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Speaking Freely: An Evening With Remarkable Women
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Brenda Knight

Brenda Knight

Describe the women who have most influenced your life and the formation of your character.

I would say that it was my mother and her sisters, my aunts. Particularly Aunt Ruth and Aunt Edith. Aunt Edith was considered to be eccentric, I believe, and she paid attention to me when I was little, a preschooler, and talked to me like I was an adult. And I appreciated that a lot. And I think that's how a lot of children want to be treated, They want people to really engage with them. And so I would ask her serious questions and she would give me serious answers. I learned a lot from her and I was encouraged to be a seeker, and to start my learning process early. Like for example, I'm from southeastern Ohio, which is Appalachia, beautiful country, mountains and hills, right along the Ohio River actually is where I was born. And so one of the things she taught me was what every tree was and every flower and every wild plant, and she taught me the ones that were edible. And she taught me survivalist skills, she said, "In case you ever get lost, you can eat this Queen Anne's Lace because it's wild carrots." And things like that. So that was real, hard knowledge to have about the meanings of things in the world. And I was able to build on that.

Do you consider yourself a feminist? Why or why not?

Yes, I do. I think that I came of age in the seventies and eighties, and I think the eighties were especially sleepy time for feminism. That's sort of how I think of it. And it wasn't until I moved to San Francisco 1984 and started trying to have my career after graduate school. In college, I think it's a blissful time for young women where you are largely treated as equals and acknowledged for having a mind. And then when I studied and learned as much as I could and then got my first job and was paid at least a third less than any man, even though I worked harder and did a better job. That sort of awakened my latent feminism.

I'll tell you one thing that I'm tired of is that in the nineties, the word feminist has become a dirty word, and I don't agree with that. So that every time I hear the word 'feminist', I think of young women in their twenties that will say, "No," because 'feminism' has become a dirty word. You can even see that I'm reading Ms. Magazine this morning. I just got it yesterday, and their latest advertising campaign - that I saw on the sides of busses - even acknowledged that they're not a feminist magazine. And I was shocked and kind of hurt by that.

Seems like there's a betrayal or identity confusion going on within the feminist community and that worries me. I wasn't aware of it until I started hearing it from twenty-somethings or I guess, third-wave feminists. Because I think when you say 'feminist' you picture a woman who's probably in her fifties, who is very strident about her rights and somehow, in the nineties, that's become uncool. That's my guess. Somebody else could probably give you a much more informed answer, but that's my guess. People start picturing round-rimmed bespectacled women who are very opinionated.

What would you most like to tell the next generation about your hopes for women in the future?

My hopes for women in the future are to support each other globally. I think that we're doing pretty darn well in North America. I mean we're still not making the same amount of money, but we're closer. There are still not nearly enough women in public office, but it is starting to happen. It's thinkable. We've had a candidate for president for a time, with Elizabeth Dole, and so we're getting there in North America. And if you look around in other parts of the world, it's still troubled. I know that it's rare, but it does still happen, that widows are burned when their husband dies, in certain really remote parts northern India. There is still genital mutilation of women in Africa and other Muslim countries. Lately, I would suggest to young women that they watch BBC News, 'cause it seems like they report on the state of women around the world better than any other form of media that I've seen.

Right now, as we hurtle into the new millennium, there's mass rape happening in Africa. It's a very systematic form of warfare. Mainly it's aimed at shaming the man. It's almost like the woman is just a vehicle to shame the man of her tribe. And that's shocking to me that not only would that be happening at all, but that it would be happening more frequently. I mean it's almost a new, really virulent form of terrorism. So I think young women need to go out and support other women globally as best they can. Get active. Work in women's shelters. Be informed. Do something.

How would you advise a young woman to find her own voice and her own path?

I would say, "Listen for it. It's there." There's a lot of noise out in the world. I mean I'm not anti-media, I'm pretty pro-media, but there are so many cable channels and so many magazines and so many newspapers and so many things to do, so much going on, that if you can find a quiet place where you can hear your internal voice, I'd say it's there. I suggest journaling. I mean, not everyone's a writer, but I think everyone can keep a journal of their thoughts, and that really helps to find the voice. So it's not finding it, it's hearing it. It's already there. And then I would say, you don't have to rush down any certain path. Slow down a little bit.

How do you define success?

I think I've been fortunate. I don't always feel successful. Sometimes when I've paid the rent and all the bills, and I'm like, "Oh, I have to live on five hundred dollars for the rest of the month." So I'd think, "Well, how is that that I got two books published, and I'm still not financially solvent?" But then talking to other writers I realized that somehow writing is not the million dollar enterprise unless you're Stephen King or Danielle Steele, really. And so forget about money. I'm not very money-oriented anyway, so that's fortunate. And I would say success for me is more in being heard.

I was stunned and really moved by the impact of my first book, which was Women of the Beat Generation. I was most pleased by the fact that these are women who are real Out writers and they're underground poets, true Bohemians. Artists like Jay DeFeo were largely ignored because the men were the absolute focal point of the culture and of the media, the New York Times and everything. So the women were definitely shunted aside. And when they finally got their due, when they finally started being interviewed and being published and being heard - now I know there's a feature film in the works and a couple of documentaries - and I thought, "I'm so glad. The whole point was that the women of the Beat Generation be acknowledged for their contributions. And it happened and it was their success at long last. And that made me feel satisfied. So I'd say, "Satisfaction for a job well done." And then also, intention - knowing your intention, holding to it. Because there was some uncomfortable moments sometimes during all that, when people would try to focus too much on me, about Women of the Beat Generation, and I would say, "It's not about me, it's about them. Go call Eileen Kaufman, Call Ruth Weiss. Call Diane Di Prima. I can talk to you about them, but as any investigative reporter, talk to the source, the original source." So I had to push people to them, and that was holding my intention. And it worked, even though it was uncomfortable at times.

What made you decide to pursue a non-traditional occupation?

I think that happened in the first grade. I learned to read in like two weeks. It was some kind of amazing thing. I'm just a book person from day one. And my first grade teacher was sort of amazed by that, and thought that we had a tutor at home that was teaching me to read, but it was just an instant thing. So then I actually sort of went from Jack and Jill, I remember reading the Iliad in the second grade. Yeah, it's true, the Iliad and the Odyssey, and it was just a logical progression. Anyway, my first grade teacher on graduation day, from the first grade, said, "You're going to be a writer, and I look forward to reading your first book." And so I think she was a very perceptive woman. And I think she saw my destiny, even then. And I had forgotten about that until two years ago. And I said, "Boy, she called that." She passed away. But I honor her every chance I get. The importance of teachers - such opportunity to touch somebody's life. It's a big responsibility.

How has gender affected your life choices and career choices?

Sometimes I'm keenly aware of the fact that if I were a man I would be further along, because in addition to being a writer, as you said, I can't make my living purely on writing, so I work in publishing. And I am very good at what I do, and if I were a man I would be probably a vice president by now. And I'm aware of it, but I sort of try to hold that thought at bay, because it's just so old and tired and it affects every woman, so I just can't let it get me down.

What woman living or dead would you most like to sit down with and have dinner and why?

Gertrude Stein. Well, for one thing, It would probably be a whole salon, so I would get either half a dozen other women from the Left Bank of Paris. But she was amazing. I mean her writing is still shockingly avant-garde, even on the eve of the year two thousand. Her writing is so new and she was so courageous. She just lived her life. She was openly lesbian. She recognized great artists and supported them and helped make their careers - more than just Picasso. I mean, even Paul Bowles, who sort of was an ex-patriot beat writer, I guess, or modernist is how he'd prefer to be thought of. But she even supported him. It seems like everybody who made a difference in the forties and fifties, in terms of culture, passed through her parlor. And I would just love to sit down and talk to her. I know a lot about her writing, but I wonder what a conversation with her was like. And then you picture Alice B. Toklas sort of hovering in the background, but very much there. And I would love to know what it was like for her to be a woman, because I have a feeling that she was just a person, you know, and that she didn't even think that much about being a woman. She just was. And somehow, with that attitude -- or my idea of that attitude she had, I think she was probably pretty male in how she went about in the world in certain ways, exacting her will. I mean, they even drove ambulances in World War II. I think Radclyffe Hall did it too, I believe. I think she's definitely the one I would want to talk to now. I'm currently fascinated with the concept of 'salons', or these groups of people. It seems like if you look at any great movement in art or literature throughout time, there was a locus, a certain group of people that were there, from the Beats, to the Left Bank of Paris, to Mabel Dodge's salon, where Elizabeth Cady Stanton and Susan B.Anthony and many others came. They called themselves the 'Heterodoxy.' Did you know that? Yeah, that's what they called their salon. And so if you look at every great movement or even certain specific tidal turnings of events, there was a group of people that was very involved in it, that seems to have, you know, melded those ideas. It's fascinating to me, so I'm trying to dig those groups out of history.


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