too late.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Our Wise Ones this week are two guys literally working to save our lives. \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/gr8vision\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Dr. Italo Brown\u003c/a> is an emergency medicine physician and clinical instructor at Stanford University Hospital. He’s been on the front lines treating people with COVID-19 over these last few months. \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/streetmedicmil?lang=en\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Jahmil Lacey \u003c/a>the founder of \u003ca href=\"https://www.trapmedicine.org/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">TRAPMedicine\u003c/a>, a nonprofit that focuses on using barbershops to help address the health inequities of Black men and boys. He’s currently in medical school, and he joined to talk to us as he just got out of class.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>You had this cultural icon in our community, as a result of his roles in a number of films, but also like he's one of us. He went to a Historically Black College/university (HBCU), Howard University. He navigated his way through Hollywood. He took on roles that really depicted us in a very positive light. And when I found out that one, he was diagnosed when it was already stage 3 cancer means he had been impacted by this for a while before he found out and he decided to just live. — Jahmil Lacey\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>Dr. Brown says the very act of having to advocate for yourself to get an earlier screening is an example of systemic racism. You can walk into a provider's office and say, “I think I need to get a colonoscopy,” says Dr. Brown, “and they say, you don’t need a colonoscopy because they don't understand the way that it decimates the people in our community. They don't understand that fear plays a factor and how much it actually took for a person to get to the point where they were OK with asking their doctor for an exam.” Dr. Brown says when Black patients are dismissed by doctors that are biased, it can lead to what he calls medical distrust.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>As Black men, we often have to maximize the time that we have in this physical realm. And we don't have the luxury of being able to say, “In five years, I want to see myself here.” We're living for today. A lot of us are living for this hour. And so it's just a reminder for me to just live. And it's also a reminder that regardless of how much money you make, how much education you acquire, Black people are always at risk because of racism. — Jahmil Lacey\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>As 30-somethings, Lacey and Dr. Brown say their insurance company won't cover a colon screening, even if they asked for one because the recommended age for testing is 45. They would have to pay out-of-pocket. According to the \u003ca href=\"https://www.cancer.org/cancer/colon-rectal-cancer/detection-diagnosis-staging/screening-coverage-laws.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">ACA\u003c/a>, there’s nothing to stop insurers from covering the tests starting at age 45, and some are likely to do so, but at this time insurers are not required to (and some might not) cover the cost of colorectal cancer screening before age 50.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“What I've been told is to just lie,” says Lacey. “We're at the point now where we have to lie about our symptoms in order for doctors to to do their proper due diligence to ensure that we don't have cancer. And that is a problem.” Dr. Brown says he's had similar experiences. “Unfortunately for Black patients, you spend more of your time trying to convince somebody that your complaints are real and you are authentic in your desire to have increased health literacy — not because you're trying to con or game the system.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Here are some tips from our Wise Ones on how to advocate for yourself in the doctor's office:\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>1. “What would you say to your family member?” \u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n“This is a question that I use and that I share with a lot of my patients or people who I would consider under informed. Put it on the physician, as if they were talking to a family member, because they often forget and they create that distance — whether it is emotional fatigue or fatigue from seeing too many patients and are tasked with making complex decisions. So if I'm walking in a room and I'm with a doctor, and I don't feel like the doctor is 100% giving me the attention that I need or deserve, I would say, “If I were your family member, what would you say to me? How would you approach this?” — Dr. Italo Brown\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>2. #BlackDoctor\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“We have to acknowledge that there's a power differential immediately when a patient approaches a doctor. There's a knowledge gap, there is a resource gap, and there's an access gap. We have to acknowledge that that gap exists and patients need to know that they are just as empowered as the physician. This physician cannot make any decisions about your care that you don't consent to. If people don't have access to a Black doctor, go on Instagram, type in “Black doctor.” Find the first Black doctor you see and just direct message them and just ask them questions.” — Jahmil Lacey\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>Note:\u003c/em> We’re not advocating for people to get legitimate health care via Instagram, but rather, see if you can find a Black doctor that you can eventually see regularly or can help you get the care you need.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>3. Pressure your benefits provider for access to providers of color\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“For folks who are employed, you can also apply pressure upstream on your benefits groups to demand that they provide you with people who have access to providers of color. You can ask that. You can request that they provide you with strategic plans on how they're going to increase their provider panel of color. You can also request that they try to put in place navigators who can help you with some of these tougher questions. For example, imagine trying to plan end-of-life care for a family member. That's difficult, especially within the Black community. And that will turn a very clear spotlight on the blind spots in lack of equity that exists within the corporate structures of the jobs that we work.” — Dr. Italo Brown\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>4. Vote\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4685976/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Study\u003c/a> after \u003ca href=\"https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_reports/RR3163.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">study\u003c/a> shows the clear association between civic engagement and health outcomes. A lot of what we're talking about are decisions that have been made at an executive level and at the legislative level.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Lastly, Lacey wants to emphasize that Boseman did not give in to cancer; he kept fighting for his life. “Despite every advancement in medicine, this is just where we are. I think about health disparities and how they impact Black people no matter how much money we have, no matter how much fame we acquire. We are always at risk. And my message to people is to fight like Chadwick.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Episode transcript can be found \u003cstrong>\u003ca href=\"https://drive.google.com/file/d/1jKbDASHwpfWnug3yxpQYU-AFOiBTnuPS/view?usp=sharing\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">here\u003c/a>\u003c/strong>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Episode Guests:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/streetmedicmil?lang=en\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Jahmil Lacey\u003c/a>, founder/CEO of \u003ca href=\"https://www.trapmedicine.org/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">TRAPMedicine\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/gr8vision\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Italo Brown\u003c/a>, MD, MPH, Policy Advocate & Emergency Medicine Physician and Chief Impact Advisor of TRAPMedicine\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"https://www.trapmedicine.org/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">TRAPMedicine\u003c/a> — (Trust, Research, Acces and Prevention) — Shifting the praxis, narrative and culture of men's health through the barbershop.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Information about \u003ca href=\"https://www.cancer.org/cancer/colon-rectal-cancer/detection-diagnosis-staging/screening-coverage-laws.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">insurance coverage for colorectal cancer screenings\u003c/a> per the American Cancer Society.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Click \u003ca href=\"https://www.usa.gov/register-to-vote\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">here\u003c/a> to register to vote.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Reading:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.thefader.com/2017/10/11/black-barbershops-new-york-la-houston-new-orleans-essay-photos\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The power and politics of the black barbershop\u003c/a> by Jason Parham\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://time.com/5480371/barbershop-blood-pressure-program/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Why Barbershops May Be Key to Improving Black Men's Health\u003c/a> by Alice Park\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2020/09/01/908471876/africans-mourn-chadwick-boseman-a-great-tree-has-fallen\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Africans Mourn Chadwick Boseman: 'A Great Tree Has Fallen'\u003c/a> by Ifeanyi Nsofor\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/185986/medical-apartheid-by-harriet-a-washington/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Medical Apartheid\u003c/a> by Harriet A. Washington\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/155575/killing-the-black-body-by-dorothy-roberts/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Killing the Black Body\u003c/a> by Dorothy Roberts\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.upress.umn.edu/book-division/books/body-and-soul\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Body and Soul: The Black Panther Party and the Fight against Medical Discrimination\u003c/a> by Alondra Nelson\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/books/titles/578679908/the-deepest-well-healing-the-long-term-effects-of-childhood-adversity\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Deepest Well: Healing the Long-Term Effects of Childhood Adversity\u003c/a> by Nadine Burke Harris\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://uncpress.org/book/9781469609720/examining-tuskegee/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Examining Tuskegee: The Infamous Syphilis Study and Its Legacy\u003c/a> by Susan M. Reverby\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"http://rebeccaskloot.com/the-immortal-life/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Immortal Life of Henrietta Lacks\u003c/a> by Rebecca Skloot\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad floatright]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Listening:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5LPHqAE1tq3wj6vFr1ZMcT?si=mFiFEFczREypEINB7UZ8rg\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Collective Grief & Healing: Nap Ministry Spotify Playlist\u003c/a> curated by Tricia Hersey-Patrick\u003c/p>\n\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":null,"status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1599840233,"stats":{"hasAudio":false,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":29,"wordCount":1579},"headData":{"title":"Fight Like Chadwick | KQED Podcasts","description":"On Aug. 28, 2020, the world heard the news that actor Chadwick Boseman had died at the age of 43 of colon cancer. Boseman was known for his role as King T'Challa in Marvel's "Black Panther." He also portrayed iconic Black figures such as James Brown, Thurgood Marshall and Jackie Robinson. Boseman’s death came as","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":""},"disqusIdentifier":"629 https://ww2.kqed.org/podcasts/?p=629","disqusUrl":"https://ww2.kqed.org/podcasts/2020/09/10/fight-like-chadwick/","disqusTitle":"Fight Like Chadwick","source":"Truth Be Told","sourceUrl":"https://www.kqed.org/podcasts/truthbetold","nprByline":"Truth Be Told team","path":"/podcasts/629/fight-like-chadwick","audioUrl":"https://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/traffic.megaphone.fm/KQINC4428756129.mp3","audioDuration":1919000,"audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003cimg class=\"size-medium wp-image-572 alignleft\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/77/2020/09/Tarot-Card-Season2_Ep14_chadwick-v2-KH.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"400\">\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>On Aug. 28, 2020, the world heard the news that actor \u003ca href=\"https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/28/entertainment/chadwick-boseman-dies/index.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Chadwick Boseman had died at the age of 43 of colon cancer\u003c/a>. Boseman was known for his role as King T'Challa in Marvel's \"Black Panther.\" He also portrayed iconic Black figures such as James Brown, Thurgood Marshall and Jackie Robinson. Boseman’s death came as a shock because he did not publicly disclose his stage 3 diagnosis and four-year fight. His death not only raised awareness of colon cancer, but also the health care disparities Black people face.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Colon cancer is \u003ca href=\"https://www.cancer.gov/types/colorectal/hp/colon-treatment-pdq#:~:text=Cancer%20of%20the%20colon%20is,approximately%2050%25%20of%20the%20patients.\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">curable\u003c/a> if caught early. It most \u003ca href=\"https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/wellness/colon-cancer-chadwick-boseman-tips/2020/09/03/13d224f2-ed29-11ea-99a1-71343d03bc29_story.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">commonly affects\u003c/a> people who are 50 and older, but in 2018, the American Cancer Society (ACA) \u003ca href=\"https://www.cancer.org/cancer/colon-rectal-cancer/detection-diagnosis-staging/acs-recommendations.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">changed its guidelines\u003c/a> to advise people to start \u003ca href=\"https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/to-your-health/wp/2018/05/30/colorectal-cancer-screening-should-start-at-age-45-not-50-american-cancer-society-says/?itid=lk_inline_manual_21\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">regularly screening at 45\u003c/a> because of the steady rise in the number of young people diagnosed. Yet, Boseman died of colon cancer at the age of 43, before the recommended screening age.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Black Americans have the \u003ca href=\"https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5785537/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">highest death rate and shortest survival rate\u003c/a> from colorectal cancer of any racial group in the U.S. There are a lot of reasons for it, but one of the most important ones is late diagnosis. By the time we get to a doctor, it's too late.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Our Wise Ones this week are two guys literally working to save our lives. \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/gr8vision\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Dr. Italo Brown\u003c/a> is an emergency medicine physician and clinical instructor at Stanford University Hospital. He’s been on the front lines treating people with COVID-19 over these last few months. \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/streetmedicmil?lang=en\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Jahmil Lacey \u003c/a>the founder of \u003ca href=\"https://www.trapmedicine.org/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">TRAPMedicine\u003c/a>, a nonprofit that focuses on using barbershops to help address the health inequities of Black men and boys. He’s currently in medical school, and he joined to talk to us as he just got out of class.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>You had this cultural icon in our community, as a result of his roles in a number of films, but also like he's one of us. He went to a Historically Black College/university (HBCU), Howard University. He navigated his way through Hollywood. He took on roles that really depicted us in a very positive light. And when I found out that one, he was diagnosed when it was already stage 3 cancer means he had been impacted by this for a while before he found out and he decided to just live. — Jahmil Lacey\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>Dr. Brown says the very act of having to advocate for yourself to get an earlier screening is an example of systemic racism. You can walk into a provider's office and say, “I think I need to get a colonoscopy,” says Dr. Brown, “and they say, you don’t need a colonoscopy because they don't understand the way that it decimates the people in our community. They don't understand that fear plays a factor and how much it actually took for a person to get to the point where they were OK with asking their doctor for an exam.” Dr. Brown says when Black patients are dismissed by doctors that are biased, it can lead to what he calls medical distrust.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>As Black men, we often have to maximize the time that we have in this physical realm. And we don't have the luxury of being able to say, “In five years, I want to see myself here.” We're living for today. A lot of us are living for this hour. And so it's just a reminder for me to just live. And it's also a reminder that regardless of how much money you make, how much education you acquire, Black people are always at risk because of racism. — Jahmil Lacey\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>As 30-somethings, Lacey and Dr. Brown say their insurance company won't cover a colon screening, even if they asked for one because the recommended age for testing is 45. They would have to pay out-of-pocket. According to the \u003ca href=\"https://www.cancer.org/cancer/colon-rectal-cancer/detection-diagnosis-staging/screening-coverage-laws.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">ACA\u003c/a>, there’s nothing to stop insurers from covering the tests starting at age 45, and some are likely to do so, but at this time insurers are not required to (and some might not) cover the cost of colorectal cancer screening before age 50.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“What I've been told is to just lie,” says Lacey. “We're at the point now where we have to lie about our symptoms in order for doctors to to do their proper due diligence to ensure that we don't have cancer. And that is a problem.” Dr. Brown says he's had similar experiences. “Unfortunately for Black patients, you spend more of your time trying to convince somebody that your complaints are real and you are authentic in your desire to have increased health literacy — not because you're trying to con or game the system.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Here are some tips from our Wise Ones on how to advocate for yourself in the doctor's office:\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>1. “What would you say to your family member?” \u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n“This is a question that I use and that I share with a lot of my patients or people who I would consider under informed. Put it on the physician, as if they were talking to a family member, because they often forget and they create that distance — whether it is emotional fatigue or fatigue from seeing too many patients and are tasked with making complex decisions. So if I'm walking in a room and I'm with a doctor, and I don't feel like the doctor is 100% giving me the attention that I need or deserve, I would say, “If I were your family member, what would you say to me? How would you approach this?” — Dr. Italo Brown\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>2. #BlackDoctor\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“We have to acknowledge that there's a power differential immediately when a patient approaches a doctor. There's a knowledge gap, there is a resource gap, and there's an access gap. We have to acknowledge that that gap exists and patients need to know that they are just as empowered as the physician. This physician cannot make any decisions about your care that you don't consent to. If people don't have access to a Black doctor, go on Instagram, type in “Black doctor.” Find the first Black doctor you see and just direct message them and just ask them questions.” — Jahmil Lacey\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>Note:\u003c/em> We’re not advocating for people to get legitimate health care via Instagram, but rather, see if you can find a Black doctor that you can eventually see regularly or can help you get the care you need.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>3. Pressure your benefits provider for access to providers of color\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“For folks who are employed, you can also apply pressure upstream on your benefits groups to demand that they provide you with people who have access to providers of color. You can ask that. You can request that they provide you with strategic plans on how they're going to increase their provider panel of color. You can also request that they try to put in place navigators who can help you with some of these tougher questions. For example, imagine trying to plan end-of-life care for a family member. That's difficult, especially within the Black community. And that will turn a very clear spotlight on the blind spots in lack of equity that exists within the corporate structures of the jobs that we work.” — Dr. Italo Brown\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>4. Vote\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4685976/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Study\u003c/a> after \u003ca href=\"https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_reports/RR3163.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">study\u003c/a> shows the clear association between civic engagement and health outcomes. A lot of what we're talking about are decisions that have been made at an executive level and at the legislative level.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Lastly, Lacey wants to emphasize that Boseman did not give in to cancer; he kept fighting for his life. “Despite every advancement in medicine, this is just where we are. I think about health disparities and how they impact Black people no matter how much money we have, no matter how much fame we acquire. We are always at risk. And my message to people is to fight like Chadwick.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Episode transcript can be found \u003cstrong>\u003ca href=\"https://drive.google.com/file/d/1jKbDASHwpfWnug3yxpQYU-AFOiBTnuPS/view?usp=sharing\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">here\u003c/a>\u003c/strong>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Episode Guests:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/streetmedicmil?lang=en\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Jahmil Lacey\u003c/a>, founder/CEO of \u003ca href=\"https://www.trapmedicine.org/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">TRAPMedicine\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/gr8vision\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Italo Brown\u003c/a>, MD, MPH, Policy Advocate & Emergency Medicine Physician and Chief Impact Advisor of TRAPMedicine\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"https://www.trapmedicine.org/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">TRAPMedicine\u003c/a> — (Trust, Research, Acces and Prevention) — Shifting the praxis, narrative and culture of men's health through the barbershop.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Information about \u003ca href=\"https://www.cancer.org/cancer/colon-rectal-cancer/detection-diagnosis-staging/screening-coverage-laws.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">insurance coverage for colorectal cancer screenings\u003c/a> per the American Cancer Society.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Click \u003ca href=\"https://www.usa.gov/register-to-vote\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">here\u003c/a> to register to vote.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Reading:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.thefader.com/2017/10/11/black-barbershops-new-york-la-houston-new-orleans-essay-photos\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The power and politics of the black barbershop\u003c/a> by Jason Parham\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://time.com/5480371/barbershop-blood-pressure-program/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Why Barbershops May Be Key to Improving Black Men's Health\u003c/a> by Alice Park\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2020/09/01/908471876/africans-mourn-chadwick-boseman-a-great-tree-has-fallen\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Africans Mourn Chadwick Boseman: 'A Great Tree Has Fallen'\u003c/a> by Ifeanyi Nsofor\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/185986/medical-apartheid-by-harriet-a-washington/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Medical Apartheid\u003c/a> by Harriet A. Washington\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/155575/killing-the-black-body-by-dorothy-roberts/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Killing the Black Body\u003c/a> by Dorothy Roberts\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.upress.umn.edu/book-division/books/body-and-soul\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Body and Soul: The Black Panther Party and the Fight against Medical Discrimination\u003c/a> by Alondra Nelson\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/books/titles/578679908/the-deepest-well-healing-the-long-term-effects-of-childhood-adversity\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Deepest Well: Healing the Long-Term Effects of Childhood Adversity\u003c/a> by Nadine Burke Harris\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://uncpress.org/book/9781469609720/examining-tuskegee/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Examining Tuskegee: The Infamous Syphilis Study and Its Legacy\u003c/a> by Susan M. Reverby\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"http://rebeccaskloot.com/the-immortal-life/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Immortal Life of Henrietta Lacks\u003c/a> by Rebecca Skloot\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"floatright"},"numeric":["floatright"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Recommended Listening:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5LPHqAE1tq3wj6vFr1ZMcT?si=mFiFEFczREypEINB7UZ8rg\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Collective Grief & Healing: Nap Ministry Spotify Playlist\u003c/a> curated by Tricia Hersey-Patrick\u003c/p>\n\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/podcasts/629/fight-like-chadwick","authors":["byline_podcasts_629"],"programs":["podcasts_2"],"categories":["podcasts_1"],"tags":["podcasts_140","podcasts_119","podcasts_90","podcasts_197","podcasts_194","podcasts_190","podcasts_98","podcasts_188","podcasts_192","podcasts_193","podcasts_99","podcasts_129","podcasts_195","podcasts_199","podcasts_201","podcasts_198","podcasts_178","podcasts_15","podcasts_196","podcasts_116","podcasts_189","podcasts_67","podcasts_200","podcasts_95","podcasts_191"],"featImg":"podcasts_664","label":"source_podcasts_629"},"podcasts_618":{"type":"posts","id":"podcasts_618","meta":{"index":"posts_1591205157","site":"podcasts","id":"618","score":null,"sort":[1599116624000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"bonus-tbt-california-loves-walter-thompson-hernandez-on-ig-live","title":"Bonus: TBT and California Love's Walter Thompson-Hernández on IG Live","publishDate":1599116624,"format":"aside","headTitle":"Truth Be Told | KQED Podcasts | KQED","labelTerm":{},"content":"\u003cp>\u003cimg class=\"size-medium wp-image-572 alignleft\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/77/2020/09/Tarot-Card-Season2_EpisodeCABonus-KH.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"400\">\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"http://www.wthdz.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Walter Thompson-Hernández\u003c/a> has reported and hosted videos from nearly every continent and throughout the United States, covering \u003ca href=\"https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/19/style/how-my-southeast-la-culture-got-to-japan.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Japan's Chicano subculture\u003c/a>, \u003ca href=\"https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/31/us/compton-cowboys-horseback-riding-african-americans.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">the Compton Cowboys' legacy\u003c/a> and the \u003ca href=\"https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/15/style/black-panther-movie-cosplay.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">disruption of cosplay stereotypes\u003c/a>. His latest project is a first-person audio anthology called “\u003ca href=\"https://laist.com/podcasts/california-love.php\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">California Love\u003c/a>.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“White folks have had the freedom to move to Los Angeles and tell our stories freely. This show is entirely different,\" Thompson-Hernández said in an Instagram post. “I wanted to create something for people who look and sound like me. And a show about L.A. from someone born and raised in Southeast L.A. in a one-room hospital on Florence Boulevard in front of a Tacos Mexico.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Thompson-Hernández has told stories since he was 11 years old, as a graffiti artist, then as an academic scholar. He earned his master’s degree in Latin American studies from Stanford University and was enrolled in the UCLA Chicano studies Ph.D. program for one year before leaving to write for the New York Times. Prior to graduate school, he played professional basketball throughout Latin America for the Mexican Olympic team. He said all of these experiences have shaped him as a storyteller and his use of various mediums to tell honest stories about Black and brown people.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote class=\"twitter-tweet\" data-conversation=\"none\" data-theme=\"dark\">\n\u003cp lang=\"en\" dir=\"ltr\">\"I am not thinking about white people when I make stories to be quite honest. It's been a process. When I am creating something I am thinking about my mom, my cousins...If it doesn't resonate with them, I didn't win.\" -\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/WTHDZ?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw\">@WTHDZ\u003c/a> \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/hashtag/deartbt?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw\">#deartbt\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>— #DearTBT (@TruthBeToldKQED) \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/TruthBeToldKQED/status/1296580259681189894?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw\">August 20, 2020\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>Truth Be Told host Tonya Mosley asked him about working in audio for the first time, dream collaborations and how 2020 has been for him.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>You can watch the conversation on our Instagram TV \u003ca href=\"https://www.instagram.com/tv/CEITVW_gTkv/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">here\u003c/a> and follow our live-tweeting of the conversation \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/TruthBeToldKQED/status/1296478602071019521\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">here\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Episode transcript can be found \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/TruthBeToldKQED/status/1296567837666897920\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">here\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Thank you to the KPCC, LAist and “California Love” team for this collaboration. Specifically, Kristen Hayford, Jennifer Su, Veronica Lopez, Megan Tan and Kyana Moghadam.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Have you listened to “\u003ca href=\"https://laist.com/podcasts/california-love.php\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">California Love\u003c/a>” yet? It’s a love letter to the city of Los Angeles, Thompson-Hernández’s community, and the people that are touchstones to his life. It is also a podcast about a side of America that usually doesn’t make it to mainstream media. “If you’re from L.A. you hear all these tropes about the city and that’s not what I know.” — Walter Thompson-Hernández.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The first and final season of the podcast is out now and you can find an overview of each episode below. In case you need some direction on where to start, Thompson-Hernández wanted to start telling his story with “Scared Straight,” but his favorite episode is “Parrots: A Parable.” If you are already a fan, give the show some love and leave a review. Here are the episodes and a little about them:\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>\"Prologue\":\u003c/strong> Our host Walter Thompson-Hernández returns home to L.A. and reflects on how much the city has changed since he was a child.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>\"Scared Straight\":\u003c/strong> Walter was just 11 years old when he was admitted to L.A.'s infamous Scared Straight program for graffiti-related crimes. In this episode, Walter, through a chance encounter, checks in with his friend who went through the program with him, their anti-tagging arch-nemesis and how they have turned out after all these years.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>\"P Line\":\u003c/strong> A story about a wild party line that many Los Angeles’ teenagers used to create a fantasy world.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>\"Kobe\":\u003c/strong> Walter dives deep on what Kobe meant to him in his life and how the icon’s death spurred a collective mourning throughout the city.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>\"Parrots:A Parable\":\u003c/strong> A first-parrot perspective into legends and myths of how L.A. became home to the world’s largest population of green parrots.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>\"Compton Cowboys:\"\u003c/strong> There’s a horse ranch in the heart of Compton that may hold the answers for salvation and redemption for the city’s Black cowboys.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>\"Ellie:\"\u003c/strong> Eleuteria “Ellie” Hernández moved to Los Angeles from a small town in Mexico when she was 14 and fell in love with the city. In this episode, Walter sits down with Ellie, his mother, to understand her relationship to L.A. and how it has shaped his own.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>\"Epilogue:\"\u003c/strong> We close the series with a meditation on how 28 years after the 1992 riots, for many in L.A., things feel exactly the same.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Episode Guests:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"http://www.wthdz.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Walter Thompson-Hernández\u003c/a>, host of “California Love” podcast, author of “\u003ca href=\"https://www.thriftbooks.com/w/the-compton-cowboys-the-new-generation-of-cowboys-in-americas-urban-heartland_walter-thompson-hernandez/22794098/item/41146095/?mkwid=%7cdc&pcrid=448918240737&pkw=&pmt=&slid=&plc=&pgrid=104755242616&ptaid=pla-927269736418&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI_5P64bDI6wIVsRx9Ch07HwshEAQYASABEgIH8fD_BwE#isbn=0062910604&idiq=41146095\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Compton Cowboys: The New Generation of Cowboys in America's Urban Heartland\u003c/a>” and New York Times alum.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Listen and subscribe to California Love \u003cstrong>\u003ca href=\"https://laist.com/podcasts/california-love.php\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">here\u003c/a>\u003c/strong>.\u003c/p>\n\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":null,"status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1599149028,"stats":{"hasAudio":false,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":23,"wordCount":836},"headData":{"title":"Bonus: TBT and California Love's Walter Thompson-Hernández on IG Live | KQED Podcasts","description":"Walter Thompson-Hernández has reported and hosted videos from nearly every continent and throughout the United States, covering Japan's Chicano subculture, the Compton Cowboys' legacy and the disruption of cosplay stereotypes. His latest project is a first-person audio anthology called “California Love.” “White folks have had the freedom to move to Los Angeles and tell our","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":""},"disqusIdentifier":"618 https://ww2.kqed.org/podcasts/?p=618","disqusUrl":"https://ww2.kqed.org/podcasts/2020/09/03/bonus-tbt-california-loves-walter-thompson-hernandez-on-ig-live/","disqusTitle":"Bonus: TBT and California Love's Walter Thompson-Hernández on IG Live","source":"Truth Be Told","sourceUrl":"https://www.kqed.org/podcasts/truthbetold","nprByline":"Truth Be Told team","path":"/podcasts/618/bonus-tbt-california-loves-walter-thompson-hernandez-on-ig-live","audioUrl":"https://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/traffic.megaphone.fm/KQINC4253420086.mp3","audioDuration":3381000,"audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003cimg class=\"size-medium wp-image-572 alignleft\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/77/2020/09/Tarot-Card-Season2_EpisodeCABonus-KH.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"400\">\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"http://www.wthdz.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Walter Thompson-Hernández\u003c/a> has reported and hosted videos from nearly every continent and throughout the United States, covering \u003ca href=\"https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/19/style/how-my-southeast-la-culture-got-to-japan.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Japan's Chicano subculture\u003c/a>, \u003ca href=\"https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/31/us/compton-cowboys-horseback-riding-african-americans.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">the Compton Cowboys' legacy\u003c/a> and the \u003ca href=\"https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/15/style/black-panther-movie-cosplay.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">disruption of cosplay stereotypes\u003c/a>. His latest project is a first-person audio anthology called “\u003ca href=\"https://laist.com/podcasts/california-love.php\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">California Love\u003c/a>.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“White folks have had the freedom to move to Los Angeles and tell our stories freely. This show is entirely different,\" Thompson-Hernández said in an Instagram post. “I wanted to create something for people who look and sound like me. And a show about L.A. from someone born and raised in Southeast L.A. in a one-room hospital on Florence Boulevard in front of a Tacos Mexico.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Thompson-Hernández has told stories since he was 11 years old, as a graffiti artist, then as an academic scholar. He earned his master’s degree in Latin American studies from Stanford University and was enrolled in the UCLA Chicano studies Ph.D. program for one year before leaving to write for the New York Times. Prior to graduate school, he played professional basketball throughout Latin America for the Mexican Olympic team. He said all of these experiences have shaped him as a storyteller and his use of various mediums to tell honest stories about Black and brown people.\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote class=\"twitter-tweet\" data-conversation=\"none\" data-theme=\"dark\">\n\u003cp lang=\"en\" dir=\"ltr\">\"I am not thinking about white people when I make stories to be quite honest. It's been a process. When I am creating something I am thinking about my mom, my cousins...If it doesn't resonate with them, I didn't win.\" -\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/WTHDZ?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw\">@WTHDZ\u003c/a> \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/hashtag/deartbt?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw\">#deartbt\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>— #DearTBT (@TruthBeToldKQED) \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/TruthBeToldKQED/status/1296580259681189894?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw\">August 20, 2020\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>Truth Be Told host Tonya Mosley asked him about working in audio for the first time, dream collaborations and how 2020 has been for him.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>You can watch the conversation on our Instagram TV \u003ca href=\"https://www.instagram.com/tv/CEITVW_gTkv/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">here\u003c/a> and follow our live-tweeting of the conversation \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/TruthBeToldKQED/status/1296478602071019521\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">here\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Episode transcript can be found \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/TruthBeToldKQED/status/1296567837666897920\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">here\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Thank you to the KPCC, LAist and “California Love” team for this collaboration. Specifically, Kristen Hayford, Jennifer Su, Veronica Lopez, Megan Tan and Kyana Moghadam.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Have you listened to “\u003ca href=\"https://laist.com/podcasts/california-love.php\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">California Love\u003c/a>” yet? It’s a love letter to the city of Los Angeles, Thompson-Hernández’s community, and the people that are touchstones to his life. It is also a podcast about a side of America that usually doesn’t make it to mainstream media. “If you’re from L.A. you hear all these tropes about the city and that’s not what I know.” — Walter Thompson-Hernández.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The first and final season of the podcast is out now and you can find an overview of each episode below. In case you need some direction on where to start, Thompson-Hernández wanted to start telling his story with “Scared Straight,” but his favorite episode is “Parrots: A Parable.” If you are already a fan, give the show some love and leave a review. Here are the episodes and a little about them:\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>\"Prologue\":\u003c/strong> Our host Walter Thompson-Hernández returns home to L.A. and reflects on how much the city has changed since he was a child.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>\"Scared Straight\":\u003c/strong> Walter was just 11 years old when he was admitted to L.A.'s infamous Scared Straight program for graffiti-related crimes. In this episode, Walter, through a chance encounter, checks in with his friend who went through the program with him, their anti-tagging arch-nemesis and how they have turned out after all these years.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>\"P Line\":\u003c/strong> A story about a wild party line that many Los Angeles’ teenagers used to create a fantasy world.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>\"Kobe\":\u003c/strong> Walter dives deep on what Kobe meant to him in his life and how the icon’s death spurred a collective mourning throughout the city.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>\"Parrots:A Parable\":\u003c/strong> A first-parrot perspective into legends and myths of how L.A. became home to the world’s largest population of green parrots.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>\"Compton Cowboys:\"\u003c/strong> There’s a horse ranch in the heart of Compton that may hold the answers for salvation and redemption for the city’s Black cowboys.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>\"Ellie:\"\u003c/strong> Eleuteria “Ellie” Hernández moved to Los Angeles from a small town in Mexico when she was 14 and fell in love with the city. In this episode, Walter sits down with Ellie, his mother, to understand her relationship to L.A. and how it has shaped his own.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>\"Epilogue:\"\u003c/strong> We close the series with a meditation on how 28 years after the 1992 riots, for many in L.A., things feel exactly the same.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Episode Guests:\u003c/strong>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"http://www.wthdz.com/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Walter Thompson-Hernández\u003c/a>, host of “California Love” podcast, author of “\u003ca href=\"https://www.thriftbooks.com/w/the-compton-cowboys-the-new-generation-of-cowboys-in-americas-urban-heartland_walter-thompson-hernandez/22794098/item/41146095/?mkwid=%7cdc&pcrid=448918240737&pkw=&pmt=&slid=&plc=&pgrid=104755242616&ptaid=pla-927269736418&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI_5P64bDI6wIVsRx9Ch07HwshEAQYASABEgIH8fD_BwE#isbn=0062910604&idiq=41146095\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">The Compton Cowboys: The New Generation of Cowboys in America's Urban Heartland\u003c/a>” and New York Times alum.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Listen and subscribe to California Love \u003cstrong>\u003ca href=\"https://laist.com/podcasts/california-love.php\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">here\u003c/a>\u003c/strong>.\u003c/p>\n\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/podcasts/618/bonus-tbt-california-loves-walter-thompson-hernandez-on-ig-live","authors":["byline_podcasts_618"],"programs":["podcasts_2"],"categories":["podcasts_1"],"tags":["podcasts_140","podcasts_119","podcasts_90","podcasts_179","podcasts_183","podcasts_99","podcasts_129","podcasts_178","podcasts_15","podcasts_177","podcasts_187","podcasts_184","podcasts_186","podcasts_116","podcasts_185","podcasts_180","podcasts_67","podcasts_95","podcasts_182","podcasts_181"],"featImg":"podcasts_620","label":"source_podcasts_618"}},"programsReducer":{"possible":{"id":"possible","title":"Possible","info":"Possible is hosted by entrepreneur Reid Hoffman and writer Aria Finger. 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And we’ll do it with your help! You ask the questions. You decide what Bay Curious investigates. And you join us on the journey to find the answers.","imageSrc":"https://ww2.kqed.org/news/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/powerpress/1440_0017_BayCurious_iTunesTile_01.jpg","imageAlt":"\"KQED Bay Curious","officialWebsiteLink":"/news/series/baycurious","meta":{"site":"news","source":"kqed","order":"4"},"link":"/podcasts/baycurious","subscribe":{"apple":"https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/bay-curious/id1172473406","npr":"https://www.npr.org/podcasts/500557090/bay-curious","rss":"https://ww2.kqed.org/news/category/bay-curious-podcast/feed/podcast","google":"https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly93dzIua3FlZC5vcmcvbmV3cy9jYXRlZ29yeS9iYXktY3VyaW91cy1wb2RjYXN0L2ZlZWQvcG9kY2FzdA","stitcher":"https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/kqed/bay-curious","spotify":"https://open.spotify.com/show/6O76IdmhixfijmhTZLIJ8k"}},"bbc-world-service":{"id":"bbc-world-service","title":"BBC World Service","info":"The day's top stories from BBC News compiled twice daily in the week, once at weekends.","airtime":"MON-FRI 9pm-10pm, TUE-FRI 1am-2am","imageSrc":"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/2021/10/BBC_1400.jpg","officialWebsiteLink":"https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live:bbc_world_service","meta":{"site":"news","source":"BBC World Service"},"link":"/radio/program/bbc-world-service","subscribe":{"apple":"https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/global-news-podcast/id135067274?mt=2","tuneIn":"https://tunein.com/radio/BBC-World-Service-p455581/","rss":"https://podcasts.files.bbci.co.uk/p02nq0gn.rss"}},"code-switch-life-kit":{"id":"code-switch-life-kit","title":"Code Switch / Life Kit","info":"\u003cem>Code Switch\u003c/em>, which listeners will hear in the first part of the hour, has fearless and much-needed conversations about race. Hosted by journalists of color, the show tackles the subject of race head-on, exploring how it impacts every part of society — from politics and pop culture to history, sports and more.\u003cbr />\u003cbr />\u003cem>Life Kit\u003c/em>, which will be in the second part of the hour, guides you through spaces and feelings no one prepares you for — from finances to mental health, from workplace microaggressions to imposter syndrome, from relationships to parenting. The show features experts with real world experience and shares their knowledge. Because everyone needs a little help being human.\u003cbr />\u003cbr />\u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/podcasts/510312/codeswitch\">\u003cem>Code Switch\u003c/em> offical site and podcast\u003c/a>\u003cbr />\u003ca href=\"https://www.npr.org/lifekit\">\u003cem>Life Kit\u003c/em> offical site and podcast\u003c/a>\u003cbr />","airtime":"SUN 9pm-10pm","imageSrc":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/12/CodeSwitchLifeKit_StationGraphics_300x300EmailGraphic.png","meta":{"site":"radio","source":"npr"},"link":"/radio/program/code-switch-life-kit","subscribe":{"apple":"https://podcasts.apple.com/podcast/1112190608?mt=2&at=11l79Y&ct=nprdirectory","google":"https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cubnByLm9yZy9yc3MvcG9kY2FzdC5waHA_aWQ9NTEwMzEy","spotify":"https://open.spotify.com/show/3bExJ9JQpkwNhoHvaIIuyV","rss":"https://feeds.npr.org/510312/podcast.xml"}},"commonwealth-club":{"id":"commonwealth-club","title":"Commonwealth Club of California Podcast","info":"The Commonwealth Club of California is the nation's oldest and largest public affairs forum. 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