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"title": "Keeping Baseball Players' Minds In Shape; Battle Over Bacon-Wrapped Hot Dogs",
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"content": "\u003cp>\u003cem>\u003ca href=\"http://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/the-california-report-magazine/id1314750545?mt=2\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Listen to this and more in-depth storytelling by subscribing to The California Report Magazine podcast.\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">This 4th of July weekend, we’re bringing you stories about a pair of iconic American symbols: baseball and hot dogs.\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/p>\n\u003cdiv class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-SinglePost-__SinglePost__mpost_Title\">\n\u003cdiv>\n\u003ch2 class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-Title-__Title__title\">\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1997528/from-dugout-to-zen-den-san-francisco-giants-champion-mental-wellness\">From the Dugout to the Zen Den: How the San Francisco Giants’ Champion Mental Wellness \u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003c/div>\n\u003c/div>\n\u003cdiv>\n\u003cdiv class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-Listen-__Listen__articleListen\">\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Summer is the heart of the baseball season. But recently the country’s oldest professional sport has been going through some changes. It’s not just the moves to speed up the pace of play. These days, along with training in the weight room or the bullpen, players are also spending time with their team’s sports psychologist. KQED’s health correspondent April Dembosky goes behind the scenes at the San Francisco Giants’ ballpark to understand how the team keeps an athlete’s\u003c/span>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\"> mind \u003c/span>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">in shape, both on and off the field. \u003c/span>\u003cb> \u003c/b>\u003c/p>\n\u003c/div>\n\u003c/div>\n\u003ch2 class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-Title-__Title__title\">\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/12038600/how-bacon-wrapped-hot-dogs-became-one-of-the-bay-areas-most-popular-street-foods\">How Bacon-Wrapped Hot Dogs Became One of California’s Most Popular Street Foods\u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Americans eat more hot dogs on the 4th of July than any other day of the year. Bacon-wrapped hot dogs have become a California staple: vendors can be seen outside of baseball games, concerts, and tourist attractions like San Francisco’s Pier 39. Bay Curious listener Olivia Godfrey wanted to find out the history of these food carts. But as KQED’s Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman found out…it’s complicated. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n",
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"content": "\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003cem>\u003ca href=\"http://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/the-california-report-magazine/id1314750545?mt=2\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Listen to this and more in-depth storytelling by subscribing to The California Report Magazine podcast.\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">This 4th of July weekend, we’re bringing you stories about a pair of iconic American symbols: baseball and hot dogs.\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/p>\n\u003cdiv class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-SinglePost-__SinglePost__mpost_Title\">\n\u003cdiv>\n\u003ch2 class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-Title-__Title__title\">\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1997528/from-dugout-to-zen-den-san-francisco-giants-champion-mental-wellness\">From the Dugout to the Zen Den: How the San Francisco Giants’ Champion Mental Wellness \u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003c/div>\n\u003c/div>\n\u003cdiv>\n\u003cdiv class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-Listen-__Listen__articleListen\">\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Summer is the heart of the baseball season. But recently the country’s oldest professional sport has been going through some changes. It’s not just the moves to speed up the pace of play. These days, along with training in the weight room or the bullpen, players are also spending time with their team’s sports psychologist. KQED’s health correspondent April Dembosky goes behind the scenes at the San Francisco Giants’ ballpark to understand how the team keeps an athlete’s\u003c/span>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\"> mind \u003c/span>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">in shape, both on and off the field. \u003c/span>\u003cb> \u003c/b>\u003c/p>\n\u003c/div>\n\u003c/div>\n\u003ch2 class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-Title-__Title__title\">\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/12038600/how-bacon-wrapped-hot-dogs-became-one-of-the-bay-areas-most-popular-street-foods\">How Bacon-Wrapped Hot Dogs Became One of California’s Most Popular Street Foods\u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Americans eat more hot dogs on the 4th of July than any other day of the year. Bacon-wrapped hot dogs have become a California staple: vendors can be seen outside of baseball games, concerts, and tourist attractions like San Francisco’s Pier 39. Bay Curious listener Olivia Godfrey wanted to find out the history of these food carts. But as KQED’s Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman found out…it’s complicated. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>",
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"content": "\u003cp>\u003cem>\u003ca href=\"#A\">View the full episode transcript.\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Every arrival and departure of an Alcatraz ferry brings a flurry of activity to San Francisco’s Pier 33. As tourists shuffle in and out of the busy terminal, bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors are there, drumming up customers.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[baycuriousbug]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The air is perfumed with the intoxicating smell of onions, peppers and bacon-wrapped hot dogs sizzling on makeshift cooktops. A normal day brings around a dozen vendors who click their tongs and yell “hot dog, hot dog, hot dog!” as they try to make a buck.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>It’s a scene. But the Embarcadero isn’t the only place you can find a bacon-wrapped hot dog in the Bay Area these days.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The hot dog people are everywhere,” Bay Curious listener Olivia Godfrey said. “You see them every time you leave a venue, anytime you’re walking around the city.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Godfrey works as an usher at Bay Area music venues like the Fox Theater and Bill Graham Auditorium, and it’s at those places that she began to suspect that the number of people selling bacon-wrapped hot dogs has grown in recent years. That got her wondering:\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“How much money do they make every year? What’s the history of them? How do they organize?” Godfrey asked, “I’d love to know how they came to be and how they’ve become such a Bay Area staple.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>This simple street food has a complicated legacy. The history crosses international borders, and there’s a fierce controversy around how these vendors work in the San Francisco Bay Area.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_12037931\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-12037931\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-17-BL-KQED.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1333\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-17-BL-KQED.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-17-BL-KQED-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-17-BL-KQED-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-17-BL-KQED-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-17-BL-KQED-1536x1024.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-17-BL-KQED-1920x1280.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">People walk past The Dog House, a hot dog stand, in Fisherman’s Wharf on April 24, 2025. \u003ccite>(Beth LaBerge/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003ch2>Where do bacon-wrapped hot dogs come from?\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>Just south of the Arizona border in the Mexican State of Sonora, there is an especially famous type of hot dog. It’s known as a Sonoran dog, or a \u003cem>dogo, \u003c/em>as the locals call it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“It’s really important to them that the hot dogs are a big meal with all these flavors,” said Bill Esparza, a food writer and a \u003ca href=\"https://www.eater.com/authors/bill-esparza\">senior contributor at Eater LA.\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>It’s got a big wheat bun, like a lobster roll. But what really makes it stand out are the condiments people put on top, such as canned mushrooms, pickled jalapenos, and liquid cheese, to name a few, according to Esparza.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The arrival of the hot dog in Sonora can be traced back to one person. \u003ca href=\"https://oem.com.mx/elsoldehermosillo/tendencias/como-llegaron-los-dogos-a-hermosillo-te-contamos-la-historia-19055503\">A Sonoran man named Don Cipriano Lucero\u003c/a>, who had worked in the United States and brought hot dogs back to the city of Hermosillo. He opened a restaurant there in 1947 called Cafe KiKi.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_12040596\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\" style=\"max-width: 1024px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-12040596\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/GettyImages-2158959446.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"1024\" height=\"683\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/GettyImages-2158959446.jpg 1024w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/GettyImages-2158959446-800x534.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/GettyImages-2158959446-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/GettyImages-2158959446-160x107.jpg 160w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 1024px) 100vw, 1024px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">A Sonoran Hot Dog — or ‘dogo’ — photographed in Washington, D.C., on June 24, 2024. \u003ccite>(Scott Suchman with food styling by Lisa Cherkasky for The Washington Post via Getty Images)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>Don Cipriano served regular hot dogs, American style. But while Americans might be content with just a little mustard or ketchup, Esparza said the locals probably found it a little boring.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Mexicans want spice, and also Mexicans very much like sweet,” Esparza said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>So they started tinkering, perfecting the hot dog for their taste buds by adding spice, and flavor, and richness. There’s a Spanish word for this process — \u003cem>tropicalizado\u003c/em>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“When the bacon came on, who knows, but it started to become a thing in the colleges, probably starting in the sixties,” Esparza said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Just as hot dogs were brought from the United States to Mexico, it was only a matter of time before \u003cem>dogos \u003c/em>made it back to the United States, shedding the wheat bun and all the extra toppings for the pared-down version on Bay Area streets today.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_12037929\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-12037929\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-12-BL-KQED.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1333\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-12-BL-KQED.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-12-BL-KQED-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-12-BL-KQED-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-12-BL-KQED-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-12-BL-KQED-1536x1024.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-12-BL-KQED-1920x1280.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">Vendors sell bacon-wrapped hot dogs at Fisherman’s Wharf on April 24, 2025. \u003ccite>(Beth LaBerge/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003ch2>A day on the wharf\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>And these dogs are popular. A vendor named Exania works a cart outside Pier 33 in San Francisco. She asked KQED not to share her full name due to fears about her immigration status.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I work so that my children can continue studying, and to help my mother,” Exania said in Spanish.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>She said she left her home and family in Nicaragua in 2021 and made an asylum claim upon getting to the U.S. She’s been selling bacon-wrapped hot dogs at Pier 33 for the past three years. Much of her earnings go to paying back the $14,000 debt she took on in order to pay for her journey here. She owes, not a bank, but a person that money. And she said she had to put up her mother’s house as collateral for the loan.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“That’s why you will see me here every day, no matter if it’s sunny, rainy, or cold,” Exania said. “If I don’t pay my debt, my family will end up in the street.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>If she doesn’t pay every month, the person who loaned her the money threatens to take her mom’s house. There’s a running tab of how much she owes on a WhatsApp thread with the collector. She still owes about $12,000.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“It’s very painful, but it’s reality,” Exania said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_12040575\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\" style=\"max-width: 2500px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-12040575\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/Side-by-side-Downpage-1.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"2500\" height=\"833\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/Side-by-side-Downpage-1.jpg 2500w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/Side-by-side-Downpage-1-800x267.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/Side-by-side-Downpage-1-1020x340.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/Side-by-side-Downpage-1-160x53.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/Side-by-side-Downpage-1-1536x512.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/Side-by-side-Downpage-1-2048x682.jpg 2048w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/Side-by-side-Downpage-1-1920x640.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 2500px) 100vw, 2500px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">Bacon-wrapped hot dogs from a vendor at Fisherman’s Wharf on April 24, 2025. \u003ccite>(Beth LaBerge/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>A friend sold her a cart for cheap and showed her the ropes, she said. She insisted she works for herself and said she feels good selling at Pier 33. She owns three hot dog carts and sometimes loans them to people who need work. They split the earnings 50–50. She also drives a van to move them all around.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Sales can be fickle. In winter, it’s slow, so she might only sell one or two hot dogs in a day, barely enough to cover parking and supplies. On a good day, she could sell more than 20, which would get her over $200. She buys her ingredients at stores like Restaurant Depot and Chef’s Stores, where she can buy 50 hot dogs for less than a dollar a piece.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>Tension on the Embarcadero\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>In the area where Exania works, merchants of all kinds compete with each other for tourists’ attention and money. Some said the bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors unfairly take business from them.[aside postID=news_12004487 hero='https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/09/IMG_2406_qed-1020x680.jpg']Erik has been driving a pedicab for eight years and said Pier 33 used to be one of the best places for pedicabbers to make money. But, around 2021, as the COVID-19 pandemic started to ease, he said bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors started showing up in large numbers outside the terminal. He declined to give his full name due to fear of repercussion if he spoke out against the hot dog vendors.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Part of the challenge of our job is to engage people so they’ll get in the bike with us,” Erik explained. “And if the vendors are yelling ‘hot dog, hot dog, hot dog,’ so loud that people can’t hear us, then we get drowned out. We get moved to the back row.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik said it’s unfair that many, if not all, bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors don’t carry any kind of license with the city, when pedicabbers and other businesses on the wharf have to carry permits and pass inspections. He claimed that if people buy a bacon-wrapped hot dog, they don’t patronize restaurants, and they’re less likely to hire a pedicab to take them to a place to eat.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“That not only hurts us, the pedicabbers, but that hurts all the restaurants at Pier 39 and North Beach,” Erik said. “So find a way to do it in a legal and healthy, safe way. I’m all in, but that’s not what we have today.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_12040599\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-12040599\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-04-BL_qed.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1333\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-04-BL_qed.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-04-BL_qed-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-04-BL_qed-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-04-BL_qed-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-04-BL_qed-1536x1024.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-04-BL_qed-1920x1280.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">Vendors sell bacon-wrapped hot dogs at Fisherman’s Wharf on April 24, 2025. \u003ccite>(Beth LaBerge/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003ch2>The rise of street vending — and crackdowns\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>Since 2022, San Francisco has been conducting regular inspections of unpermitted street vending seven days a week, including food vendors.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The main issues are foodborne illness, and that is what we are really concerned about,” said Dr. Susan Philip, the director of the population health division at the San Francisco Department of Public Health (SFDPH).\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_12040608\" class=\"wp-caption alignright\" style=\"max-width: 800px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"wp-image-12040608 size-medium\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/IMG_5828-800x1067.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"800\" height=\"1067\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/IMG_5828-800x1067.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/IMG_5828-1020x1360.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/IMG_5828-160x213.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/IMG_5828-1152x1536.jpg 1152w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/IMG_5828-1536x2048.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/IMG_5828-scaled.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 800px) 100vw, 800px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">A San Francisco city worker confiscated a hot dog vendor’s cart. \u003ccite>(Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>Philip said the inspections are to make sure that food vendors comply with state health laws, like having adequate refrigeration and handwashing, which she said many bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors lack.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Philip said that when SFDPH workers do unpermitted vending inspections, they lead with education and information about how to come into compliance with the health code. However, if vendors continue to sell in an unsafe manner, city workers can confiscate their food and equipment.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“ Because we want to decrease the chance that it will end up being sold to someone who could potentially get sick,” Philip said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>From July 1, 2023, to Dec. 19, 2024, Philip said SFDPH had carried out enforcement action against 239 vendors in which the city impounded unsafe food or unsafe equipment. The department does not keep track of how many of those actions are related specifically to bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The city has seen a rise in street vending of all kinds in recent years, not just bacon-wrapped hot dogs, partly because of the passage of two statewide bills. \u003ca href=\"https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billNavClient.xhtml?bill_id=201720180SB946\">Senate Bill 946\u003c/a>, passed in 2018, broadly decriminalized street vending throughout the state. And \u003ca href=\"https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billTextClient.xhtml?bill_id=202120220SB972\">SB 972,\u003c/a> which went into effect in 2023, reduced enforcement of sidewalk food vending from a criminal offense to one that can only incur administrative citations.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“So that timeline is consistent with some of the increase that we’re seeing,” Philip said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_12040603\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-12040603\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-01-BL_qed-1.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1333\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-01-BL_qed-1.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-01-BL_qed-1-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-01-BL_qed-1-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-01-BL_qed-1-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-01-BL_qed-1-1536x1024.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-01-BL_qed-1-1920x1280.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">A customer holds a bacon-wrapped hot dog from a vendor at Fisherman’s Wharf on April 24, 2025. \u003ccite>(Beth LaBerge/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003ch2>The only option\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>When the inspectors confiscate a vendor’s cart, they take it to the San Francisco Port property, where it’s held for 30 days. Vendors are allowed to recover their carts, but SFDPH can issue hefty fines — almost $3,000, in some cases.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania said that when her cart gets confiscated, she just buys a new one.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Even if we pay the fine, they would just come back and fine us again, only that time the fine would be more expensive,” Exania said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>At the end of the day, this is her only option for work. She said everywhere else she has tried, they want proof of residency, something she can’t provide. So she keeps working here.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[baycuriousquestion]\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>\u003ca id=\"A\">\u003c/a>Episode Transcript\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>This is a computer-generated transcript. While our team has reviewed it, there may be errors.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Katrina Schwartz: You smell them before you see them.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Hot dog, hot dog, hot dog!\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Katrina Schwartz: The scent is almost heavenly and they’ve become a Bay Area staple outside of sporting events, concerts, and late night bars. We’re talking of course about the bacon-wrapped hot dog. Chances are, if you live in the Bay Area, you’ve seen people selling this iconic street food.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Olivia Godfrey: It’s like an ice cream cart, but for hot dogs with just like their griddle on top and they always just have a stock of bacon-wrapped hot dogs, like ready to go.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Katrina Schwartz: That’s Olivia Godfrey. She grew up in Alameda, now lives in Oakland, and works as an usher at local venues like the Fox and the Greek Theatre. It’s in those places that she started to notice just how abundant these vendors are.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Olivia Godfrey: The hot dog people are everywhere. You see them every time you leave a venue, anytime you’re walking around the city.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Katrina Schwartz: She felt like their numbers had grown in recent years, and that got her wondering.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Olivia Godfrey: How much money do they make every year? Kind of like, what’s the history of them? How do they organize? I’d love to know how they like kind of came to be and like how they’ve become such a Bay Area staple.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Katrina Schwartz: I’m Katrina Schwartz, and today on Bay Curious, bacon-wrapped hot dogs! The roots of this culinary tradition, who sells them, what it’s like to do this work, and why some city governments are trying to stop them. Stay with us.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Katrina Schwartz: These days, it seems like bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors are anywhere there’s a crowd, concerts, sports games, touristy areas. It’s not uncommon to see dozens of people selling them from identical carts. For some, the relatively cheap, easy salty delicious snack is just what they’re craving. Others see issues with the fact that many of these vendors are unpermitted. KQED’s Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman looked into the controversy surrounding this porky problem, and how bacon-wrapped hot dogs became such a part of Bay Area street food culture.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Hot dog, amigo hot dog!\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: It’s 11 a.m. on a Saturday and Exania just got her first customers of the day. Her hot dog cart is one of about a dozen, parked outside the Alcatraz Ferry Terminal on San Francisco’s Embarcadero.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Ketchup, mustard, mayo?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Customer: Umm, I’m not going to do any of that.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Only onions?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Customer: Uhhh, yeah.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Okay.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Nick and Cameron Nelson just got off the Alcatraz Ferry and they’re hungry.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Customer: Oh, look at that.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Even my mouth starts to water as we watch the onions, peppers, and bacon-wrapped hot dogs heat up over a propane flame. Exania skillfully assembles the greasy delicious mess onto a bun and hands it over.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Customer: Do you take cards?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Yeah.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: For $10 a pop. Nick and Cameron walk away with a quick bite to eat. Nick is stoked.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Nick Nelson: I mean, all the onions on them are cool. I didn’t put all, like, the mayonnaise and ketchup on that, but I just, you know, who doesn’t like a bacon-wrapped hot dog? I feel like that’s, that’s really good, so.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Cameron, the dad, also appreciates a cheap meal in an expensive city.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Cameron Nelson: Yeah, going out to restaurants, this is sitting down, you’re looking at $80, can just keep walking and keep doing what we’re doing for $20.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: They amble off towards Pier 39. But Exania’s got work to do. We’re only using her first name due to fears about her immigration status.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Tengo tres años de vender acá y pues me siento bien.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She says she has been selling at this exact spot for the past three years. Basically the whole time she has been in the United States.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Cuando nosotros entramos acá por migración, nosotros pedimos asilo.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She says she left her home in Nicaragua in 2021, and made an asylum claim upon getting to the U.S. She says she was frightened to make the journey, but a lack of work and the political situation there left her few options.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Tenemos miedo, porque tú sabes cuántas cosas uno pasa para venir a este país.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She’s working to send money to her mother and three children back home in Nicaragua. But she says she’s also paying back the debt to the people who helped bring her here.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Aqui nosotros venimos endeudada. Con una deuda que dejamos en nuestro país y es una deuda que tenemos que pagarla, sino que quedamos en la calle. Mi familia quedaría en la calle.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: To pay for the trip, she says she took out a $14,000 loan. According to Exania, this loan wasn’t from a bank, but from a person. To get the loan, she had to use her mother’s house as collateral. If she doesn’t pay every month, the person who loaned her the money threatens to take her mom’s house. She showed me a WhatsApp thread where they keep a running tab. She still owes about $12,000.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Es algo muy, muy penoso, pero es la realidad.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She says when she first got to the U.S., the people who brought her here supposedly had a job for her. But she says she was treated badly, working long hours selling things like jewelry and ponchos on the street and making just $600 a month.\u003cbr>\nExania: Bajo lluvia, bajo sol, con hambre, con frío que tuve trabajando y en la temporada que yo le estuve trabajando a ella y yo me enfermé muchísimo.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She started selling bacon-wrapped hot dogs, she says, when a friend told her she was being exploited, and that she should start her own business.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Y me dice no le sigas ayudando a ella. Te está explotando. Ella está viviendo de ti. No sé. Y entonces, pues ya fue cuando él me animó a meterme a este negocio.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She says a friend sold her a cart for cheap, showed her the ropes, and she got started selling hot dogs. Exania says now she works for herself, she owns three hot dog carts and sometimes loans them to people who need work. They split the earnings 50,50. She also drives a van to move them all around.\u003cbr>\nShe says she feels good working at Pier 33, but sales can be fickle. In winter, it’s slow, she might only sell one or two hot dogs in a day, barely enough to cover parking and supplies. On a good day, she could sell more than 20, which would get her over $200 in a day. She buys her ingredients at stores like Restaurant Depot and chef stores, where she can buy 50 hot dogs for less than a dollar a piece.\u003cbr>\nThe area around the Embarcadero where Exania works is kind of like one big tourist attraction. Businesses of all kinds compete with each other. Of course there’s restaurants and museums, but there are also people who work outside.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Street Entertainer: Everybody’s say, woo. Everybody’s say, wow. Ladies and gentlemen….\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: And pedicabbers who earn their living by giving people bike rides up and down the wharf.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: Rides up to the sourdough, the sea lions, the chowder.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: And I quickly learned, there’s tension between the pedicabbers and the hot dog vendors. As I’m interviewing Exania, one pedicab driver approaches me.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Pedicab Driver: Are you going to go and interview legitimate businesses who pay taxes?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Am I going to?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Pedicab Driver: Yeah, I would hope you do. I’d hope you go to the restaurants that have been closed.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: The atmosphere becomes pretty tense. He asks me if I am going to interview legitimate businesses who pay taxes.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Pedicab Driver: These guys cost me about $5,000 a year. How do they, how do they? Because when they buy a hot dog, they don’t go to the wharf. Okay? Yeah, I pay taxes. I pay for a license. We pay permits. F*** these people.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: It’s a pretty open display of hostility. I can tell there is some bad blood. But I wanted to find out why so I asked another pedicab driver. He offered to fill me in, but suggested we go somewhere quieter.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: We’re going for a pedicab ride.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Where better to talk, than the back seat of a pedicab?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: I had a passenger once describe it as, uh, it’s like riding a couch down the sidewalk.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: This is Erik. He told me he’s been a pedicabber for eight years. He declined to give his last name because of fear of repercussions to his business if he spoke out against the hot dog vendors.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: They’re playing their music loud. They’re making a lot of noise soliciting the selling of hot dogs. Um, and they’ve crowded out the prime spot.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: You might be thinking how would the pedicab business be affected by bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors? Well, Erik says many of his best customers are hungry tourists headed to eat out. Pier 33 used to be his number one place to pick people up and make some money.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: We’re not just bike riders, we’re tour guides.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: But around 2021, as the COVID-19 pandemic started to ease, he says bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors started showing up in large numbers outside the terminal.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: Part of our job, part of our challenge is to engage people. So they’ll get in the bike with us. And, um, if they’re playing their music really loud, so they can’t hear us or if they’re yelling hot dog, hot dog, hot dog, so loud that they can’t hear us, then yeah, we, we get drowned out. We get, uh, moved to the back row.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Instead of getting a ride to lunch at a restaurant with a pedicabber, he says people at the ferry terminal started choosing to buy a bacon-wrapped hot dog instead, and just keep walking. Much like Nick and Cameron Nelson did at the beginning of this story.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: And that not only hurts us, the pedicabbers, but that hurts all the restaurants at Pier 39, all the restaurants down here, all the restaurants up at North Beach.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Erik says it’s unfair that many, if not all bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors don’t carry any kind of license with the city.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: We all have permits, the bikes have permits, we’re doing everything by regulation and they’re not.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Erik pays a yearly fee of $347 for a pedicab operator’s license. And his employer likely spends more. Other brick and mortar shops on the wharf have to pass health inspections and pay for building permits.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: So there’s a lot of local businesses that are paying the price for those people to be out there.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Erik says he supports the hot dog vendors’ right to make a living and hustle on the wharf just like he does. But he says it has to be fair.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: So find a way to do it right and legal and in a healthy, safe way. I’m all in, but that’s not what we have today.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: We take a ride back to Pier 33.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: Rickshaw rides, rides up to where you should be having lunch.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Erik points out that the sidewalk outside the Ferry Terminal is covered in grease splatters from all the hot dog carts. He raises another complaint commonly leveled against the hot dog vendors. Many don’t have adequate handwashing and refrigeration, and that’s a violation of food safety laws. Just then, something illustrates his point.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: Oh, look, look, look. See what happened over there. That knife hit the ground. It’s on that greasy sidewalk and wipe it with a napkin and let’s cut some more tomatoes or onions or whatever. That’s, it’s a health issue. Nobody, nobody at the city is doing anything about it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Erik clearly isn’t satisfied with how the city is responding, but since 2022, the city has been conducting regular inspections of unpermitted street vending seven days a week, including food vendors. That work is done by a multi-agency task force, which includes the San Francisco Department of Public Health.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Dr. Susan Philip: The main issues are, are foodborne, foodborne illness, and that that is what we are really concerned about.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Dr. Susan Philip is the director of the population health division at the San Francisco Department of Public Health. She says the main purpose of these inspections is to make sure that food vendors are in compliance with state health laws. Things like having adequate refrigeration and handwashing.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Dr. Susan Philip: Which many of the carts do not have those capabilities.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: I’ve seen pictures on social showing hot dogs for sale kept in moldy cardboard boxes below the carts. Dr. Philip says when DPH workers do unpermitted vending inspections, they lead with education and information about how to come into compliance with the health code. But if vendors are not willing to do that, city workers can confiscate their food and equipment.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Dr. Susan Philip: Because we want to decrease the chance that It will end up being sold to someone who could potentially get sick.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She says in a roughly year and a half period, 239 vendors had an enforcement action carried out against them, where the city impounded unsafe food or unsafe equipment. The department does not keep track of how many of those actions related specifically to bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors. Dr. Philip said these inspections aren’t just about food safety, city teams also look out for people selling stolen goods, or people blocking the public right of way.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Dr. Susan Philip: That is why this task force came about. And it really also is because of this, uh, increase, increase in overall vending that has been occurring in the city, um, as you know, the result of some of the, the changes in the state law.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Senate Bill 946, passed in 2018, broadly decriminalized street vending throughout the state. And SB 972 which went into effect in 2023, reduced enforcement of sidewalk food vending from a criminal offense to one that can only incur administrative citations.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Dr. Susan Philip: So that timeline is, is consistent with some of the increase that we’re, that we are seeing.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: So our question asker Olivia, is right: there has been an increase in street vending over the past few years. She also wanted to know where these hot dogs came from and while you might think of a hot dog as the classic all American food, to understand the origins of bacon-wrapped hot dogs, you have to check out Mexico.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bill Esparza: It has been one of my goals as I travel to new Latin American countries all the time is to try their local version of the hot dog and, and I’ve never been disappointed.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: This is Bill Esparza, he’s a food writer, senior contributor at Eater LA, and a bit of a hot dog expert.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bill Esparza: I went to Brazil and I was having hot dogs there and there’s are also very full of ingredients and wild toppings, you know, they put quail eggs on the hot dogs in Colombia.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: He says just south of the Arizona border in the Mexican State of Sonora, there is an especially famous type of hot dog. It’s known as a Sonoran dog, or a Dogo as the locals call it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bill Esparza: It’s like really important to them that, that the hot dogs are just like this. They’re like this big meal with all these flavors.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: It’s got a big wheat bun, think like a lobster roll. But what really makes it stand out are the condiments people put on top. Here are just some them:\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bill Esparza: Canned mushrooms, pickled jalapenos , liquid cheese, ruffles potato chips, black olives, sweet corn.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: The list goes on. Esparza says as best as we can tell, the arrival of the hot dog in Sonora can be traced back to one person. A Sonoran man named Don Cipriano Lucero, who opened a restaurant called Cafe KiKi in Hermosillo in 1947.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bill Esparza: So Don Cipriano Lucero brought the hot dog back from the United States and, um, started serving them there.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Don Cipriano served regular hot dogs, American style. But while Americans might be content with just a little mustard or ketchup, Esparza says the locals probably found it a little boring.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bill Esparza: Mexicans want spice and also Mexican very much like sweet.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: And there’s a Spanish word for what he says people did next. Tropicalizado. It means tropicalized. Over the years people in Sonora perfected the hot dog for their taste buds. They made the American hot dog to be more, well, Mexican. By adding spice, flavor, and richness.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bill Esparza: When the bacon came on, who knows, but it started to become a thing in the colleges in, uh, probably starting in the sixties.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Just as hot dogs were brought from the United States to Mexico, it was only a matter of time before dogos that had been tropicalizado and made it back to the United States.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bill Esparza: So it’s very possible that once hot dogs became popular in Sonora, that somebody came and brought them to Tijuana because those, those people are connected. Those two states are so connected.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Once in Tijuana, people traveling from Mexico into California might bring this culinary tradition with them. When it makes this cross-border journey, the dog changes again. Shedding the big wheaty bun and all the extra toppings for a pared down version you can see on Bay Area streets today.\u003cbr>\nBacon-wrapped hot dogs are celebrated in places like Hermosillo, but back at Pier 33, the vendors are constantly on the lookout for city inspection teams.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Johanna: ¿Alo? Aquí bajo, no, no, hay aquí venta.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: I’m speaking with a bacon-wrapped hot dog vendor named Johanna when she gets a call from another vendor down the street. They exchange information about sales, and also if anyone has seen city inspection teams around.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Johanna: No amiga, esta más abajo, por que como ayer cayó abajo, entonces nos avisaron que había la cuidad y nos movimos todo.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She asked to use her middle name due to fears about her immigration status. Johanna says it varies how often the city inspection teams come, sometimes as many as four times a day, sometimes not at all.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Johanna: Ayer cayeron dos veces y anteayer cayeron cuatro veces.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: There’s this strange sort of rhythm to the area around where the vendors work. It’s almost tidal. Every 30 minutes or so, a ferry from Alcatraz arrives at the pier, and drops off a boatload of tourists. As they exit the terminal, the pedicabbers and the hot dog vendors hock their wares, rides to the wharf, a quick snack.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Johanna: Algunos barcos son buenos.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Johanna says some boats are good, People are hungry. But others, nobody buys anything. Once the tourists leave, a strange quiet settles over the place. Vendors idly click their tongs. People joke with their neighbors, the pedicabbers take a nap in the back of their cab. They wait for the next boat. But city inspection teams can also come at any moment. When that happens it’s chaos.\u003cbr>\nJohanna shows me a video of one enforcement action by the city in March. City staff roll up in vehicles, Johanna and others run away, pushing their carts ahead of them. Johanna got caught, city workers took her cart, and that’s the third time that’s happened in about a year of vending. She says she had a panic attack and city workers called an ambulance for her.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Johanna: Llamaron a los bomberos primero, vinieron y me tomaron el pulso y dijeron de que no, que y había entrado, dicen en un pánico.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: When the inspectors confiscate a vendor’s cart, they take it to SF Port property where it’s held for 30 days. Vendors can try to get their carts back, but SFDPH can issue hefty fines, almost $3,000 in some cases.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Preferimos que se pierda.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Standing next to Johanna is Exania. Exania says when her cart gets confiscated, she just buys a new one.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Porque igual compramos otros los quitan. Aunque vayamos a pagar esa multa, vienen de nuevo y los quitan entonces, ¿qué hacemos?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She says even if she was to pay the fine and get her cart back, the city would just come and take it again, only this time with a heftier fine.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: De todas maneras nos agarran nuestros nombres y en otra nos viene una multa más cara.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She shows me the Amazon listing for these exact carts. It’s a $50 tool cart, but outfitting it with a stove and cooktop and everything else they need brings the price up to around $450. Exania says it can take a while to get the money and supplies together.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Hay que hacer un proceso primero a juntar dinero para armarlo, porque a veces cuando nos dejan sin nada, imaginate, tenemos que ver por otro lado, para comprar el material\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: But at the end of the day, she says this is her only option for work. She says everywhere else she has tried, they want proof of residency. Something she can’t provide. So she keeps working here.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Es la única manera que tenemos para trabajar. Sí, porque donde quiera que vayamos, nos piden papeles.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Exania says she’s well aware that she’s working without permits from the city, but says she tries to follow the health code as best she can.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Compramos diarios lo que podemos vender y lo que ya sobra, lo metemos a la hielera, a la refri, para que no se nos dañe.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She brings fresh ingredients, the hot dogs are frozen at the start of the day, and she refrigerates what she doesn’t sell. Exania says if she could say one thing to the city, it would be this:\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Que nos dejen de maltratar, de seguirnos. Porque aquí nosotros trabajamos decentemente, no le robamos a nadie, no dañamos a nadie.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Stop treating us badly. We’re just here to work decently. We’re not robbing anybody, and we’re not hurting anyone.\u003cbr>\nAfter all this, I caught back up with Olivia Godfrey, the question asker. I told her about Exania, and the pedicabbers, and the health department, and the history of bacon-wrapped hot dogs, and everything else. When she asked this question, she came from a place of wanting to know how to support these vendors.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Olivia Godfrey: I think we should be able to support our community around us.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: But I raised the pedicabbers’ concerns, that many local businesses say they’re hurting because of these vendors. And aren’t they also part of our community?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: How can we support both? Or like, like do you think that like supporting a bacon-wrapped hot dog vendor is to the detriment of other businesses?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Olivia Godfrey: Oh man, that’s so tough.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: I also asked her about the food safety aspect. Knowing that these hot dogs likely weren’t up to the food code, did she feel safe eating them?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Olivia Godfrey: Oh, no, that’s definitely something that you’re aware of, of like, you might take your chances on like maybe not feeling well afterwards.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: I know what she means, growing up in San Francisco, my friends and I called them Danger Dogs.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Knowing what you know now, do you think that you would still buy a bacon-wrapped hot dog?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Olivia Godfrey: Yes, definitely. I kind of sympathize with people like the industry or the other folks in that like Pier 39 area that might be struggling because of this, but where I’m frequenting them is like concert venues and things like that. And I’ll of course support those folks because who doesn’t love a good bacon-wrapped hot dog after a concert?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: There’s some people who definitely don’t love them. But the bacon-wrapped hot dog has undeniably become an iconic Bay Area Street food.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Katrina Schwartz: That was KQED’s Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman. Bay Curious is made in San Francisco at member-supported KQED. Our show is produced by: Gabriela Glueck, Christopher Beale, and me, Katrina Schwartz. With extra support from Alana Walker, Maha Sanad, Katie Springer, Jen Chien, Holly Kernan, and everyone on team KQED. Some members of the KQED podcast team are represented by The Screen Actors Guild, American Federation of Television and Radio Artists. San Francisco Northern California Local.\u003cbr>\nThanks for listening. Have a great week!\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad floatright]\u003c/p>\n",
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"excerpt": "You can get them at Pier 39, outside The Fillmore or when leaving Chase Center. However, this popular street food is causing tension with some local businesses and city officials.",
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"content": "\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003cem>\u003ca href=\"#A\">View the full episode transcript.\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Every arrival and departure of an Alcatraz ferry brings a flurry of activity to San Francisco’s Pier 33. As tourists shuffle in and out of the busy terminal, bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors are there, drumming up customers.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003cp>\u003caside class=\"alignleft utils-parseShortcode-shortcodes-__bayCuriousPodcastShortcode__bayCurious\">\u003cimg src=https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/02/bayCuriousLogo.png alt=\"Bay Curious Podcast\" loading=\"lazy\" />\n What do you wonder about the Bay Area, its culture or people that you want KQED to investigate?\n \u003ca href=\"/news/series/baycurious\">Ask Bay Curious.\u003c/a>\u003c/aside>\u003c/p>\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The air is perfumed with the intoxicating smell of onions, peppers and bacon-wrapped hot dogs sizzling on makeshift cooktops. A normal day brings around a dozen vendors who click their tongs and yell “hot dog, hot dog, hot dog!” as they try to make a buck.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>It’s a scene. But the Embarcadero isn’t the only place you can find a bacon-wrapped hot dog in the Bay Area these days.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The hot dog people are everywhere,” Bay Curious listener Olivia Godfrey said. “You see them every time you leave a venue, anytime you’re walking around the city.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>",
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"content": "\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Godfrey works as an usher at Bay Area music venues like the Fox Theater and Bill Graham Auditorium, and it’s at those places that she began to suspect that the number of people selling bacon-wrapped hot dogs has grown in recent years. That got her wondering:\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“How much money do they make every year? What’s the history of them? How do they organize?” Godfrey asked, “I’d love to know how they came to be and how they’ve become such a Bay Area staple.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>This simple street food has a complicated legacy. The history crosses international borders, and there’s a fierce controversy around how these vendors work in the San Francisco Bay Area.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_12037931\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-12037931\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-17-BL-KQED.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1333\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-17-BL-KQED.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-17-BL-KQED-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-17-BL-KQED-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-17-BL-KQED-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-17-BL-KQED-1536x1024.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-17-BL-KQED-1920x1280.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">People walk past The Dog House, a hot dog stand, in Fisherman’s Wharf on April 24, 2025. \u003ccite>(Beth LaBerge/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003ch2>Where do bacon-wrapped hot dogs come from?\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>Just south of the Arizona border in the Mexican State of Sonora, there is an especially famous type of hot dog. It’s known as a Sonoran dog, or a \u003cem>dogo, \u003c/em>as the locals call it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“It’s really important to them that the hot dogs are a big meal with all these flavors,” said Bill Esparza, a food writer and a \u003ca href=\"https://www.eater.com/authors/bill-esparza\">senior contributor at Eater LA.\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>It’s got a big wheat bun, like a lobster roll. But what really makes it stand out are the condiments people put on top, such as canned mushrooms, pickled jalapenos, and liquid cheese, to name a few, according to Esparza.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The arrival of the hot dog in Sonora can be traced back to one person. \u003ca href=\"https://oem.com.mx/elsoldehermosillo/tendencias/como-llegaron-los-dogos-a-hermosillo-te-contamos-la-historia-19055503\">A Sonoran man named Don Cipriano Lucero\u003c/a>, who had worked in the United States and brought hot dogs back to the city of Hermosillo. He opened a restaurant there in 1947 called Cafe KiKi.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_12040596\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\" style=\"max-width: 1024px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-12040596\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/GettyImages-2158959446.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"1024\" height=\"683\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/GettyImages-2158959446.jpg 1024w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/GettyImages-2158959446-800x534.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/GettyImages-2158959446-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/GettyImages-2158959446-160x107.jpg 160w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 1024px) 100vw, 1024px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">A Sonoran Hot Dog — or ‘dogo’ — photographed in Washington, D.C., on June 24, 2024. \u003ccite>(Scott Suchman with food styling by Lisa Cherkasky for The Washington Post via Getty Images)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>Don Cipriano served regular hot dogs, American style. But while Americans might be content with just a little mustard or ketchup, Esparza said the locals probably found it a little boring.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Mexicans want spice, and also Mexicans very much like sweet,” Esparza said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>So they started tinkering, perfecting the hot dog for their taste buds by adding spice, and flavor, and richness. There’s a Spanish word for this process — \u003cem>tropicalizado\u003c/em>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“When the bacon came on, who knows, but it started to become a thing in the colleges, probably starting in the sixties,” Esparza said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Just as hot dogs were brought from the United States to Mexico, it was only a matter of time before \u003cem>dogos \u003c/em>made it back to the United States, shedding the wheat bun and all the extra toppings for the pared-down version on Bay Area streets today.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_12037929\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-12037929\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-12-BL-KQED.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1333\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-12-BL-KQED.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-12-BL-KQED-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-12-BL-KQED-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-12-BL-KQED-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-12-BL-KQED-1536x1024.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/04/250424-DANGERDOGS-12-BL-KQED-1920x1280.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">Vendors sell bacon-wrapped hot dogs at Fisherman’s Wharf on April 24, 2025. \u003ccite>(Beth LaBerge/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003ch2>A day on the wharf\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>And these dogs are popular. A vendor named Exania works a cart outside Pier 33 in San Francisco. She asked KQED not to share her full name due to fears about her immigration status.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I work so that my children can continue studying, and to help my mother,” Exania said in Spanish.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>She said she left her home and family in Nicaragua in 2021 and made an asylum claim upon getting to the U.S. She’s been selling bacon-wrapped hot dogs at Pier 33 for the past three years. Much of her earnings go to paying back the $14,000 debt she took on in order to pay for her journey here. She owes, not a bank, but a person that money. And she said she had to put up her mother’s house as collateral for the loan.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“That’s why you will see me here every day, no matter if it’s sunny, rainy, or cold,” Exania said. “If I don’t pay my debt, my family will end up in the street.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>If she doesn’t pay every month, the person who loaned her the money threatens to take her mom’s house. There’s a running tab of how much she owes on a WhatsApp thread with the collector. She still owes about $12,000.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“It’s very painful, but it’s reality,” Exania said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_12040575\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\" style=\"max-width: 2500px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-12040575\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/Side-by-side-Downpage-1.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"2500\" height=\"833\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/Side-by-side-Downpage-1.jpg 2500w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/Side-by-side-Downpage-1-800x267.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/Side-by-side-Downpage-1-1020x340.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/Side-by-side-Downpage-1-160x53.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/Side-by-side-Downpage-1-1536x512.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/Side-by-side-Downpage-1-2048x682.jpg 2048w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/Side-by-side-Downpage-1-1920x640.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 2500px) 100vw, 2500px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">Bacon-wrapped hot dogs from a vendor at Fisherman’s Wharf on April 24, 2025. \u003ccite>(Beth LaBerge/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>A friend sold her a cart for cheap and showed her the ropes, she said. She insisted she works for herself and said she feels good selling at Pier 33. She owns three hot dog carts and sometimes loans them to people who need work. They split the earnings 50–50. She also drives a van to move them all around.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Sales can be fickle. In winter, it’s slow, so she might only sell one or two hot dogs in a day, barely enough to cover parking and supplies. On a good day, she could sell more than 20, which would get her over $200. She buys her ingredients at stores like Restaurant Depot and Chef’s Stores, where she can buy 50 hot dogs for less than a dollar a piece.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>Tension on the Embarcadero\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>In the area where Exania works, merchants of all kinds compete with each other for tourists’ attention and money. Some said the bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors unfairly take business from them.\u003c/p>\u003c/div>",
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"content": "\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>Erik has been driving a pedicab for eight years and said Pier 33 used to be one of the best places for pedicabbers to make money. But, around 2021, as the COVID-19 pandemic started to ease, he said bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors started showing up in large numbers outside the terminal. He declined to give his full name due to fear of repercussion if he spoke out against the hot dog vendors.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Part of the challenge of our job is to engage people so they’ll get in the bike with us,” Erik explained. “And if the vendors are yelling ‘hot dog, hot dog, hot dog,’ so loud that people can’t hear us, then we get drowned out. We get moved to the back row.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik said it’s unfair that many, if not all, bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors don’t carry any kind of license with the city, when pedicabbers and other businesses on the wharf have to carry permits and pass inspections. He claimed that if people buy a bacon-wrapped hot dog, they don’t patronize restaurants, and they’re less likely to hire a pedicab to take them to a place to eat.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“That not only hurts us, the pedicabbers, but that hurts all the restaurants at Pier 39 and North Beach,” Erik said. “So find a way to do it in a legal and healthy, safe way. I’m all in, but that’s not what we have today.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_12040599\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-12040599\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-04-BL_qed.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1333\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-04-BL_qed.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-04-BL_qed-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-04-BL_qed-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-04-BL_qed-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-04-BL_qed-1536x1024.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-04-BL_qed-1920x1280.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">Vendors sell bacon-wrapped hot dogs at Fisherman’s Wharf on April 24, 2025. \u003ccite>(Beth LaBerge/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003ch2>The rise of street vending — and crackdowns\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>Since 2022, San Francisco has been conducting regular inspections of unpermitted street vending seven days a week, including food vendors.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The main issues are foodborne illness, and that is what we are really concerned about,” said Dr. Susan Philip, the director of the population health division at the San Francisco Department of Public Health (SFDPH).\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_12040608\" class=\"wp-caption alignright\" style=\"max-width: 800px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"wp-image-12040608 size-medium\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/IMG_5828-800x1067.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"800\" height=\"1067\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/IMG_5828-800x1067.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/IMG_5828-1020x1360.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/IMG_5828-160x213.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/IMG_5828-1152x1536.jpg 1152w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/IMG_5828-1536x2048.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/IMG_5828-scaled.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 800px) 100vw, 800px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">A San Francisco city worker confiscated a hot dog vendor’s cart. \u003ccite>(Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>Philip said the inspections are to make sure that food vendors comply with state health laws, like having adequate refrigeration and handwashing, which she said many bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors lack.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Philip said that when SFDPH workers do unpermitted vending inspections, they lead with education and information about how to come into compliance with the health code. However, if vendors continue to sell in an unsafe manner, city workers can confiscate their food and equipment.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“ Because we want to decrease the chance that it will end up being sold to someone who could potentially get sick,” Philip said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>From July 1, 2023, to Dec. 19, 2024, Philip said SFDPH had carried out enforcement action against 239 vendors in which the city impounded unsafe food or unsafe equipment. The department does not keep track of how many of those actions are related specifically to bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The city has seen a rise in street vending of all kinds in recent years, not just bacon-wrapped hot dogs, partly because of the passage of two statewide bills. \u003ca href=\"https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billNavClient.xhtml?bill_id=201720180SB946\">Senate Bill 946\u003c/a>, passed in 2018, broadly decriminalized street vending throughout the state. And \u003ca href=\"https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billTextClient.xhtml?bill_id=202120220SB972\">SB 972,\u003c/a> which went into effect in 2023, reduced enforcement of sidewalk food vending from a criminal offense to one that can only incur administrative citations.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“So that timeline is consistent with some of the increase that we’re seeing,” Philip said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_12040603\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-12040603\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-01-BL_qed-1.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1333\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-01-BL_qed-1.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-01-BL_qed-1-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-01-BL_qed-1-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-01-BL_qed-1-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-01-BL_qed-1-1536x1024.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2025/05/250424-DangerDogs-01-BL_qed-1-1920x1280.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">A customer holds a bacon-wrapped hot dog from a vendor at Fisherman’s Wharf on April 24, 2025. \u003ccite>(Beth LaBerge/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003ch2>The only option\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>When the inspectors confiscate a vendor’s cart, they take it to the San Francisco Port property, where it’s held for 30 days. Vendors are allowed to recover their carts, but SFDPH can issue hefty fines — almost $3,000, in some cases.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania said that when her cart gets confiscated, she just buys a new one.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Even if we pay the fine, they would just come back and fine us again, only that time the fine would be more expensive,” Exania said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>At the end of the day, this is her only option for work. She said everywhere else she has tried, they want proof of residency, something she can’t provide. So she keeps working here.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>",
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"content": "\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>\u003ca id=\"A\">\u003c/a>Episode Transcript\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>This is a computer-generated transcript. While our team has reviewed it, there may be errors.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Katrina Schwartz: You smell them before you see them.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Hot dog, hot dog, hot dog!\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Katrina Schwartz: The scent is almost heavenly and they’ve become a Bay Area staple outside of sporting events, concerts, and late night bars. We’re talking of course about the bacon-wrapped hot dog. Chances are, if you live in the Bay Area, you’ve seen people selling this iconic street food.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Olivia Godfrey: It’s like an ice cream cart, but for hot dogs with just like their griddle on top and they always just have a stock of bacon-wrapped hot dogs, like ready to go.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Katrina Schwartz: That’s Olivia Godfrey. She grew up in Alameda, now lives in Oakland, and works as an usher at local venues like the Fox and the Greek Theatre. It’s in those places that she started to notice just how abundant these vendors are.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Olivia Godfrey: The hot dog people are everywhere. You see them every time you leave a venue, anytime you’re walking around the city.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Katrina Schwartz: She felt like their numbers had grown in recent years, and that got her wondering.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Olivia Godfrey: How much money do they make every year? Kind of like, what’s the history of them? How do they organize? I’d love to know how they like kind of came to be and like how they’ve become such a Bay Area staple.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Katrina Schwartz: I’m Katrina Schwartz, and today on Bay Curious, bacon-wrapped hot dogs! The roots of this culinary tradition, who sells them, what it’s like to do this work, and why some city governments are trying to stop them. Stay with us.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Katrina Schwartz: These days, it seems like bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors are anywhere there’s a crowd, concerts, sports games, touristy areas. It’s not uncommon to see dozens of people selling them from identical carts. For some, the relatively cheap, easy salty delicious snack is just what they’re craving. Others see issues with the fact that many of these vendors are unpermitted. KQED’s Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman looked into the controversy surrounding this porky problem, and how bacon-wrapped hot dogs became such a part of Bay Area street food culture.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Hot dog, amigo hot dog!\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: It’s 11 a.m. on a Saturday and Exania just got her first customers of the day. Her hot dog cart is one of about a dozen, parked outside the Alcatraz Ferry Terminal on San Francisco’s Embarcadero.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Ketchup, mustard, mayo?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Customer: Umm, I’m not going to do any of that.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Only onions?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Customer: Uhhh, yeah.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Okay.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Nick and Cameron Nelson just got off the Alcatraz Ferry and they’re hungry.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Customer: Oh, look at that.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Even my mouth starts to water as we watch the onions, peppers, and bacon-wrapped hot dogs heat up over a propane flame. Exania skillfully assembles the greasy delicious mess onto a bun and hands it over.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Customer: Do you take cards?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Yeah.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: For $10 a pop. Nick and Cameron walk away with a quick bite to eat. Nick is stoked.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Nick Nelson: I mean, all the onions on them are cool. I didn’t put all, like, the mayonnaise and ketchup on that, but I just, you know, who doesn’t like a bacon-wrapped hot dog? I feel like that’s, that’s really good, so.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Cameron, the dad, also appreciates a cheap meal in an expensive city.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Cameron Nelson: Yeah, going out to restaurants, this is sitting down, you’re looking at $80, can just keep walking and keep doing what we’re doing for $20.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: They amble off towards Pier 39. But Exania’s got work to do. We’re only using her first name due to fears about her immigration status.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Tengo tres años de vender acá y pues me siento bien.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She says she has been selling at this exact spot for the past three years. Basically the whole time she has been in the United States.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Cuando nosotros entramos acá por migración, nosotros pedimos asilo.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She says she left her home in Nicaragua in 2021, and made an asylum claim upon getting to the U.S. She says she was frightened to make the journey, but a lack of work and the political situation there left her few options.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Tenemos miedo, porque tú sabes cuántas cosas uno pasa para venir a este país.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She’s working to send money to her mother and three children back home in Nicaragua. But she says she’s also paying back the debt to the people who helped bring her here.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Aqui nosotros venimos endeudada. Con una deuda que dejamos en nuestro país y es una deuda que tenemos que pagarla, sino que quedamos en la calle. Mi familia quedaría en la calle.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: To pay for the trip, she says she took out a $14,000 loan. According to Exania, this loan wasn’t from a bank, but from a person. To get the loan, she had to use her mother’s house as collateral. If she doesn’t pay every month, the person who loaned her the money threatens to take her mom’s house. She showed me a WhatsApp thread where they keep a running tab. She still owes about $12,000.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Es algo muy, muy penoso, pero es la realidad.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She says when she first got to the U.S., the people who brought her here supposedly had a job for her. But she says she was treated badly, working long hours selling things like jewelry and ponchos on the street and making just $600 a month.\u003cbr>\nExania: Bajo lluvia, bajo sol, con hambre, con frío que tuve trabajando y en la temporada que yo le estuve trabajando a ella y yo me enfermé muchísimo.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She started selling bacon-wrapped hot dogs, she says, when a friend told her she was being exploited, and that she should start her own business.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Y me dice no le sigas ayudando a ella. Te está explotando. Ella está viviendo de ti. No sé. Y entonces, pues ya fue cuando él me animó a meterme a este negocio.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She says a friend sold her a cart for cheap, showed her the ropes, and she got started selling hot dogs. Exania says now she works for herself, she owns three hot dog carts and sometimes loans them to people who need work. They split the earnings 50,50. She also drives a van to move them all around.\u003cbr>\nShe says she feels good working at Pier 33, but sales can be fickle. In winter, it’s slow, she might only sell one or two hot dogs in a day, barely enough to cover parking and supplies. On a good day, she could sell more than 20, which would get her over $200 in a day. She buys her ingredients at stores like Restaurant Depot and chef stores, where she can buy 50 hot dogs for less than a dollar a piece.\u003cbr>\nThe area around the Embarcadero where Exania works is kind of like one big tourist attraction. Businesses of all kinds compete with each other. Of course there’s restaurants and museums, but there are also people who work outside.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Street Entertainer: Everybody’s say, woo. Everybody’s say, wow. Ladies and gentlemen….\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: And pedicabbers who earn their living by giving people bike rides up and down the wharf.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: Rides up to the sourdough, the sea lions, the chowder.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: And I quickly learned, there’s tension between the pedicabbers and the hot dog vendors. As I’m interviewing Exania, one pedicab driver approaches me.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Pedicab Driver: Are you going to go and interview legitimate businesses who pay taxes?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Am I going to?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Pedicab Driver: Yeah, I would hope you do. I’d hope you go to the restaurants that have been closed.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: The atmosphere becomes pretty tense. He asks me if I am going to interview legitimate businesses who pay taxes.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Pedicab Driver: These guys cost me about $5,000 a year. How do they, how do they? Because when they buy a hot dog, they don’t go to the wharf. Okay? Yeah, I pay taxes. I pay for a license. We pay permits. F*** these people.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: It’s a pretty open display of hostility. I can tell there is some bad blood. But I wanted to find out why so I asked another pedicab driver. He offered to fill me in, but suggested we go somewhere quieter.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: We’re going for a pedicab ride.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Where better to talk, than the back seat of a pedicab?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: I had a passenger once describe it as, uh, it’s like riding a couch down the sidewalk.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: This is Erik. He told me he’s been a pedicabber for eight years. He declined to give his last name because of fear of repercussions to his business if he spoke out against the hot dog vendors.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: They’re playing their music loud. They’re making a lot of noise soliciting the selling of hot dogs. Um, and they’ve crowded out the prime spot.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: You might be thinking how would the pedicab business be affected by bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors? Well, Erik says many of his best customers are hungry tourists headed to eat out. Pier 33 used to be his number one place to pick people up and make some money.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: We’re not just bike riders, we’re tour guides.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: But around 2021, as the COVID-19 pandemic started to ease, he says bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors started showing up in large numbers outside the terminal.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: Part of our job, part of our challenge is to engage people. So they’ll get in the bike with us. And, um, if they’re playing their music really loud, so they can’t hear us or if they’re yelling hot dog, hot dog, hot dog, so loud that they can’t hear us, then yeah, we, we get drowned out. We get, uh, moved to the back row.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Instead of getting a ride to lunch at a restaurant with a pedicabber, he says people at the ferry terminal started choosing to buy a bacon-wrapped hot dog instead, and just keep walking. Much like Nick and Cameron Nelson did at the beginning of this story.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: And that not only hurts us, the pedicabbers, but that hurts all the restaurants at Pier 39, all the restaurants down here, all the restaurants up at North Beach.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Erik says it’s unfair that many, if not all bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors don’t carry any kind of license with the city.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: We all have permits, the bikes have permits, we’re doing everything by regulation and they’re not.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Erik pays a yearly fee of $347 for a pedicab operator’s license. And his employer likely spends more. Other brick and mortar shops on the wharf have to pass health inspections and pay for building permits.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: So there’s a lot of local businesses that are paying the price for those people to be out there.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Erik says he supports the hot dog vendors’ right to make a living and hustle on the wharf just like he does. But he says it has to be fair.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: So find a way to do it right and legal and in a healthy, safe way. I’m all in, but that’s not what we have today.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: We take a ride back to Pier 33.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: Rickshaw rides, rides up to where you should be having lunch.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Erik points out that the sidewalk outside the Ferry Terminal is covered in grease splatters from all the hot dog carts. He raises another complaint commonly leveled against the hot dog vendors. Many don’t have adequate handwashing and refrigeration, and that’s a violation of food safety laws. Just then, something illustrates his point.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erik: Oh, look, look, look. See what happened over there. That knife hit the ground. It’s on that greasy sidewalk and wipe it with a napkin and let’s cut some more tomatoes or onions or whatever. That’s, it’s a health issue. Nobody, nobody at the city is doing anything about it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Erik clearly isn’t satisfied with how the city is responding, but since 2022, the city has been conducting regular inspections of unpermitted street vending seven days a week, including food vendors. That work is done by a multi-agency task force, which includes the San Francisco Department of Public Health.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Dr. Susan Philip: The main issues are, are foodborne, foodborne illness, and that that is what we are really concerned about.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Dr. Susan Philip is the director of the population health division at the San Francisco Department of Public Health. She says the main purpose of these inspections is to make sure that food vendors are in compliance with state health laws. Things like having adequate refrigeration and handwashing.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Dr. Susan Philip: Which many of the carts do not have those capabilities.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: I’ve seen pictures on social showing hot dogs for sale kept in moldy cardboard boxes below the carts. Dr. Philip says when DPH workers do unpermitted vending inspections, they lead with education and information about how to come into compliance with the health code. But if vendors are not willing to do that, city workers can confiscate their food and equipment.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Dr. Susan Philip: Because we want to decrease the chance that It will end up being sold to someone who could potentially get sick.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She says in a roughly year and a half period, 239 vendors had an enforcement action carried out against them, where the city impounded unsafe food or unsafe equipment. The department does not keep track of how many of those actions related specifically to bacon-wrapped hot dog vendors. Dr. Philip said these inspections aren’t just about food safety, city teams also look out for people selling stolen goods, or people blocking the public right of way.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Dr. Susan Philip: That is why this task force came about. And it really also is because of this, uh, increase, increase in overall vending that has been occurring in the city, um, as you know, the result of some of the, the changes in the state law.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Senate Bill 946, passed in 2018, broadly decriminalized street vending throughout the state. And SB 972 which went into effect in 2023, reduced enforcement of sidewalk food vending from a criminal offense to one that can only incur administrative citations.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Dr. Susan Philip: So that timeline is, is consistent with some of the increase that we’re, that we are seeing.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: So our question asker Olivia, is right: there has been an increase in street vending over the past few years. She also wanted to know where these hot dogs came from and while you might think of a hot dog as the classic all American food, to understand the origins of bacon-wrapped hot dogs, you have to check out Mexico.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bill Esparza: It has been one of my goals as I travel to new Latin American countries all the time is to try their local version of the hot dog and, and I’ve never been disappointed.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: This is Bill Esparza, he’s a food writer, senior contributor at Eater LA, and a bit of a hot dog expert.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bill Esparza: I went to Brazil and I was having hot dogs there and there’s are also very full of ingredients and wild toppings, you know, they put quail eggs on the hot dogs in Colombia.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: He says just south of the Arizona border in the Mexican State of Sonora, there is an especially famous type of hot dog. It’s known as a Sonoran dog, or a Dogo as the locals call it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bill Esparza: It’s like really important to them that, that the hot dogs are just like this. They’re like this big meal with all these flavors.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: It’s got a big wheat bun, think like a lobster roll. But what really makes it stand out are the condiments people put on top. Here are just some them:\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bill Esparza: Canned mushrooms, pickled jalapenos , liquid cheese, ruffles potato chips, black olives, sweet corn.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: The list goes on. Esparza says as best as we can tell, the arrival of the hot dog in Sonora can be traced back to one person. A Sonoran man named Don Cipriano Lucero, who opened a restaurant called Cafe KiKi in Hermosillo in 1947.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bill Esparza: So Don Cipriano Lucero brought the hot dog back from the United States and, um, started serving them there.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Don Cipriano served regular hot dogs, American style. But while Americans might be content with just a little mustard or ketchup, Esparza says the locals probably found it a little boring.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bill Esparza: Mexicans want spice and also Mexican very much like sweet.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: And there’s a Spanish word for what he says people did next. Tropicalizado. It means tropicalized. Over the years people in Sonora perfected the hot dog for their taste buds. They made the American hot dog to be more, well, Mexican. By adding spice, flavor, and richness.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bill Esparza: When the bacon came on, who knows, but it started to become a thing in the colleges in, uh, probably starting in the sixties.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Just as hot dogs were brought from the United States to Mexico, it was only a matter of time before dogos that had been tropicalizado and made it back to the United States.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Bill Esparza: So it’s very possible that once hot dogs became popular in Sonora, that somebody came and brought them to Tijuana because those, those people are connected. Those two states are so connected.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Once in Tijuana, people traveling from Mexico into California might bring this culinary tradition with them. When it makes this cross-border journey, the dog changes again. Shedding the big wheaty bun and all the extra toppings for a pared down version you can see on Bay Area streets today.\u003cbr>\nBacon-wrapped hot dogs are celebrated in places like Hermosillo, but back at Pier 33, the vendors are constantly on the lookout for city inspection teams.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Johanna: ¿Alo? Aquí bajo, no, no, hay aquí venta.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: I’m speaking with a bacon-wrapped hot dog vendor named Johanna when she gets a call from another vendor down the street. They exchange information about sales, and also if anyone has seen city inspection teams around.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Johanna: No amiga, esta más abajo, por que como ayer cayó abajo, entonces nos avisaron que había la cuidad y nos movimos todo.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She asked to use her middle name due to fears about her immigration status. Johanna says it varies how often the city inspection teams come, sometimes as many as four times a day, sometimes not at all.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Johanna: Ayer cayeron dos veces y anteayer cayeron cuatro veces.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: There’s this strange sort of rhythm to the area around where the vendors work. It’s almost tidal. Every 30 minutes or so, a ferry from Alcatraz arrives at the pier, and drops off a boatload of tourists. As they exit the terminal, the pedicabbers and the hot dog vendors hock their wares, rides to the wharf, a quick snack.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Johanna: Algunos barcos son buenos.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Johanna says some boats are good, People are hungry. But others, nobody buys anything. Once the tourists leave, a strange quiet settles over the place. Vendors idly click their tongs. People joke with their neighbors, the pedicabbers take a nap in the back of their cab. They wait for the next boat. But city inspection teams can also come at any moment. When that happens it’s chaos.\u003cbr>\nJohanna shows me a video of one enforcement action by the city in March. City staff roll up in vehicles, Johanna and others run away, pushing their carts ahead of them. Johanna got caught, city workers took her cart, and that’s the third time that’s happened in about a year of vending. She says she had a panic attack and city workers called an ambulance for her.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Johanna: Llamaron a los bomberos primero, vinieron y me tomaron el pulso y dijeron de que no, que y había entrado, dicen en un pánico.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: When the inspectors confiscate a vendor’s cart, they take it to SF Port property where it’s held for 30 days. Vendors can try to get their carts back, but SFDPH can issue hefty fines, almost $3,000 in some cases.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Preferimos que se pierda.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Standing next to Johanna is Exania. Exania says when her cart gets confiscated, she just buys a new one.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Porque igual compramos otros los quitan. Aunque vayamos a pagar esa multa, vienen de nuevo y los quitan entonces, ¿qué hacemos?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She says even if she was to pay the fine and get her cart back, the city would just come and take it again, only this time with a heftier fine.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: De todas maneras nos agarran nuestros nombres y en otra nos viene una multa más cara.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She shows me the Amazon listing for these exact carts. It’s a $50 tool cart, but outfitting it with a stove and cooktop and everything else they need brings the price up to around $450. Exania says it can take a while to get the money and supplies together.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Hay que hacer un proceso primero a juntar dinero para armarlo, porque a veces cuando nos dejan sin nada, imaginate, tenemos que ver por otro lado, para comprar el material\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: But at the end of the day, she says this is her only option for work. She says everywhere else she has tried, they want proof of residency. Something she can’t provide. So she keeps working here.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Es la única manera que tenemos para trabajar. Sí, porque donde quiera que vayamos, nos piden papeles.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Exania says she’s well aware that she’s working without permits from the city, but says she tries to follow the health code as best she can.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Compramos diarios lo que podemos vender y lo que ya sobra, lo metemos a la hielera, a la refri, para que no se nos dañe.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: She brings fresh ingredients, the hot dogs are frozen at the start of the day, and she refrigerates what she doesn’t sell. Exania says if she could say one thing to the city, it would be this:\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Exania: Que nos dejen de maltratar, de seguirnos. Porque aquí nosotros trabajamos decentemente, no le robamos a nadie, no dañamos a nadie.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Stop treating us badly. We’re just here to work decently. We’re not robbing anybody, and we’re not hurting anyone.\u003cbr>\nAfter all this, I caught back up with Olivia Godfrey, the question asker. I told her about Exania, and the pedicabbers, and the health department, and the history of bacon-wrapped hot dogs, and everything else. When she asked this question, she came from a place of wanting to know how to support these vendors.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Olivia Godfrey: I think we should be able to support our community around us.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: But I raised the pedicabbers’ concerns, that many local businesses say they’re hurting because of these vendors. And aren’t they also part of our community?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: How can we support both? Or like, like do you think that like supporting a bacon-wrapped hot dog vendor is to the detriment of other businesses?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Olivia Godfrey: Oh man, that’s so tough.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: I also asked her about the food safety aspect. Knowing that these hot dogs likely weren’t up to the food code, did she feel safe eating them?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Olivia Godfrey: Oh, no, that’s definitely something that you’re aware of, of like, you might take your chances on like maybe not feeling well afterwards.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: I know what she means, growing up in San Francisco, my friends and I called them Danger Dogs.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: Knowing what you know now, do you think that you would still buy a bacon-wrapped hot dog?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Olivia Godfrey: Yes, definitely. I kind of sympathize with people like the industry or the other folks in that like Pier 39 area that might be struggling because of this, but where I’m frequenting them is like concert venues and things like that. And I’ll of course support those folks because who doesn’t love a good bacon-wrapped hot dog after a concert?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman: There’s some people who definitely don’t love them. But the bacon-wrapped hot dog has undeniably become an iconic Bay Area Street food.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Katrina Schwartz: That was KQED’s Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman. Bay Curious is made in San Francisco at member-supported KQED. Our show is produced by: Gabriela Glueck, Christopher Beale, and me, Katrina Schwartz. With extra support from Alana Walker, Maha Sanad, Katie Springer, Jen Chien, Holly Kernan, and everyone on team KQED. Some members of the KQED podcast team are represented by The Screen Actors Guild, American Federation of Television and Radio Artists. San Francisco Northern California Local.\u003cbr>\nThanks for listening. Have a great week!\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>",
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"content": "\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Night markets have exploded in popularity over the past few years in the Bay Area. Many local downtowns and shopping districts have invested in night markets as a way to regain the foot traffic of the pre-pandemic years. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">In this episode, we go to the Story Road Night Market in San Jose’s Little Saigon neighborhood to eat some delicious food and talk about whether night markets are here to stay.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe loading=\"lazy\" frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm?e=KQINC6287890509&light=true\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>This is a transcript of the episode.\u003c/em>\u003cb>\u003c/b>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>I’m Ericka Cruz Guevarra and welcome to The Bay. Local news to keep you rooted. And today, we’re going to the night market.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham:\u003c/strong> To me it seems like a farmer’s market almost, but at night. Right? And I guess really what a night market is, is a farmer’s market at night.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra :\u003c/strong> Night markets have popped up all around the Bay Area in the last two years. And organizers and local officials are hoping that they can bring more life into some of the neighborhoods hit hardest by the pandemic.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong> Especially in the Bay Area, and especially when you’re talking about some of the Asian American communities. Nothing is going to bring people out like the promise of delicious free food.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>So today we’re taking you to the Story Road Night Market, right in the heart of San Jose’s Little Saigon neighborhood, to see what these night markets are all about.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>Sponsor Message\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>And we are here in San Jose on Story Road. And I’m here with..\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>Luke Tsai food editor for KQED.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>And Thien Pham, a graphic novelist and an educator based in Oakland.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>And we are here at this Story Road Night Market, which is a mostly Vietnamese night market at this strip mall. Thien, can you tell us a little bit more about where we are right now?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>Yeah. So this strip of San Jose has always been kind of like Little Saigon. But they opened this big place called the Grand Century. And it was supposed to be like \u003cem>the\u003c/em> Vietnamese mall, you know, like it had all the Vietnamese food, all the restaurants were here. And then, like a couple of years later, this giant lot next to Grand Century opened up. It was called Vietnam Town, the hub of like, Vietnamese culture in San Jose.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>We’re kind of here to explore, Luke as you wrote about, a growing sort of night market scene in the Bay Area, right?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai : \u003c/strong>Yeah, totally, I think. You know, I grew up going to night markets when I would travel to Taiwan with my family. You know, as a kid eating stinky tofu, eating like giant chicken cutlets the size of my head. And so that was something I grew up with and something that after I moved to the Bay Area, I never really found. But just in the past few years and really like in the past year or two, we’ve seen this kind of explosion in night markets.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>With the pandemic, there were so many neighborhoods that just sort of shut down. A lot of these areas were struggling. And so what a lot of sort of community organizers, community groups, local governments, kind of when they put their heads together, a lot of them looked to the night market as kind of a potentially successful model. And I think especially in the Bay Area and especially when you’re talking about some of the Asian-American communities, nothing is going to bring people out like the promise of delicious street food. And I think that’s that’s mostly why we’re here tonight to check that out.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Yeah. And people are out. People are out.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>We’re going to get, we’re going to try the chicken hand pie and the charcoal grilled ribs.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra:\u003c/strong> Can I get the steamed tofu?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ryan Sebastian: \u003c/strong>Speaking as someone who was born and raised in East San Jose. Like, there is always a feeling that when I would travel to other places and I would say, “Why can’t we have that?”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>My name is Ryan Sebastian and I run Moveable Feast. We started doing food truck events here based out of San Jose. Our whole goal for the whole summer was, or the whole series, was to get 20,000 people. And we saw by backed by cell phone data that the first weekend we had 22,000 people.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>You know, Story Road for many reasons, particularly in the Vietnamese community and the like Mexican-American community is so, so key. To have this in San Jose, to have it in a place that maybe isn’t always like shown in the most positive light, is incredibly important.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>Family style. We’re family style.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Okay. And what do we got here, Thien?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>We got some lobster like fried in a rice coating. Green rice, which is like a gelatinous rice. And then we have here, ee have a hand pie that has a chicken curry in it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>These are the pork ribs that have some sort of, like, herb fish sauce, calamansi, sort of a little dressing, kind of garnish on top.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>All right. Let’s go.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>These ribs are so good.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>So it’s got that little bit of tanginess on top, but the ribs are super, super tender and juicy.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>Oh my god. So good. In my phone, I just have so much of just Luke, like, eating. He’s such a, like, profane eater. It’s, like, disgusting to watch him eat. But I’m also, like, I really also love it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>So what’s, what’s what’s this? This is like a tofu sandwich.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Yeah, it’s like a tofu sandwiches with some pork inside. And then it looks like…\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>Is that like pork floss?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Yeah. Yeah.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>Vietnamese people eat pork floss?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>That’s our thing! We came up with pork floss, bro!\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>Come on! I’m always like, this is a Chinese thing, and Thien is always like, “No, the Vietnamese invented that.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>The Vietnamese invented that for sure! Chinese took that from us.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Mori Nguyen: \u003c/strong>My name is Mori. Last name is Nguyen. I feel like there’s a healthy amount of vendors, so and a lot of like, I don’t know what they’re called but like cool little shops that people have or like small businesses. So I like it so far.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>I ordered grilled squid satay. It’s really good. It’s a little on the saltier side, but I like it because I think it’s, I want to say it’s a Vietnamese style, and I really like Vietnamese style squid.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>And I mean, I think the other thing I really like when you walk past is you have all these sort of like retail vendors that are mixed in also. And I think there are other markets that have that component or like, you know, one day festivals where it’ll be like, okay, we’re going to have food, but we’re also going to have people selling like crafts, or we’re also going to have people selling like clothing or jewelry. You know, where it doesn’t feel like it’s some like, fancy artisan who has like parachuted in from outside of the community to, like, promote their art.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>You know, it feels more like, these are just like people from the community. Maybe they have a shop in this mall, selling like jewelry or selling like little trinkets or gifts. And so they set up a stall outside. And so it just has that very– it just feels very natural, feels very good just to walk around and see everybody checking out all the little stalls while they’re eating their their food. Yeah.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Shanaya: \u003c/strong>I’m Shanaya. I’m the creator of Naya’s Desk. So I sell original art through stickers. And I also hand make all of these at home, sticker sheets. I’ve been a San Jose native all my life, so this is my second time here at the Story Road Night Market. This one is really great because I love the Asian diversity here, and the community here is really good. Really good food and a lot of other cool artists here.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>Snails! I found the snails! Should I go get it? Or do you guys want to come?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>The sea snails, the grilled sea snails.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Oh! That’s what you wanted.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>That’s what we wanted. Yeah. Should we go get the snails?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>You want to go try? Yeah. Yeah. It’s amazing. So right now, we’re going across the parking lot to the next mall, which is called Vietnam Town. There’s only one stall, but they got a lot of attention.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>This is actually insane. Okay. So there is literally a deejay spinning EDM in the background. And in the forefront, with this, just like, YouTube lighting, are these Vietnamese aunties pouring sugarcane juice, selling snails. An uncle is grilling. I am, I’m stunned. I think it’s the lights. It’s the lights and the music, for sure.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Okay, so Thien just ordered. He has a snail in his hand.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong> And then you grab it with a toothpick. Because the snail has, like, a you know, like the shell is, like, circular. So you got to, like, kind of spin it while you open it, and you grab it. And you’ve got to dip it in this sauce. The sauce is it. And then, oh my God, they have this thing called rau răm, which I think the English title is Vietnamese Coriander.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Oh my god. It’s so good you guys. Oh my god. So this really brings me home to my mom because, you know, we didn’t have a lot of money when we came to America. So my mom would go to the market. My mom would just have this huge pot of it and me and my mom would just sit there and just do this and eat there. And it would just be like our bonding. We never really talked, you know, it’s one of those things that is just like, oh man, this is like, my mom, you know, this is like, like my mom. Yeah. Oh my god.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>I’m curious what you all, just your impressions of the night market so far, especially Luke, compared to some of the other ones that you’ve been to around the Bay Area.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>I mean, one of the things I really appreciate about here is just when you’re walking through and you smell the smell of that charcoal, right? And you just know it’s going to be good. And I was reading, I think Soleil Ho for The Chronicle wrote this opinion piece basically saying how it was really awesome that San Francisco has a whole bunch of night markets now, but that at a lot of them the food they said was like kind of mid. And it wasn’t because the food vendors aren’t good, but because the regulations and the fees are such that most vendors can’t afford to pay all the fees to be able to, like grill on the street to actually cook hot food. I mean, that’s one of the hallmarks of a night market is like you have, you have the fire going, you smell that charcoal. So I really appreciate that about here.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Like we’re literally standing–\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>Watching them make it. They’ve got like a little bamboo fan that they’re like fanning it every so often. Like, that’s like old school cooking, right? Old school street food cooking. And I do think, like, with anything else, that it requires some like know how. You know, and it requires some, like, actual outreach and connection to the community.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>I am curious for both of you and I guess starting with you first, Luke, is this the kind of thing you both would want to see more of?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai:\u003c/strong> Yeah, totally. Yeah. I think it just feels so comfortable just strolling through here. The smells, the sights. It’s such a warm kind of community feeling for for folks in San Jose. If you had this every week, you know, or at least you had it like once or twice a month, I feel like people would come out, you know, especially especially in San Jose and a lot of other neighborhoods, too. I think people would come out.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>You seem very at home here, Thien.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>I love it. This type of thing we didn’t have when we were growing up. And so now when I walk around and sometimes when I speak about it, it’s like really moving to me. Because it’s like so many years of growing up and just kind of like hiding your culture or just like experiencing it with your family. And for me, I can go to my American friends or my friends of all cultures, “Hey, let’s go to this this Vietnamese street fair.” And they will be fine with it. And every single one of this food here can be enjoyed by everybody. Like every time me and Luke go anywhere, like in the Bay Area nowadays and we see this huge, diverse crowd, we’re like always moved by it. It’s always so, feels so nice. It feels so nice to like to like have this, you know, like, and I think that’s part of the reason why we live here. Why we pay the prices that we pay to live here, you know.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai:\u003c/strong>100%. Yeah.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Okay. So I don’t know about you all, but I’m full. I’m very full.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>We have, you can’t see, but we have like two giant bags of leftovers.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>Ericka’s just holding the nước mía. I hope, I hope someone at home likes sugar cane juice.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Just double fisting this sugar cane juice. This was so much fun, you guys. Thank you so much for doing this. I really appreciate it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>Thanks so much for having us here. Cheers!\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Special thanks to KQED food editor Luke Tsai and Thien Pham for being our guides of the Story Road Night Market. The Story Road Night Market is done for the year, but there are still a handful of night markets to still check out around the Bay Area. We’re going to leave you a link to Luke’s list of Bay Area night markets in our show notes.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad floatright]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>This episode was cut down and edited by me and senior editor Alan Montecillo. It was produced by Jessica Kariisa. We get extra support from Jen Chien, Katie Sprenger, Maha Sanad and Holly Kernan. Music Courtesy of Audio Network. The Bay is a production of KQED in San Francisco, I’m Ericka Cruz Guevarra, thanks for listening.\u003c/p>\n\n",
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"content": "\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Night markets have exploded in popularity over the past few years in the Bay Area. Many local downtowns and shopping districts have invested in night markets as a way to regain the foot traffic of the pre-pandemic years. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">In this episode, we go to the Story Road Night Market in San Jose’s Little Saigon neighborhood to eat some delicious food and talk about whether night markets are here to stay.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe loading=\"lazy\" frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm?e=KQINC6287890509&light=true\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>This is a transcript of the episode.\u003c/em>\u003cb>\u003c/b>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>I’m Ericka Cruz Guevarra and welcome to The Bay. Local news to keep you rooted. And today, we’re going to the night market.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>",
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"content": "\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham:\u003c/strong> To me it seems like a farmer’s market almost, but at night. Right? And I guess really what a night market is, is a farmer’s market at night.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra :\u003c/strong> Night markets have popped up all around the Bay Area in the last two years. And organizers and local officials are hoping that they can bring more life into some of the neighborhoods hit hardest by the pandemic.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong> Especially in the Bay Area, and especially when you’re talking about some of the Asian American communities. Nothing is going to bring people out like the promise of delicious free food.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>So today we’re taking you to the Story Road Night Market, right in the heart of San Jose’s Little Saigon neighborhood, to see what these night markets are all about.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>Sponsor Message\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>And we are here in San Jose on Story Road. And I’m here with..\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>Luke Tsai food editor for KQED.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>And Thien Pham, a graphic novelist and an educator based in Oakland.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>And we are here at this Story Road Night Market, which is a mostly Vietnamese night market at this strip mall. Thien, can you tell us a little bit more about where we are right now?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>Yeah. So this strip of San Jose has always been kind of like Little Saigon. But they opened this big place called the Grand Century. And it was supposed to be like \u003cem>the\u003c/em> Vietnamese mall, you know, like it had all the Vietnamese food, all the restaurants were here. And then, like a couple of years later, this giant lot next to Grand Century opened up. It was called Vietnam Town, the hub of like, Vietnamese culture in San Jose.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>We’re kind of here to explore, Luke as you wrote about, a growing sort of night market scene in the Bay Area, right?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai : \u003c/strong>Yeah, totally, I think. You know, I grew up going to night markets when I would travel to Taiwan with my family. You know, as a kid eating stinky tofu, eating like giant chicken cutlets the size of my head. And so that was something I grew up with and something that after I moved to the Bay Area, I never really found. But just in the past few years and really like in the past year or two, we’ve seen this kind of explosion in night markets.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>With the pandemic, there were so many neighborhoods that just sort of shut down. A lot of these areas were struggling. And so what a lot of sort of community organizers, community groups, local governments, kind of when they put their heads together, a lot of them looked to the night market as kind of a potentially successful model. And I think especially in the Bay Area and especially when you’re talking about some of the Asian-American communities, nothing is going to bring people out like the promise of delicious street food. And I think that’s that’s mostly why we’re here tonight to check that out.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Yeah. And people are out. People are out.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>We’re going to get, we’re going to try the chicken hand pie and the charcoal grilled ribs.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra:\u003c/strong> Can I get the steamed tofu?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ryan Sebastian: \u003c/strong>Speaking as someone who was born and raised in East San Jose. Like, there is always a feeling that when I would travel to other places and I would say, “Why can’t we have that?”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>My name is Ryan Sebastian and I run Moveable Feast. We started doing food truck events here based out of San Jose. Our whole goal for the whole summer was, or the whole series, was to get 20,000 people. And we saw by backed by cell phone data that the first weekend we had 22,000 people.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>You know, Story Road for many reasons, particularly in the Vietnamese community and the like Mexican-American community is so, so key. To have this in San Jose, to have it in a place that maybe isn’t always like shown in the most positive light, is incredibly important.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>Family style. We’re family style.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Okay. And what do we got here, Thien?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>We got some lobster like fried in a rice coating. Green rice, which is like a gelatinous rice. And then we have here, ee have a hand pie that has a chicken curry in it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>These are the pork ribs that have some sort of, like, herb fish sauce, calamansi, sort of a little dressing, kind of garnish on top.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>All right. Let’s go.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>These ribs are so good.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>So it’s got that little bit of tanginess on top, but the ribs are super, super tender and juicy.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>Oh my god. So good. In my phone, I just have so much of just Luke, like, eating. He’s such a, like, profane eater. It’s, like, disgusting to watch him eat. But I’m also, like, I really also love it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>So what’s, what’s what’s this? This is like a tofu sandwich.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Yeah, it’s like a tofu sandwiches with some pork inside. And then it looks like…\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>Is that like pork floss?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Yeah. Yeah.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>Vietnamese people eat pork floss?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>That’s our thing! We came up with pork floss, bro!\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>Come on! I’m always like, this is a Chinese thing, and Thien is always like, “No, the Vietnamese invented that.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>The Vietnamese invented that for sure! Chinese took that from us.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Mori Nguyen: \u003c/strong>My name is Mori. Last name is Nguyen. I feel like there’s a healthy amount of vendors, so and a lot of like, I don’t know what they’re called but like cool little shops that people have or like small businesses. So I like it so far.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>I ordered grilled squid satay. It’s really good. It’s a little on the saltier side, but I like it because I think it’s, I want to say it’s a Vietnamese style, and I really like Vietnamese style squid.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>And I mean, I think the other thing I really like when you walk past is you have all these sort of like retail vendors that are mixed in also. And I think there are other markets that have that component or like, you know, one day festivals where it’ll be like, okay, we’re going to have food, but we’re also going to have people selling like crafts, or we’re also going to have people selling like clothing or jewelry. You know, where it doesn’t feel like it’s some like, fancy artisan who has like parachuted in from outside of the community to, like, promote their art.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>You know, it feels more like, these are just like people from the community. Maybe they have a shop in this mall, selling like jewelry or selling like little trinkets or gifts. And so they set up a stall outside. And so it just has that very– it just feels very natural, feels very good just to walk around and see everybody checking out all the little stalls while they’re eating their their food. Yeah.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Shanaya: \u003c/strong>I’m Shanaya. I’m the creator of Naya’s Desk. So I sell original art through stickers. And I also hand make all of these at home, sticker sheets. I’ve been a San Jose native all my life, so this is my second time here at the Story Road Night Market. This one is really great because I love the Asian diversity here, and the community here is really good. Really good food and a lot of other cool artists here.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>Snails! I found the snails! Should I go get it? Or do you guys want to come?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>The sea snails, the grilled sea snails.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Oh! That’s what you wanted.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>That’s what we wanted. Yeah. Should we go get the snails?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>You want to go try? Yeah. Yeah. It’s amazing. So right now, we’re going across the parking lot to the next mall, which is called Vietnam Town. There’s only one stall, but they got a lot of attention.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>This is actually insane. Okay. So there is literally a deejay spinning EDM in the background. And in the forefront, with this, just like, YouTube lighting, are these Vietnamese aunties pouring sugarcane juice, selling snails. An uncle is grilling. I am, I’m stunned. I think it’s the lights. It’s the lights and the music, for sure.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Okay, so Thien just ordered. He has a snail in his hand.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong> And then you grab it with a toothpick. Because the snail has, like, a you know, like the shell is, like, circular. So you got to, like, kind of spin it while you open it, and you grab it. And you’ve got to dip it in this sauce. The sauce is it. And then, oh my God, they have this thing called rau răm, which I think the English title is Vietnamese Coriander.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Oh my god. It’s so good you guys. Oh my god. So this really brings me home to my mom because, you know, we didn’t have a lot of money when we came to America. So my mom would go to the market. My mom would just have this huge pot of it and me and my mom would just sit there and just do this and eat there. And it would just be like our bonding. We never really talked, you know, it’s one of those things that is just like, oh man, this is like, my mom, you know, this is like, like my mom. Yeah. Oh my god.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>I’m curious what you all, just your impressions of the night market so far, especially Luke, compared to some of the other ones that you’ve been to around the Bay Area.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>I mean, one of the things I really appreciate about here is just when you’re walking through and you smell the smell of that charcoal, right? And you just know it’s going to be good. And I was reading, I think Soleil Ho for The Chronicle wrote this opinion piece basically saying how it was really awesome that San Francisco has a whole bunch of night markets now, but that at a lot of them the food they said was like kind of mid. And it wasn’t because the food vendors aren’t good, but because the regulations and the fees are such that most vendors can’t afford to pay all the fees to be able to, like grill on the street to actually cook hot food. I mean, that’s one of the hallmarks of a night market is like you have, you have the fire going, you smell that charcoal. So I really appreciate that about here.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Like we’re literally standing–\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>Watching them make it. They’ve got like a little bamboo fan that they’re like fanning it every so often. Like, that’s like old school cooking, right? Old school street food cooking. And I do think, like, with anything else, that it requires some like know how. You know, and it requires some, like, actual outreach and connection to the community.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>I am curious for both of you and I guess starting with you first, Luke, is this the kind of thing you both would want to see more of?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai:\u003c/strong> Yeah, totally. Yeah. I think it just feels so comfortable just strolling through here. The smells, the sights. It’s such a warm kind of community feeling for for folks in San Jose. If you had this every week, you know, or at least you had it like once or twice a month, I feel like people would come out, you know, especially especially in San Jose and a lot of other neighborhoods, too. I think people would come out.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>You seem very at home here, Thien.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>I love it. This type of thing we didn’t have when we were growing up. And so now when I walk around and sometimes when I speak about it, it’s like really moving to me. Because it’s like so many years of growing up and just kind of like hiding your culture or just like experiencing it with your family. And for me, I can go to my American friends or my friends of all cultures, “Hey, let’s go to this this Vietnamese street fair.” And they will be fine with it. And every single one of this food here can be enjoyed by everybody. Like every time me and Luke go anywhere, like in the Bay Area nowadays and we see this huge, diverse crowd, we’re like always moved by it. It’s always so, feels so nice. It feels so nice to like to like have this, you know, like, and I think that’s part of the reason why we live here. Why we pay the prices that we pay to live here, you know.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai:\u003c/strong>100%. Yeah.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Okay. So I don’t know about you all, but I’m full. I’m very full.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>We have, you can’t see, but we have like two giant bags of leftovers.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Thien Pham: \u003c/strong>Ericka’s just holding the nước mía. I hope, I hope someone at home likes sugar cane juice.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Just double fisting this sugar cane juice. This was so much fun, you guys. Thank you so much for doing this. I really appreciate it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Luke Tsai: \u003c/strong>Thanks so much for having us here. Cheers!\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Special thanks to KQED food editor Luke Tsai and Thien Pham for being our guides of the Story Road Night Market. The Story Road Night Market is done for the year, but there are still a handful of night markets to still check out around the Bay Area. We’re going to leave you a link to Luke’s list of Bay Area night markets in our show notes.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>",
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"info": "The MindShift podcast explores the innovations in education that are shaping how kids learn. Hosts Ki Sung and Katrina Schwartz introduce listeners to educators, researchers, parents and students who are developing effective ways to improve how kids learn. We cover topics like how fed-up administrators are developing surprising tactics to deal with classroom disruptions; how listening to podcasts are helping kids develop reading skills; the consequences of overparenting; and why interdisciplinary learning can engage students on all ends of the traditional achievement spectrum. This podcast is part of the MindShift education site, a division of KQED News. KQED is an NPR/PBS member station based in San Francisco. You can also visit the MindShift website for episodes and supplemental blog posts or tweet us \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/MindShiftKQED\">@MindShiftKQED\u003c/a> or visit us at \u003ca href=\"/mindshift\">MindShift.KQED.org\u003c/a>",
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"soldout": {
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