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"content": "\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"#episode-transcript\">\u003ci>View the full episode transcript.\u003c/i>\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Whether melted in a quesadilla or a grilled cheese sandwich, or sliced on a charcuterie board next to one of its stinkier cousins, Monterey Jack is a staple cheese. Its flavor is similar to cheddar, but it contains a bit more moisture. Despite its popularity, there remains some mystery around Monterey Jack’s true origins. Though it may have the name “Monterey,” the town of Pacifica lays claim to the iconic cheese.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[baycuriouspodcastinfo]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The recipe for what we now call Monterey Jack is believed — by some — to have originated in California’s missions in the 1700s. But the soft, mild cheese got its name — at least the “Jack” part — much later from a wealthy Monterey landowner named David Jack. Jack popularized and marketed the cheese. But how he got his hands on the recipe is wrapped up in local pride — and lore.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch3>David Jack and Monterey\u003c/h3>\n\u003cp>David Jack was born in Scotland in 1822 and had emigrated to America by the time he reached adulthood. After a stop on the East Coast, where he acquired a shipment of guns, Jack arrived in California in 1849 in the midst of the Gold Rush. Firearms were a hot commodity in those days, and Jack sold the guns for a huge profit. He took that money and went prospecting, but never found gold.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11916550\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\" style=\"max-width: 590px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"wp-image-11916550 size-full\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/10/2022/06/David_Jack.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"590\" height=\"686\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2022/06/David_Jack.jpg 590w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2022/06/David_Jack-160x186.jpg 160w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 590px) 100vw, 590px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">David Jack \u003ccite>(I.W. Taber/Public domain)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>Jack began calling himself David Jacks at this point, and moved to the small town of Monterey, where he began to acquire land. Kathleen Manning from the Pacifica Historical Society says much of that acquisition was through what she called “shady land deals.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In 1851, at the end of the Mexican-American war, as part of the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo, the land around California was divided up and sold. The pueblo of Monterey, as it was then known, hired an attorney named Dalos Rodeyn to handle some land deals.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But the town had no money to pay him and had to sell land to pay that debt. That attorney teamed up with Jacks to buy the entire town of Monterey and much of the adjacent land at a very low rate. Jacks became the de facto landlord of the region, and began lending money against people’s land, and then foreclosing and taking ownership of even more land in the region.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“He was able to take advantage of a lot of people. He has a very bad reputation,” said Manning.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The town of Monterey tried a few times to buy itself back from Jacks, even sending a case to the U.S. Supreme Court in 1906, but Jacks won.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Besides land, Jacks had another business interest: dairy.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>There were hundreds of dairies making milk and various types of cheese around Monterey at the time, and several were on Jacks’ land. One of those dairies was making a mild, soft, white cheese — sound familiar? Jacks would market and sell that cheese with his name on it, and the official Jack cheese was born.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The original recipe for the cheese Jacks would sell as his own could have come from any number of places — but where?\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>The Pacifica connection\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>According to a 1938 cookbook, “Eating Around San Francisco,” the recipe for what we now know as Jack cheese originated on Mori Point in Pacifica. The author visited Mori Point and wrote:\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>“I was interested to discover that it was Stephano Mori, who first made what we today call Monterey cheese. Having been born and brought up in Italy, Stephano and his wife learned there how to make cheese. They made it on their Mori Point property. The cheese was very good.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“An Italian named Baldocchi was a friend of the family. He learned how to make the cheese and went to Monterey and manufactured it on a commercial scale. As he was on the Jack ranch. The cheese is now known as Jack or Monterey cheese.”\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>If this book is to be believed, Baldocchi took the recipe from the Moris, moved to Monterey and mass-produced it with David Jacks.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[gallery columns=\"2\" ids=\"11916551,11916552,11916562,11916563\"]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp> \u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>Other theories\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>Not everyone is sold on Jack cheese being from Pacifica. In fact, there are a number of claims to the lineage of Monterey Jack. Some point to Domingo Pedrazzi of Carmel Valley, who made a cheese called “jack cheese.” It required pressure to remove moisture, which he accomplished with a “jack press.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>It’s also been argued that a local woman who sold homemade queso del país — like the cheese made at California’s historic missions — could be the person Jacks took the recipe from. What we do know for sure is Jacks didn’t invent the recipe – but he did go on to make that cheese, and himself, very famous.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>Pacifica Jack cheese\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>In Pacifica, the historical society is making the most of their lesser-known connection to this California cheese by producing their own variety. Pacifica Jack Cheese is sold exclusively at the Pacifica Coastside Museum in Pacifica, and Manning says they’ve sold nearly 3 tons so far.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>If you begin to ask where Monterey Jack cheese originated, you’ll get a different answer depending on whom you ask. But Kathleen Manning says, “If you don’t know Pacifica, you don’t know Jack.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[baycuriousquestion]\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2 id=\"episode-transcript\">Episode Transcript\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Let’s take a moment to consider Monterey Jack cheese.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Decent cheese, probably not my first choice for a cheese plate, I’m more of a gouda girl but I’m not going to turn it down if someone offers. It works well in a quesadilla, melted on nachos, in a grilled cheese sandwich.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">You might guess with a name like \u003c/span>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Monterey\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Jack that it hails from the beachside town of Monterey, just south of the Bay Area. But a listener named Kathy wrote to us because she’d heard something else entirely! That Monterey Jack was actually created in Pacifica.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Today on Bay Curious, we’ll investigate this debate to see if we can settle once and for all who made Monterey Jack. This story first aired on the podcast in 2022. I’m Olivia Allen-Price.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[SPONSOR MESSAGE]\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Reporter Christopher Beale takes us on a journey today – to find the true origins of Monterey Jack.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Here in San Francisco when you have a question about cheese, you might stop by a place like the Rainbow Grocery Co-Op and talk to a cheesemonger.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Gordon “Zola” Edgar:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Basically it’s an old fashioned word for someone who buys and sells cheese. I’m in the business of cheese. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">That’s Gordon “Zola” Edgar and he’s been working with and around cheese for almost 3 decades, and took me for a tour of his cheese department at the co-op.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Gordon “Zola” Edgar: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">This is where our basic cheeses are, so like Jacks, Cheddars, organic Jacks and Cheddars. You know, domestic swiss, grated cheeses and stuff like that.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Okay. So in the grand scheme of cheeses, where do you place Monterey Jack? Like, what is Monterey Jack cheese for?\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Gordon “Zola” Edgar: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Monterey Jack, it kind of lives on this like, parallel life to mild cheddar. They’re both your basic, like, pantry cheeses. Monterey Jack, you could say is basically a cheddar with a little more moisture.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> The flavor of a Jack cheese is really mild, the texture is soft, it cuts and melts easily. It’s not a sexy cheese but it’s been made in one form or another in our region for hundreds of years, as far back as the late 1700s. Spanish missions, which were located all over what is now California, made a simple white cheese. There is a likelihood that the cheese from those missions, then known as Queso del Pais, evolved into the cheese we know as Monterey Jack. But that may not be the story at all. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Gordon “Zola” Edgar:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Some people say that it got its name from the Jack press that was used to make the cheese, others say it was named after David Jacks who, kind of, well, that’s a long story, but who, let’s just say, popularized the cheese.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> David Jack, he was quite a scoundrel. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">That’s Kathleen Manning, she is the former president of the Pacifica Historical Society. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">He was like an early capitalist, right?\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I would say so. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">David Jack was this Scottish guy who came to California during the gold rush in the mid 1800s. He sold some firearms for a huge profit in his first days in California and went to the mountains searching for gold…which he did not find. So, Jack–who around this time took to calling himself David \u003c/span>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Jacks\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">– returned to the Bay Area and made his way to Monterey in 1850. This is where his reputation as sort of a jerk begins.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">At the end of the Mexican-American war Jacks was involved in a scheme that ultimately allowed him to buy the entire town of Monterey, and much of the adjacent land at a steep discount.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">a lot of shady land deals\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">And once he owned everything in and around Monterey, he started loaning money to people, and when they couldn’t pay he would foreclose and, well, you can imagine he didn’t make a lot of friends this way. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">He was able to take advantage of a lot of people. He has a very bad reputation.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">The town even tried a few times to, basically, buy itself back from Jacks even sending a case to the U.S. Supreme Court. But Jacks ultimately won.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Aside from land, Jacks had another business interest – dairy. There were hundreds of dairies making milk and various types of cheese around Monterey at the time, many were on Jack’s land and one of those dairies was making this mild, soft, white cheese. Jacks would market and sell that cheese with his name on it, and the official Jack cheese was born. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> The original recipe for the cheese Jacks would claim and sell as his own could have come from any number of places…Jacks certainly didn’t invent it, but where did it come from?\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Gordon “Zola” Edgar: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">It’s really hard to know. There is a claim that it originated in Pacifica.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> So — I asked Kathleen Manning.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Was Monterey Jack cheese actually created in Pacifica?\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Yes it was.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">If you have ever been to Rockaway Beach in Pacifica, there is a huge point that juts out into the Pacific Ocean on the north end of the beach and it is there — on Mori’s point — where, some believe, the recipe for what would became known as Monterey Jack entered the United States.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Stephano Mori brought a recipe from Italy, and they certainly produced it here. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">There used to be this restaurant up on that hill called Mori’s Place and one of the things they sold was cheese. Kathleen and the folks at the Pacifica Historical Society have an old cookbook called “Eating Around San Francisco.” They say a passage in that book supports their claim …\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">What year is this book from? \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">1938 \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Oh, and then right down here, bold at the top of the chapter it says, Ray Mori’s place near Rockaway Beach. Would you mind reading that to me? If you can. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I was interested to discover that it was Stephano Mori, who first made what we today called Monterey cheese. Having been born and brought up in Italy, Stephano and his wife learned there how to make cheese. They made it on their Mori point property.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> So the Mori had this family friend named Baldocci. He worked with them at Mori’s point and he learned how to make their cheese recipe.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">The cheese was very good. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Baldocchi, and the Mori’s had a falling out and this is where the link to Monterey happens. Kathleen reads on…\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">He learned how to make the cheese and went to Monterey and manufactured it on a commercial scale. As he was on the Jack ranch. The cheese is now known as Jack or Monterey cheese.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">There, in black and white is Pacifica’s claim to Jack Cheese. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Now, not everyone is sold on this theory that the recipe came from Pacifica. It’s been argued that a local woman who sold homemade Queso del Pais door-to-door could be who Jacks took the recipe from. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">And some think the cheese isn’t named after David Jacks at all! Another cheesemaker in the area used a \u003c/span>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Jack press \u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">to make his cheese – that’s a device used to squeeze moisture out. And it’s believed he sold his cheese under the name “Jack Cheese” for that reason. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Ultimately it’s hard to determine the cold hard facts about this soft mild cheese. What we know for sure is that David Jacks would go on to distribute and market the cheese as Jack’s cheese, and eventually people began asking for “Monterey” Jack’s Cheese across the state, and eventually the country and the world. And that cheese would help make Jacks a wealthy man.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Pacifica, however, isn’t taking the alleged theft lying down.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">The historical society felt it was our duty to reclaim the, uh, wonderful heritage that we have. And so. We began producing the cheese here and selling it locally, just on a small basis. and people loved it. That’s a wonderful, wonderful cheese this is made with, by a fine cheese maker.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Kathleen says that the Pacifica Historical Society has sold about 3 tons of their “Pacifica Jack Cheese” and gave me some to take home. I’ll put a link in the web post of this story for where you can buy your own, but Kathleen says:\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">The best way is to come to the museum when it’s open and we’re open Tuesdays, Thursdays, and Saturdays, one to four, and the cheese is always available.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">We may never know with certainty where Monterey Jack Cheese actually originated. It’s hard to get a thief like David Jacks to give up that sort of information, but it did ultimately become a staple food our region is famous for. But according to the folks in Pacifica, there’s always been a chapter missing in the story of this California original Jack Cheese.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">If you don’t know Pacifica, you don’t know Jack. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">That story was by Christopher Beale, who joins me in the studio now. Hey Chris!\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Hello! I also brought the Pacifica Jack Cheese with me that I was given. It’s a hefty brick of cheese.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I’m so glad you did because it felt remiss to do this story and not actually eat any cheese so let’s cut into it. Nice packaging. Lets give this baby a cut. Oh that cuts just like butter!\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Lets try it.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Take a bite, friend.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I’m not gonna lie, that’s actually really good.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Oh yeah, it’s actually way sharper than I remember Monterey Jack Cheese being. I mean, it tastes like a cheddar to me.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">It’s not a basic pantry cheese to me, that’s delicious!\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Woah bold words! I can’t remember the last time I would’ve had Monterey Jack Cheese by itself or even on a cracker. I mean, I generally would have it, you know, in a sandwich, or melted on something. It’s not like a cheese I reach for but, uh, I’m enjoying this.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Now, we kinda had to end this story on a bit of an uncertain note. Do you as a reporter feel at all disappointed that there wasn’t a very sharp answer to this one?\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I’m not disappointed because I think that regardless of which path this cheese took into the United States and then across California, it is now an absolutely, unequivocally local product. It’s a thing Northern Californians can be proud of. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">And I should say, especially when it comes to food stories–we’ve done stories for Bay Curious about sourdough, \u003c/span>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">cioppino\u003c/span>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">, the martini, Irish coffee, rocky road ice cream–and in almost all of these stories there’s some bit of lore that we just can’t quite nail down. So a lot of these stories end kind of on a shrug, we did our best!\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">And food is this kind of cultural exchange where one culture may provide one thing, be it an ingredient, and another may provide a manufacturing process. And before you know it those things have happened here, away from the home of that recipe and a whole new recipe has come to light under a whole different name it becomes something like Monterey Jack Cheese, a California original. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Yeah, I think from now on when I have Monterey Jack it’s going to bring up this story in my head and what a lovely thing, that food is a story.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I did bring some pretzel crisps that I keep at my desk. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[pretzel crunch]\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Question for you, do you have wine at your desk?\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[Olivia laughs]\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Christopher Beale, thank you so much for your reporting on this topic.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Thanks for the pretzels.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">And also thanks to Jean Bartlett for all of her help with this story.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">This episode of Bay Curious was made by Katrina Schwartz, Brendan Willard, Sebastian-Mino Bucheli and me, Olivia Allen-Price. Our team today includes Amanda Font, Christopher Beale and Ana De Almeida Amaral. Additional support from Katie Sprenger, Jen Chien, Maha Sanad, Holly Kernan and the whole KQED Family. We’re a production of member-supported KQED in San Francisco. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp> \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Ok, I’m going to resist making a cheesy joke here … and just say farewell.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp> \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">It’s a little melty even, where have you been keeping this?\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp> \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">In my desk drawer.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp> \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Mmm, tasty. Desk cheese.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp> \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad floatright]\u003c/p>\n",
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"title": "Move Over Monterey? Pacifica Lays Claim to Iconic Jack Cheese | KQED",
"description": "View the full episode transcript. Whether melted in a quesadilla or a grilled cheese sandwich, or sliced on a charcuterie board next to one of its stinkier cousins, Monterey Jack is a staple cheese. Its flavor is similar to cheddar, but it contains a bit more moisture. Despite its popularity, there remains some mystery around Monterey Jack’s true origins. Though it may have the name “Monterey,” the town of Pacifica lays claim to the iconic cheese. The recipe for what we now call Monterey Jack is believed — by some — to have originated in California’s missions in the 1700s.",
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"headline": "Move Over Monterey? Pacifica Lays Claim to Iconic Jack Cheese",
"datePublished": "2022-06-09T03:00:34-07:00",
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"content": "\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"#episode-transcript\">\u003ci>View the full episode transcript.\u003c/i>\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Whether melted in a quesadilla or a grilled cheese sandwich, or sliced on a charcuterie board next to one of its stinkier cousins, Monterey Jack is a staple cheese. Its flavor is similar to cheddar, but it contains a bit more moisture. Despite its popularity, there remains some mystery around Monterey Jack’s true origins. Though it may have the name “Monterey,” the town of Pacifica lays claim to the iconic cheese.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003cp>\u003caside class=\"alignleft utils-parseShortcode-shortcodes-__bayCuriousPodcastShortcode__bayCurious\">\u003cimg src=https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/02/bayCuriousLogo.png alt=\"Bay Curious Podcast\" loading=\"lazy\" />\n \u003ca href=\"/news/series/baycurious\">Bay Curious\u003c/a> is a podcast that answers your questions about the Bay Area.\n Subscribe on \u003ca href=\"https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/bay-curious/id1172473406\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Apple Podcasts\u003c/a>,\n \u003ca href=\"http://www.npr.org/podcasts/500557090/bay-curious\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">NPR One\u003c/a> or your favorite podcast platform.\u003c/aside>\u003c/p>\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The recipe for what we now call Monterey Jack is believed — by some — to have originated in California’s missions in the 1700s. But the soft, mild cheese got its name — at least the “Jack” part — much later from a wealthy Monterey landowner named David Jack. Jack popularized and marketed the cheese. But how he got his hands on the recipe is wrapped up in local pride — and lore.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch3>David Jack and Monterey\u003c/h3>\n\u003cp>David Jack was born in Scotland in 1822 and had emigrated to America by the time he reached adulthood. After a stop on the East Coast, where he acquired a shipment of guns, Jack arrived in California in 1849 in the midst of the Gold Rush. Firearms were a hot commodity in those days, and Jack sold the guns for a huge profit. He took that money and went prospecting, but never found gold.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11916550\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\" style=\"max-width: 590px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"wp-image-11916550 size-full\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/10/2022/06/David_Jack.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"590\" height=\"686\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2022/06/David_Jack.jpg 590w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2022/06/David_Jack-160x186.jpg 160w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 590px) 100vw, 590px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">David Jack \u003ccite>(I.W. Taber/Public domain)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>Jack began calling himself David Jacks at this point, and moved to the small town of Monterey, where he began to acquire land. Kathleen Manning from the Pacifica Historical Society says much of that acquisition was through what she called “shady land deals.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In 1851, at the end of the Mexican-American war, as part of the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo, the land around California was divided up and sold. The pueblo of Monterey, as it was then known, hired an attorney named Dalos Rodeyn to handle some land deals.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But the town had no money to pay him and had to sell land to pay that debt. That attorney teamed up with Jacks to buy the entire town of Monterey and much of the adjacent land at a very low rate. Jacks became the de facto landlord of the region, and began lending money against people’s land, and then foreclosing and taking ownership of even more land in the region.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“He was able to take advantage of a lot of people. He has a very bad reputation,” said Manning.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The town of Monterey tried a few times to buy itself back from Jacks, even sending a case to the U.S. Supreme Court in 1906, but Jacks won.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>",
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"content": "\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Besides land, Jacks had another business interest: dairy.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>There were hundreds of dairies making milk and various types of cheese around Monterey at the time, and several were on Jacks’ land. One of those dairies was making a mild, soft, white cheese — sound familiar? Jacks would market and sell that cheese with his name on it, and the official Jack cheese was born.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The original recipe for the cheese Jacks would sell as his own could have come from any number of places — but where?\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>The Pacifica connection\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>According to a 1938 cookbook, “Eating Around San Francisco,” the recipe for what we now know as Jack cheese originated on Mori Point in Pacifica. The author visited Mori Point and wrote:\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>“I was interested to discover that it was Stephano Mori, who first made what we today call Monterey cheese. Having been born and brought up in Italy, Stephano and his wife learned there how to make cheese. They made it on their Mori Point property. The cheese was very good.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“An Italian named Baldocchi was a friend of the family. He learned how to make the cheese and went to Monterey and manufactured it on a commercial scale. As he was on the Jack ranch. The cheese is now known as Jack or Monterey cheese.”\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>If this book is to be believed, Baldocchi took the recipe from the Moris, moved to Monterey and mass-produced it with David Jacks.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>",
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"content": "\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp> \u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>Other theories\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>Not everyone is sold on Jack cheese being from Pacifica. In fact, there are a number of claims to the lineage of Monterey Jack. Some point to Domingo Pedrazzi of Carmel Valley, who made a cheese called “jack cheese.” It required pressure to remove moisture, which he accomplished with a “jack press.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>It’s also been argued that a local woman who sold homemade queso del país — like the cheese made at California’s historic missions — could be the person Jacks took the recipe from. What we do know for sure is Jacks didn’t invent the recipe – but he did go on to make that cheese, and himself, very famous.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>Pacifica Jack cheese\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>In Pacifica, the historical society is making the most of their lesser-known connection to this California cheese by producing their own variety. Pacifica Jack Cheese is sold exclusively at the Pacifica Coastside Museum in Pacifica, and Manning says they’ve sold nearly 3 tons so far.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>If you begin to ask where Monterey Jack cheese originated, you’ll get a different answer depending on whom you ask. But Kathleen Manning says, “If you don’t know Pacifica, you don’t know Jack.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>",
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"content": "\u003cdiv class=\"post-content post-body\">\u003ch2 id=\"episode-transcript\">Episode Transcript\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Let’s take a moment to consider Monterey Jack cheese.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Decent cheese, probably not my first choice for a cheese plate, I’m more of a gouda girl but I’m not going to turn it down if someone offers. It works well in a quesadilla, melted on nachos, in a grilled cheese sandwich.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">You might guess with a name like \u003c/span>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Monterey\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Jack that it hails from the beachside town of Monterey, just south of the Bay Area. But a listener named Kathy wrote to us because she’d heard something else entirely! That Monterey Jack was actually created in Pacifica.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Today on Bay Curious, we’ll investigate this debate to see if we can settle once and for all who made Monterey Jack. This story first aired on the podcast in 2022. I’m Olivia Allen-Price.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[SPONSOR MESSAGE]\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Reporter Christopher Beale takes us on a journey today – to find the true origins of Monterey Jack.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Here in San Francisco when you have a question about cheese, you might stop by a place like the Rainbow Grocery Co-Op and talk to a cheesemonger.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Gordon “Zola” Edgar:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Basically it’s an old fashioned word for someone who buys and sells cheese. I’m in the business of cheese. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">That’s Gordon “Zola” Edgar and he’s been working with and around cheese for almost 3 decades, and took me for a tour of his cheese department at the co-op.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Gordon “Zola” Edgar: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">This is where our basic cheeses are, so like Jacks, Cheddars, organic Jacks and Cheddars. You know, domestic swiss, grated cheeses and stuff like that.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Okay. So in the grand scheme of cheeses, where do you place Monterey Jack? Like, what is Monterey Jack cheese for?\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Gordon “Zola” Edgar: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Monterey Jack, it kind of lives on this like, parallel life to mild cheddar. They’re both your basic, like, pantry cheeses. Monterey Jack, you could say is basically a cheddar with a little more moisture.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> The flavor of a Jack cheese is really mild, the texture is soft, it cuts and melts easily. It’s not a sexy cheese but it’s been made in one form or another in our region for hundreds of years, as far back as the late 1700s. Spanish missions, which were located all over what is now California, made a simple white cheese. There is a likelihood that the cheese from those missions, then known as Queso del Pais, evolved into the cheese we know as Monterey Jack. But that may not be the story at all. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Gordon “Zola” Edgar:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Some people say that it got its name from the Jack press that was used to make the cheese, others say it was named after David Jacks who, kind of, well, that’s a long story, but who, let’s just say, popularized the cheese.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> David Jack, he was quite a scoundrel. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">That’s Kathleen Manning, she is the former president of the Pacifica Historical Society. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">He was like an early capitalist, right?\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I would say so. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">David Jack was this Scottish guy who came to California during the gold rush in the mid 1800s. He sold some firearms for a huge profit in his first days in California and went to the mountains searching for gold…which he did not find. So, Jack–who around this time took to calling himself David \u003c/span>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Jacks\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">– returned to the Bay Area and made his way to Monterey in 1850. This is where his reputation as sort of a jerk begins.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">At the end of the Mexican-American war Jacks was involved in a scheme that ultimately allowed him to buy the entire town of Monterey, and much of the adjacent land at a steep discount.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">a lot of shady land deals\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">And once he owned everything in and around Monterey, he started loaning money to people, and when they couldn’t pay he would foreclose and, well, you can imagine he didn’t make a lot of friends this way. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">He was able to take advantage of a lot of people. He has a very bad reputation.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">The town even tried a few times to, basically, buy itself back from Jacks even sending a case to the U.S. Supreme Court. But Jacks ultimately won.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Aside from land, Jacks had another business interest – dairy. There were hundreds of dairies making milk and various types of cheese around Monterey at the time, many were on Jack’s land and one of those dairies was making this mild, soft, white cheese. Jacks would market and sell that cheese with his name on it, and the official Jack cheese was born. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> The original recipe for the cheese Jacks would claim and sell as his own could have come from any number of places…Jacks certainly didn’t invent it, but where did it come from?\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Gordon “Zola” Edgar: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">It’s really hard to know. There is a claim that it originated in Pacifica.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> So — I asked Kathleen Manning.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Was Monterey Jack cheese actually created in Pacifica?\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Yes it was.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">If you have ever been to Rockaway Beach in Pacifica, there is a huge point that juts out into the Pacific Ocean on the north end of the beach and it is there — on Mori’s point — where, some believe, the recipe for what would became known as Monterey Jack entered the United States.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Stephano Mori brought a recipe from Italy, and they certainly produced it here. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">There used to be this restaurant up on that hill called Mori’s Place and one of the things they sold was cheese. Kathleen and the folks at the Pacifica Historical Society have an old cookbook called “Eating Around San Francisco.” They say a passage in that book supports their claim …\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">What year is this book from? \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">1938 \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Oh, and then right down here, bold at the top of the chapter it says, Ray Mori’s place near Rockaway Beach. Would you mind reading that to me? If you can. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I was interested to discover that it was Stephano Mori, who first made what we today called Monterey cheese. Having been born and brought up in Italy, Stephano and his wife learned there how to make cheese. They made it on their Mori point property.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale:\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> So the Mori had this family friend named Baldocci. He worked with them at Mori’s point and he learned how to make their cheese recipe.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">The cheese was very good. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Baldocchi, and the Mori’s had a falling out and this is where the link to Monterey happens. Kathleen reads on…\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">He learned how to make the cheese and went to Monterey and manufactured it on a commercial scale. As he was on the Jack ranch. The cheese is now known as Jack or Monterey cheese.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">There, in black and white is Pacifica’s claim to Jack Cheese. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Now, not everyone is sold on this theory that the recipe came from Pacifica. It’s been argued that a local woman who sold homemade Queso del Pais door-to-door could be who Jacks took the recipe from. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">And some think the cheese isn’t named after David Jacks at all! Another cheesemaker in the area used a \u003c/span>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Jack press \u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">to make his cheese – that’s a device used to squeeze moisture out. And it’s believed he sold his cheese under the name “Jack Cheese” for that reason. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Ultimately it’s hard to determine the cold hard facts about this soft mild cheese. What we know for sure is that David Jacks would go on to distribute and market the cheese as Jack’s cheese, and eventually people began asking for “Monterey” Jack’s Cheese across the state, and eventually the country and the world. And that cheese would help make Jacks a wealthy man.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Pacifica, however, isn’t taking the alleged theft lying down.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">The historical society felt it was our duty to reclaim the, uh, wonderful heritage that we have. And so. We began producing the cheese here and selling it locally, just on a small basis. and people loved it. That’s a wonderful, wonderful cheese this is made with, by a fine cheese maker.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Kathleen says that the Pacifica Historical Society has sold about 3 tons of their “Pacifica Jack Cheese” and gave me some to take home. I’ll put a link in the web post of this story for where you can buy your own, but Kathleen says:\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">The best way is to come to the museum when it’s open and we’re open Tuesdays, Thursdays, and Saturdays, one to four, and the cheese is always available.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">We may never know with certainty where Monterey Jack Cheese actually originated. It’s hard to get a thief like David Jacks to give up that sort of information, but it did ultimately become a staple food our region is famous for. But according to the folks in Pacifica, there’s always been a chapter missing in the story of this California original Jack Cheese.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Kathleen Manning: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">If you don’t know Pacifica, you don’t know Jack. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">That story was by Christopher Beale, who joins me in the studio now. Hey Chris!\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Hello! I also brought the Pacifica Jack Cheese with me that I was given. It’s a hefty brick of cheese.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I’m so glad you did because it felt remiss to do this story and not actually eat any cheese so let’s cut into it. Nice packaging. Lets give this baby a cut. Oh that cuts just like butter!\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Lets try it.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Take a bite, friend.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I’m not gonna lie, that’s actually really good.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Oh yeah, it’s actually way sharper than I remember Monterey Jack Cheese being. I mean, it tastes like a cheddar to me.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">It’s not a basic pantry cheese to me, that’s delicious!\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Woah bold words! I can’t remember the last time I would’ve had Monterey Jack Cheese by itself or even on a cracker. I mean, I generally would have it, you know, in a sandwich, or melted on something. It’s not like a cheese I reach for but, uh, I’m enjoying this.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Now, we kinda had to end this story on a bit of an uncertain note. Do you as a reporter feel at all disappointed that there wasn’t a very sharp answer to this one?\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I’m not disappointed because I think that regardless of which path this cheese took into the United States and then across California, it is now an absolutely, unequivocally local product. It’s a thing Northern Californians can be proud of. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">And I should say, especially when it comes to food stories–we’ve done stories for Bay Curious about sourdough, \u003c/span>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">cioppino\u003c/span>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">, the martini, Irish coffee, rocky road ice cream–and in almost all of these stories there’s some bit of lore that we just can’t quite nail down. So a lot of these stories end kind of on a shrug, we did our best!\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">And food is this kind of cultural exchange where one culture may provide one thing, be it an ingredient, and another may provide a manufacturing process. And before you know it those things have happened here, away from the home of that recipe and a whole new recipe has come to light under a whole different name it becomes something like Monterey Jack Cheese, a California original. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Yeah, I think from now on when I have Monterey Jack it’s going to bring up this story in my head and what a lovely thing, that food is a story.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I did bring some pretzel crisps that I keep at my desk. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[pretzel crunch]\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Question for you, do you have wine at your desk?\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[Olivia laughs]\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Christopher Beale, thank you so much for your reporting on this topic.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Thanks for the pretzels.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">And also thanks to Jean Bartlett for all of her help with this story.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">This episode of Bay Curious was made by Katrina Schwartz, Brendan Willard, Sebastian-Mino Bucheli and me, Olivia Allen-Price. Our team today includes Amanda Font, Christopher Beale and Ana De Almeida Amaral. Additional support from Katie Sprenger, Jen Chien, Maha Sanad, Holly Kernan and the whole KQED Family. We’re a production of member-supported KQED in San Francisco. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp> \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Ok, I’m going to resist making a cheesy joke here … and just say farewell.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp> \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">It’s a little melty even, where have you been keeping this?\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp> \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Christopher Beale: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">In my desk drawer.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp> \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Olivia Allen-Price: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Mmm, tasty. Desk cheese.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp> \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003c/div>"
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"title": "We Need to Talk About Wage Theft",
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"content": "\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">In California, tens of thousands of workers aren’t getting paid what they’re owed by their employers. Many of these workers are low-wage earning immigrants in industries like construction, home care, and food service.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">The state actually has a system in place where people can file claims of wage theft. But the system currently has a huge backlog, leaving people waiting years before they can try and and recover their money. In some cases, workers claim their employers stole tens or even hundreds of thousands of dollars from them. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">The result? Many low-wage Californians miss out on rent, food, and can even lose their homes.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Guest\u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">: \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/FaridaJhabvala\">Farida Jhabvala Romero\u003c/a>, KQED labor correspondent\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cdiv class=\"card card--enclosed grey\">\n\u003cp id=\"embed-code\" class=\"inconsolata\">\n\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe loading=\"lazy\" frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm?e=KQINC2436357748&light=true\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\n\u003c/p>\n\u003c/div>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Related links:\u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11913643/most-fast-food-workers-are-victims-of-wage-theft-survey-finds\">\u003cb>Most Fast-Food Workers Are Victims of Wage Theft, Survey Find\u003c/b>\u003c/a>\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11913910/despite-record-budget-surplus-california-unlikely-to-fix-massive-wage-theft-claim-delays-anytime-soon\">\u003cb>Despite Record Budget Surplus, California Unlikely to Fix Massive Wage-Theft Claim Backlog Anytime Soon\u003c/b>\u003c/a>\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n",
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"content": "\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Just because COVID sick pay exists doesn’t necessarily mean employees always feel comfortable using it. Between Americans’ unhealthy relationship with work and a sense that the world is opening back up again, employers have a lot to gain from the lack of widespread knowledge of COVID sick pay benefits in California.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">But if you work in California and get infected with COVID, you may be able to claim up to 80 hours of paid leave. And now that the Bay Area is in another COVID surge because of the omicron BA.2 variant, learning your rights about sick pay is more important than ever. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Guest: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/TeacupInTheBay\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Carly Severn\u003c/a>, senior engagement editor for KQED\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Links: \u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli style=\"list-style-type: none;\">\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11904834/covid-sick-pay-in-california-how-to-claim-this-new-paid-leave\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">COVID Sick Pay in California: How to Claim This New Paid Leave\u003c/a>\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"http://kqed.org/covidguides\">All of KQED’s COVID resources and explainers\u003c/a>\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\u003cp>\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe loading=\"lazy\" frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm?e=KQINC4163900269\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n",
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"content": "\u003cp dir=\"ltr\">The threat of domestic extremist violence is all over the country. Just last weekend, an 18-year old white man drove to a predominantly Black part of Buffalo, New York, and shot 13 people at a grocery store. 10 have died.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp dir=\"ltr\">The Bay Area is not immune to this threat of violence. Last year, two men who worked at an auto shop in Napa were arrested and accused of plotting to blow up the California Democratic Party headquarters in Sacramento.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp dir=\"ltr\">\u003cstrong>Guests\u003c/strong>: \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/SmallRadio2\">Julie Small\u003c/a> and \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/chalexhall\">Alex Hall\u003c/a>, KQED reporters\u003c/p>\n\u003cdiv class=\"card card--enclosed grey\">\n\u003cp id=\"embed-code\" class=\"inconsolata\">\n\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe loading=\"lazy\" frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm?e=KQINC9059618547&light=true\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\n\u003c/p>\n\u003c/div>\n\u003cp dir=\"ltr\">\u003cstrong>Links: \u003c/strong>\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>\n\u003cp dir=\"ltr\" role=\"presentation\">\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11913965/plot-to-blow-up-democratic-headquarters-exposed-california-extremists-hiding-in-plain-sight\">Plot to Blow Up Democratic Headquarters Exposed California Extremists Hiding in Plain Sight\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003c/li>\n\u003cli>\n\u003cp dir=\"ltr\" role=\"presentation\">\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11854275/the-california-republicans-who-helped-enable-wednesdays-attack-on-the-capitol\">The California Republicans Who Helped Enable the January 6 Attack\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n",
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"info": "What kind of no sabo word is Hyphenación? For us, it’s about living within a hyphenation. Like being a third-gen Mexican-American from the Texas border now living that Bay Area Chicano life. Like Xorje! Each week we bring together a couple of hyphenated Latinos to talk all about personal life choices: family, careers, relationships, belonging … everything is on the table. ",
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"info": "The Political Mind of Jerry Brown brings listeners the wisdom of the former Governor, Mayor, and presidential candidate. Scott Shafer interviewed Brown for more than 40 hours, covering the former governor's life and half-century in the political game – and Brown has some lessons he'd like to share. ",
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"marketplace": {
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"info": "Our flagship program, helmed by Kai Ryssdal, examines what the day in money delivered, through stories, conversations, newsworthy numbers and more. Updated Monday through Friday at about 3:30 p.m. PT.",
"airtime": "MON-FRI 4pm-4:30pm, MON-WED 6:30pm-7pm",
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"masters-of-scale": {
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},
"mindshift": {
"id": "mindshift",
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"info": "The MindShift podcast explores the innovations in education that are shaping how kids learn. Hosts Ki Sung and Katrina Schwartz introduce listeners to educators, researchers, parents and students who are developing effective ways to improve how kids learn. We cover topics like how fed-up administrators are developing surprising tactics to deal with classroom disruptions; how listening to podcasts are helping kids develop reading skills; the consequences of overparenting; and why interdisciplinary learning can engage students on all ends of the traditional achievement spectrum. This podcast is part of the MindShift education site, a division of KQED News. KQED is an NPR/PBS member station based in San Francisco. You can also visit the MindShift website for episodes and supplemental blog posts or tweet us \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/MindShiftKQED\">@MindShiftKQED\u003c/a> or visit us at \u003ca href=\"/mindshift\">MindShift.KQED.org\u003c/a>",
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"order": 12
},
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"google": "https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5tZWdhcGhvbmUuZm0vS1FJTkM1NzY0NjAwNDI5",
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"morning-edition": {
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"info": "\u003cem>Morning Edition\u003c/em> takes listeners around the country and the world with multi-faceted stories and commentaries every weekday. Hosts Steve Inskeep, David Greene and Rachel Martin bring you the latest breaking news and features to prepare you for the day.",
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"onourwatch": {
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"title": "On Our Watch",
"tagline": "Deeply-reported investigative journalism",
"info": "For decades, the process for how police police themselves has been inconsistent – if not opaque. In some states, like California, these proceedings were completely hidden. After a new police transparency law unsealed scores of internal affairs files, our reporters set out to examine these cases and the shadow world of police discipline. On Our Watch brings listeners into the rooms where officers are questioned and witnesses are interrogated to find out who this system is really protecting. Is it the officers, or the public they've sworn to serve?",
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"order": 11
},
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"on-the-media": {
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"title": "On The Media",
"info": "Our weekly podcast explores how the media 'sausage' is made, casts an incisive eye on fluctuations in the marketplace of ideas, and examines threats to the freedom of information and expression in America and abroad. For one hour a week, the show tries to lift the veil from the process of \"making media,\" especially news media, because it's through that lens that we see the world and the world sees us",
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},
"link": "/radio/program/on-the-media",
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},
"pbs-newshour": {
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"tuneIn": "https://tunein.com/radio/PBS-NewsHour---Full-Show-p425698/",
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},
"perspectives": {
"id": "perspectives",
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"order": 14
},
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"planet-money": {
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"info": "The economy explained. Imagine you could call up a friend and say, Meet me at the bar and tell me what's going on with the economy. Now imagine that's actually a fun evening.",
"airtime": "SUN 3pm-4pm",
"imageSrc": "https://ww2.kqed.org/radio/wp-content/uploads/sites/50/2018/04/planetmoney.jpg",
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},
"link": "/radio/program/planet-money",
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"apple": "https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/planet-money/id290783428?mt=2",
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},
"politicalbreakdown": {
"id": "politicalbreakdown",
"title": "Political Breakdown",
"tagline": "Politics from a personal perspective",
"info": "Political Breakdown is a new series that explores the political intersection of California and the nation. Each week hosts Scott Shafer and Marisa Lagos are joined with a new special guest to unpack politics -- with personality — and offer an insider’s glimpse at how politics happens.",
"airtime": "THU 6:30pm-7pm",
"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Political-Breakdown-2024-Podcast-Tile-703x703-1.jpg",
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"order": 5
},
"link": "/podcasts/politicalbreakdown",
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"amazon": "https://music.amazon.com/podcasts/e0c2d153-ad36-4c8d-901d-f1da6a724824/political-breakdown",
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"possible": {
"id": "possible",
"title": "Possible",
"info": "Possible is hosted by entrepreneur Reid Hoffman and writer Aria Finger. Together in Possible, Hoffman and Finger lead enlightening discussions about building a brighter collective future. The show features interviews with visionary guests like Trevor Noah, Sam Altman and Janette Sadik-Khan. Possible paints an optimistic portrait of the world we can create through science, policy, business, art and our shared humanity. It asks: What if everything goes right for once? How can we get there? Each episode also includes a short fiction story generated by advanced AI GPT-4, serving as a thought-provoking springboard to speculate how humanity could leverage technology for good.",
"airtime": "SUN 2pm",
"imageSrc": "https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Possible-Podcast-Tile-360x360-1.jpg",
"officialWebsiteLink": "https://www.possible.fm/",
"meta": {
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"source": "Possible"
},
"link": "/radio/program/possible",
"subscribe": {
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"spotify": "https://open.spotify.com/show/730YpdUSNlMyPQwNnyjp4k"
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},
"pri-the-world": {
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